Did Babcock have it right to begin with?

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Unfortunately, Lou doesn't understand anything else, and he stopped at the net, and didn't improve the defense or any part of the rest of the team at all.

The only goaltending issue we had last year was the goaltender Lou acquired.
Uhhh.... Sparks says hi. We had to kick a goalie out of the locker room weeks before the playoffs. literally missed the playoffs the following season because Dubas decided to ditch a sure thing and roll the dice on a dbag hot head with an attitude problem. Then took half a season to remedy his colossal mistake.
 
You said lou created goalie problems. That's clearly not the case.
That's actually not what I said. I said "The only goaltending issue we had last year was the goaltender Lou acquired." which is clearly true. Andersen was not good last year. Sparks hasn't been here for years - he has no relevance.
 
That's actually not what I said. I said "The only goaltending issue we had last year was the goaltender Lou acquired." which is clearly true. Andersen was not good last year. Sparks hasn't been here for years - he has no relevance.
That's fair. So he should've stuck with Reim time? I'm not a Freddy fan either. Campbell is nothing special.
 
Babcock was fired because he lost the room. It was untenable. Became clear soon after *why* he lost the room, he was a prick. Now whether you like it or not, it's an abrasiveness that rarely flies anymore, especially after 4+ years of it. The Spezza thing was a middle finger to management on opening night, and given how beloved Spezza became, and quickly, I can imagine the room was pretty pissed about it too.

Dubas is the GM, and getting his teeth kicked in on the Marner negotiation has hurt the ability to improve the depth, but ultimately, even if he HAD gotten a better deal Marner and Matthews need to produce. The loss to Montreal is on them. Now, look, Dubas is the GM, he wears the on-ice results, that's the ball game. And one more quick exit he's likely out, and fair enough, but better depth, more grit, and the reincarnation of Toe Blake aren't helping you if your two best players score one goal between them in seven games.
 
That's fair. So he should've stuck with Reim time?
I mean, getting Andersen wasn't even necessarily wrong, even if it was risky for the cost at our stage of development at the time. He gave us a couple great years; but that doesn't change that he sucked last year, which is really all I was addressing. Reimer was underrated and mistreated here though.
 
The red wings lost the magic i remember from years past.. The team just couldnt find itself until babcock took over. He had one of the best seasons you could have as a coach that year he won the cup with wings. A top top coach
 
Babcock was most correct about one issue that still plagues the Leafs today, the need for "heavy" hockey players.

They are needed once the playoffs start, when space is tight and you need to get to the net, create havok, be hard on the puck, in the corners etc.

East/West creativity is nice, but unfortunately it doesn't translate well in the playoffs.
 
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And they do it repeatedly on top of it all. It still pisses me off that they could have had Justin Williams the same year we signed Patty Cakes but Babs had a hard on for Marleau...
At least back then they were kids who could use a vet, last year I’m like take off the training wheels if these guys still need guidance with JT, Brodie, Bogo, Muzz, something is wrong. Jumbo was awful too.
 
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At least back then they were kids who could use a vet, last year I’m like take off the training wheels if these guys still need guidance with JT, Brodie, Bogo, Muzz, something is wrong. Jumbo was awful too.
Jumbo always being in the lineup with some of the usage he was getting became a huge issue for me. Because now team building basics like accountability have been thrown out the window.

Not sure how Galchenyuk or Engvall felt being scratched for Jumbo at the start of the playoffs
 
It’s so funny here sometimes, HOF GM and future HOF Coach and they are shown so little respect, yet people who’ve done absolutely jack freaking squat in this league are revered as genius. It’s the weirdest thing going.
Thank You.
Feels like the twilight zone here sometimes.
Nice to know other people see the same thing.
 
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The same posters here that wanted a HOF GM in Lou Lamoriello replaced by Kyle Dubas, because supposedly, Lou was too old and out of touch, are the same group who wanted Babcock fired and replaced by Keefe.

So let’s see, what has Lou done since he left?

Oh just completely turned around the perennial basement dwelling New York Islanders, gotten them into the second round of the playoffs in his first year and then taken them into the conference finals the next two years and in the process won the GM of the year in back to back seasons.

So with all due respect, hopefully you’ll forgive me and many others here, who get just a little bit frustrated having to listen now to all the creatively lame excuses about why Dubas has failed to make any progress in moving the Leafs forward, especially when they appeared to be well on their way to finally doing something significant with the GM you wanted replaced.

The bottom line here is you got the GM you pushed for, you got the coach your GM supposedly needed and the results have been very underwhelming.

So perhaps remedy your misjudgment by; stopping the non-stop excuses, suggesting more time is needed and just own the results of your misjudgment.

I’m sorry, but Dubas just isn’t the great GM you thought he would be and he’ll most likely be replaced after this year, by someone with more experience after we have wasted 4 years figuring out what many of us already knew, which was, Dubas wasn’t ready to be the GM of the Toronto Maple Leafs.
Wish I said that.
Perfect.
Well said.
 
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What kind of rosy retrospection is this? Babs didn't win a playoff series here either and had far worse regular seasons.
He actually had about equal regular seasons

2017 vs 2020 is basically a wash we were a wildcard level team both years (mid 90s point team)

2018 vs 2019 is pretty close with the team being 105 vs 100. Not much of a change

2021 was in a division which Babcocks teams never played in in which the leafs overperformed due to quality of competition. They won't be putting up the 115 or whatever pace they had this year in the Atlantic next season
 
I never said he wasn't a good coach.

Also, Babcock is the thread topic.
What I meant was we ( Leafs Ownership ) need to address the current situation , which seems to be getting worse as we go along.
Babcock is irrelevant now.
Seems to be a distractive talking point to attempt to disguise or ignore how poorly the current mgt group have performed ( or not ).
Not suggesting you do it but there are a bunch of look over here types on here.
I think it disrupts interesting debate sometimes.
Just my opinion.
 

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