Details Surrounding Nazem Kadri Trade

[notbias]

It's a bit ironic that when Dubas finally seemed to learn his lesson and started putting a bigger emphasis on size, grit, and skilled physicality he gets canned. Brought in O'Reilly, McCabe, Acciari, Schenn, and Lafferty for the 2023 run. Added size to the system by drafting Knies, Grebenkin, and Minten, signing McMann, and trading for Timmins. But like you said it was too late.

He always did this... people just need to make him out to be something he is not to make it easier to hate him.

Kadri to me looked like a domi but better hockey player, or at least less flawed

Silky smooth hands, much better goal scorer, an actual option for PP1, and biggest thing is he stood up for the team. I think he is as hot tempered as domi is but when you have guys like McCabe and Benoit and Knies and Bert(last playoffs), you don't shoulder the burden all on yourself and in turn toe the line, and even cross it. FFS Matthews plays physical AF and even Nylander and Tavares throw some hits come playoff time. Had our team been like that back then, I believe he wouldn't get suspended.

Also for the trade, at best case barrie goes 60-80 points and now you either can't afford him or have to trade rielly, making a lateral move, and at worst it was what we got. A SOFT, slow, weak, bottom pairing calibre defencemen. We also had to pay Muzzin so where was the future planning in this move.

Kerfoot had 7 good games for the leafs, that montreal series. He was a disgrace to the 3C title and had to play with nylander and tavares to get points.

Kadri is like Domi, and both are players Dubas and his fans don't/didn't like . Dubas learned how f***ed up his ideology was with the O'Rielly, Acciari, McCabe pickups, but it was too late.

Are we pretending Barrie sucked in Colorado now?

If you are going to judge Barrie by his time here, judge Kadri only by his time here.

They both sucked.

Kadri did nothing in the playoffs here besides hurt the team.

 

[Dekes For Days]

He always did this... people just need to make him out to be something he is not to make it easier to hate him.

Yep. Literally got Muzzin (and Ozhighanov) in his first year, but people like their false narratives.

Are we pretending Barrie sucked in Colorado now?

Yeah, lots of revisionist history. He had been a 22-23 minute defenseman for like half a decade, and was coming off a great playoffs averaging 5 minutes more than any other D on the team. People kept screaming for a defenseman with a shot on the PP, and 99% of the people who can't stop talking about it half a decade later wanted Kadri purged, and loved the trade when it happened.

 

[CapspaceKiller]

When they signed JT, they had to pick Kadri or Nylander. They chose Nylander... Nylander's a lot better and will be for the next decade.

The trade sucked, Kerfoot was a 3rd liner and Barrie was the complete wrong fit. But that discussion has already been done to death.

Nice to know Kadri takes no accountability though.

 

[Stephen]

Pro sports is a ruthless business, which we all know as fans, so I don't see what happened on the surface to be that offensive.

For example, Ed Olczyk has told the story about how he was traded from Toronto to Winnipeg while his wife was in labour/giving birth. Sucks for Kadri and his family to be sure, and ultimately the trade was a disaster for the Leafs but the writing was on the wall and you'd have to think some kind of change was going to happen that summer.

The only human level problem I see is how Dubas tried hard to foster a loyalty and good guy brand. Just seemed like an unnecessary vanity project at the time.

 

[LeafGrief]

I have always defended management for the Kadri trade because I believe he was effectively fired. He wasn't going to play for the Leafs again the next season after that second suspension. People can groan about the organizational softness that led to that decision and how we needed him, but he did get suspended a third time in Colorado before he finally figured out how to play playoff hockey on the right side of the edge. This is the sort of situation where a firing is the wakeup call that the player needed to eventually figure it out, and the team just needed to move on.

Baffling that they'd lie about him still being in the plans. I understand leadership being chickenshit and hedging their bets in case they couldn't find a deal they'd like, but honesty is going to be your best policy 9/10 times, and if you're firing a player for cause, TELL THEM WHY SO THEY CAN FIX IT. Naz needed to hear the message loud and clear, so even if they didn't trade him, telling him that he was going to be shopped all summer might have had some of the positive effect.

Stuff about his pregnant wife is literally irrelevant. He's a millionaire on a multimillion dollar contract. It's nice to know where you'll be living for the next few years, but if you've got that kind of scratch your wife can give birth in the back of the Learjet and things will turn out okay. That management expected Kadri to cover for their p***yfooting is... ugh.

So I mean, on the one hand this isn't some huge indictment of Leafs management, but on the other, it kind of is in that it shows they're just a bunch of wusses who expect players to do the hard parts of their job for them.

 

[HockeyVirus]

Breaking news, professional athlete has to deal with instability as part of multi millionaire lifestyle.

 

[Aashir]

Are we pretending Barrie sucked in Colorado now?

