Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - 2023 offseason part II

[Blackjack]

IDK, we have a lot of wingers, I would not be shocked at all if Holtz doesn’t make the team.

 

[Nocashstyle]

I don’t think Holtz is a shoo-in by any means

 

[Bleedred]

I do disagree on Allen. The 2016-2017 playoffs he took single handly down the Wild, which actually had ridiculously good group and horrible leaking Dubnyk in their goal.

For this price I think Allen could the decent price low risk high reward option. There are not many this kind of goalies available: either they are regular season goalies or the price is insane, especially considering the risks with a goalie.

Habs might be able to retain part of the 3,8M salary and the Devils would have a solid veteran to support Akira & Vitek. Allen must have motivation, especially after the 2020-21 finals run, where he got to play exactly 0 games. Price was good then, he won games, but he didn't carry a whole serie like Allen has managed to do in the past.

One playoff series 6 years ago? I remember him also single handedly taking his own team down against the Wild in the 2015 playoffs. So calling Allen a playoff goalie (that was your implication) because of that is really weird.

I also remember him being a huge part in why the Blues were in such a hole in 2018-2019 and why Binnington even had to become a thing there. This was the first year of my goals reviews and I remember ranting about him a whole lot before Binnington came up.

Allen is also getting up there in age, so regardless of how well he played in 2017, he’s about to be 7 years older this season.

And even then, there’s just as many, if not more examples of Allen having his troubles in when he was in his prime than examples of doing things of value.

Martin Jones was really good in the 2017 playoffs too and kept the Sharks from being swept by Edmonton. You can literally find examples of more goalies than not (who play long enough) having a playoff series like Allen did in 2017.

If Allen was on waivers I’d probably take him. If he were 50% retained I may take him.

Allen is a $1.5 million goalie (maybe $2 at most) making close to $4 million.

As far as the “Price hasn’t managed to carry a whole series like Allen has” part, there’s a lot of people who would take issue with that. Especially in regards to those 2021 playoffs. And that’s a weird statement to make, considering one was a pretty good goalie in his career (who will probably make the HHOF) while Jake Allen probably won’t be remembered by many in about 5 years from now.

 

[Poppy Whoa Sonnet]

I don’t think Holtz is a shoo-in by any means

I think he'd have to have a disastrous camp to not make the team. Game 1 I could see him being a healthy scratch if he has a merely bad camp though.

 

[NJ DevLolz]

Give Holtz October (~10-15 games) and staple him to the top 9 with 13-15 minutes per game. I don’t believe he thinks the game nearly well enough to succeed but he hasn’t gotten a fair shake.

Time to see what we have

 

[DevilsHughes86]

Give Holtz October (~10-15 games) and staple him to the top 9 with 13-15 minutes per game. I don’t believe he thinks the game nearly well enough to succeed but he hasn’t gotten a fair shake.

Time to see what we have

100%, but is LR going to be that patient with him?

 

[NJ DevLolz]

100%, but is LR going to be that patient with him?

I don’t see why he wouldn’t be. As others have mentioned, the roster is good enough to compensate for Holtz if he’s struggling. They have to see what they have or else they’re lighting a recent top ten pick on fire.

 

[Hockey Sports Fan]

100%, but is LR going to be that patient with him?

If he is, I’ll eat Stan Fischler’s hat.

 

[NJDevs26]

I don’t see why he wouldn’t be. As others have mentioned, the roster is good enough to compensate for Holtz if he’s struggling. They have to see what they have or else they’re lighting a recent top ten pick on fire.

It was last year too. If he's not producing we'll just run out more Nosek, Haula and the other depth guys.

 

[NJ DevLolz]

It was last year too. If he's not producing we'll just run out more Nosek, Haula and the other depth guys.

I could also see them giving Clarke a shot in that spot if it doesn’t work out with Holtz. Think his game is a lot better suited there than players like Nosek, Bastian, etc. in the top 9.

Seems like an obvious upgrade at the deadline if Holtz doesn’t work out.

 

[Eggtimer]

I wonder what Jack is workingon this off-season . His wrist shot was wayyyy better last year . If he can improve his one-timer and or getting his shot off even quicker … he is going to score a shit ton of goals.
Even him adding more strength as he grows into his man body probably equals even more production . Which is a scary thought.

 

[Hischier and Hughes]

i think if Holtz can get his shot off quick enough he can stick on a top or second line

id love it if every player was well-rounded but..

i can recognize thats not the case!

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

I wonder what Jack is workingon this off-season . His wrist shot was wayyyy last year . If he can improve his one-timer and or getting his shot off even quicker … he is going to score a shit ton of goals.
Even him adding more strength as he grows into his man body probably equals even more production . Which is a scary thought.

Motivational speaking

 

[Ripshot 43]

Motivational speaking

Psssh, Kids these days

 

[My3Sons]

Psssh, Kids these days

It's funny seeing him with a bunch of kids his own age. He's got a grown up job to go with his grown up contract but he's still a kid.

 

[Aurinko]

One playoff series 6 years ago? I remember him also single handedly taking his own team down against the Wild in the 2015 playoffs. So calling Allen a playoff goalie (that was your implication) because of that is really weird.

I also remember him being a huge part in why the Blues were in such a hole in 2018-2019 and why Binnington even had to become a thing there. This was the first year of my goals reviews and I remember ranting about him a whole lot before Binnington came up.

Allen is also getting up there in age, so regardless of how well he played in 2017, he’s about to be 7 years older this season.

And even then, there’s just as many, if not more examples of Allen having his troubles in when he was in his prime than examples of doing things of value.

Martin Jones was really good in the 2017 playoffs too and kept the Sharks from being swept by Edmonton. You can literally find examples of more goalies than not (who play long enough) having a playoff series like Allen did in 2017.

If Allen was on waivers I’d probably take him. If he were 50% retained I may take him.

Allen is a $1.5 million goalie (maybe $2 at most) making close to $4 million.

As far as the “Price hasn’t managed to carry a whole series like Allen has” part, there’s a lot of people who would take issue with that. Especially in regards to those 2021 playoffs. And that’s a weird statement to make, considering one was a pretty good goalie in his career (who will probably make the HHOF) while Jake Allen probably won’t be remembered by many in about 5 years from now.

He is experienced in playoffs with good playoff stats. Most goalies just lose the touch when the real games begin. Career playoffs: 92,4% & 2,06 GAA are fantastic stats:

I'm not saying Martin or Price are worse overall goalies. While both could also hold their level in the playoffs neither one of them is available.

Allen is 33 yo. , which is optimal age for what the Devils are looking. The fact that he played his best playoff hockey already 6 years ago just adds to the value in my view. 33 is old enough to understand things, but still young enough to not be a complete wreck.

 

[Emperoreddy]

 

[Bleedred]

He is experienced in playoffs with good playoff stats. Most goalies just lose the touch when the real games begin. Career playoffs: 92,4% & 2,06 GAA are fantastic stats:

View attachment 736023


I'm not saying Martin or Price are worse overall goalies. While both could also hold their level in the playoffs neither one of them is available.

Allen is 33 yo. , which is optimal age for what the Devils are looking. The fact that he played his best playoff hockey already 6 years ago just adds to the value in my view. 33 is old enough to understand things, but still young enough to not be a complete wreck.

So you're interested in acquiring him because he's good in the playoffs? He's better than Vitek in the playoffs (who the f*** isn't?) but if he's starting over Schmid in the playoffs then that just means Schmid is really having a hard time/potentially poor season.

It will be 4 years since Allen had a playoff start. It's hard to believe he's played 29 playoff games (though only 23 starts) since it was Binnington in the 2019 run and Elliott played most of their 2016 conference finals run. Allen got a couple of starts against the Sharks and was brutal in game 5 of that series, which made them go back to Elliott for game 6.

Allen isn't the worst goalie in the league or anything, but he's an average, break even goalie at best. His last two years haven't been that bad in GSAx on moneypuck or evolving hockey (just barely below breaking even), but he's also really nothing to get excited over either. In reality, he's probably an upgrade right now over both Pittsburgh and Washington's backups. Both teams are using AHL caliber goalies as their backups right now because they're capped out. Lindgren is a 30 year old career minor leaguer and Nedeljkovic is a one hit wonder and for the AHL.

I would say that Martin Jones is a worse overall goalie than him, but he also had that 2016 playoff run, which means shit today because he's been one of the league's absolute worst goalies since the 18-19 season. He's down there with Blackwood and Mrazek for league's worst goaliies, though I don't think any of them are worse than the decrepit Qremains 2023 version of Jonathan Quick, who should have stopped embarrassing himself after last year and just retired.

 

[Guadana]

Really like youtuber. He isnt the man who knows everything, but he knows a lot about other team and pretty accurate with his words and estimation. He is calm, balanced, he has good calculated intonations, he builds a good narrative of thought. He does not shout loudly, is not caustic, does not try to be inspired. A nice person, at least as a narrator from YouTube. Is there much you can learn from him about your team? No. But some devilish media heads know less. Its good to listen him about other teams and narratives, he is good in translating and disputing with fanbases.
Even with Blackwell mistake. He named him Blackwood 100 times before.

 

[Aurinko]

So you're interested in acquiring him because he's good in the playoffs? He's better than Vitek in the playoffs (who the f*** isn't?) but if he's starting over Schmid in the playoffs then that just means Schmid is really having a hard time/potentially poor season.

It will be 4 years since Allen had a playoff start. It's hard to believe he's played 29 playoff games (though only 23 starts) since it was Binnington in the 2019 run and Elliott played most of their 2016 conference finals run. Allen got a couple of starts against the Sharks and was brutal in game 5 of that series, which made them go back to Elliott for game 6.

Allen isn't the worst goalie in the league or anything, but he's an average, break even goalie at best. His last two years haven't been that bad in GSAx on moneypuck or evolving hockey (just barely below breaking even), but he's also really nothing to get excited over either. In reality, he's probably an upgrade right now over both Pittsburgh and Washington's backups. Both teams are using AHL caliber goalies as their backups right now because they're capped out. Lindgren is a 30 year old career minor leaguer and Nedeljkovic is a one hit wonder and for the AHL.

I would say that Martin Jones is a worse overall goalie than him, but he also had that 2016 playoff run, which means shit today because he's been one of the league's absolute worst goalies since the 18-19 season. He's down there with Blackwood and Mrazek for league's worst goaliies, though I don't think any of them are worse than the decrepit Qremains 2023 version of Jonathan Quick, who should have stopped embarrassing himself after last year and just retired.

Maybe in the regular season, but who else has 92,4% & 2.0 GAA in the playoffs or even a cup win?

I do give a lot of value to previous playoff success, since I see the Devils as a contender that needs the experienced goalie. He doesn't have to play to be valuable.

 

[Devs3cups]

 

[PizzaAndPucks]

Training camp and preseason are going to be fun. I'm intrigued by how Holtz , Foote & Clarke look in the games they get in.

I'm excited for Toffoli. He had a really really good season but if you look at previous years he is more of a 2nd line player (which is fine). If he can mesh with Hughes , Nico , Bratt , Meier etc than a 30 goal season again is doable. Our 2nd powerplay unit is going to to be pretty deep too. You figure the top unit is a lock for Hughes , Bratt , Hamilton , Hischier and Meier. The 2nd unit might look something like Mercer , Toffoli , Luke , Holtz/Clarke , Palat/Haula/Bastian. It wouldn't be suprising to see either guy from unit #2 to be moved to the top powerplay when injuries or inconsistency hits. Sometimes those net front guys like Bastian or Haula can force their hand to the top unit but still. Luke and Holtz on the 2nd unit is insane with their shooting ability. I'm hoping Luke really makes a big impact there , it can be a really big advantage.

 

[Mr Bojanglez]

I wonder what Jack is workingon this off-season . His wrist shot was wayyyy last year . If he can improve his one-timer and or getting his shot off even quicker … he is going to score a shit ton of goals.
Even him adding more strength as he grows into his man body probably equals even more production . Which is a scary thought.

I'd like to see his faceoffs improve. Not a must. But it would be nice to not expect an auto-loss

 

[Maine Fan]

Is that your dog? (looks at Avatar)

Yes, it was my dog, I had to put her down at 7 yrs old because she had a liver disease that could not be fixed. She was a beautiful dog, a great friend and just terrific to live with and be around. Her name was Nala.

 

[Hisch13r]

Give Holtz October (~10-15 games) and staple him to the top 9 with 13-15 minutes per game. I don’t believe he thinks the game nearly well enough to succeed but he hasn’t gotten a fair shake.

Time to see what we have

I have a hard time believing he thinks the game poorly enough to be a PPG AHLer at 19/20 but not succeed in our top 9 with his talent level. Out of the 2 guys he should be competing with too one of those guys is basically just a worse version of Holtz.