If you are going to judge Barrie by his time here, judge Kadri only by his time here.

They both sucked.

Kadri did nothing in the playoffs here besides hurt the team.

I’m not surprised you think kadri sucked.

Barrie didn’t suck in Colorado, I never said that. What I’m getting at is that it was an unnecessary and short sighted move with one of our best trade chips, it’s almost exactly the same as the stupid as hell Karlsson move.

This wasn’t needed, we had Rielly and we didn’t need another powerplay qb who had no semblance of physicality or a defensive game. Rielly was coming off a 20G 72P season and was solid in the playoffs. Muzzin was more than enough for PP2.

If Barrie worked here, we couldn’t afford him. If Barrie didn’t work here, it was a waste of an incredible asset

Love the no mention on kerfoot, you must agree how awful he was then.

Kadri still produced at roughly a .5ppg playing with the likes of Connor brown and Leo komorav. Had we tried him on the wing or with better wingers he could’ve had even more success. Not surprising he went on to be great for Colorado in the playoffs. Over a point per game in 3 years and 30+ games for the team with a cup.

 

[francis246]

I have always defended management for the Kadri trade because I believe he was effectively fired. He wasn't going to play for the Leafs again the next season after that second suspension. People can groan about the organizational softness that led to that decision and how we needed him, but he did get suspended a third time in Colorado before he finally figured out how to play playoff hockey on the right side of the edge. This is the sort of situation where a firing is the wakeup call that the player needed to eventually figure it out, and the team just needed to move on.

Baffling that they'd lie about him still being in the plans. I understand leadership being chickenshit and hedging their bets in case they couldn't find a deal they'd like, but honesty is going to be your best policy 9/10 times, and if you're firing a player for cause, TELL THEM WHY SO THEY CAN FIX IT. Naz needed to hear the message loud and clear, so even if they didn't trade him, telling him that he was going to be shopped all summer might have had some of the positive effect.

Stuff about his pregnant wife is literally irrelevant. He's a millionaire on a multimillion dollar contract. It's nice to know where you'll be living for the next few years, but if you've got that kind of scratch your wife can give birth in the back of the Learjet and things will turn out okay. That management expected Kadri to cover for their p***yfooting is... ugh.

So I mean, on the one hand this isn't some huge indictment of Leafs management, but on the other, it kind of is in that it shows they're just a bunch of wusses who expect players to do the hard parts of their job for them.

Do you not think they had multiple conversations with Kadri? That’s why I’m not sure why everyone is acting surprised. This was like Kadri’s 8th incident within the organization. If you count everything from when he was drafted to that point. How many press conferences did we see Shanny come out and say we’ve talked to Naz about his maturity and ect. The writing was the on the wall.

I wish they would have kept him, but Naz had to have known his days were numbered. He got so many chances to redeem himself within the organization. At some point people who run the show are gonna get tired of your antics affecting the team.

 

[Stephen]

I have always defended management for the Kadri trade because I believe he was effectively fired. He wasn't going to play for the Leafs again the next season after that second suspension. People can groan about the organizational softness that led to that decision and how we needed him, but he did get suspended a third time in Colorado before he finally figured out how to play playoff hockey on the right side of the edge. This is the sort of situation where a firing is the wakeup call that the player needed to eventually figure it out, and the team just needed to move on.

Baffling that they'd lie about him still being in the plans. I understand leadership being chickenshit and hedging their bets in case they couldn't find a deal they'd like, but honesty is going to be your best policy 9/10 times, and if you're firing a player for cause, TELL THEM WHY SO THEY CAN FIX IT. Naz needed to hear the message loud and clear, so even if they didn't trade him, telling him that he was going to be shopped all summer might have had some of the positive effect.

Stuff about his pregnant wife is literally irrelevant. He's a millionaire on a multimillion dollar contract. It's nice to know where you'll be living for the next few years, but if you've got that kind of scratch your wife can give birth in the back of the Learjet and things will turn out okay. That management expected Kadri to cover for their p***yfooting is... ugh.

So I mean, on the one hand this isn't some huge indictment of Leafs management, but on the other, it kind of is in that it shows they're just a bunch of wusses who expect players to do the hard parts of their job for them.

The only part that seems remarkable about the way Kadri was treated is how that management group preached this player friendly, loyalty and other virtuous miscellany when no one asked for it. Just be respectful, cool, calculating and cutthroat, do a good job and cut out the need to show how nice you are.

 

[francis246]

Pro sports is a ruthless business, which we all know as fans, so I don't see what happened on the surface to be that offensive.

For example, Ed Olczyk has told the story about how he was traded from Toronto to Winnipeg while his wife was in labour/giving birth. Sucks for Kadri and his family to be sure, and ultimately the trade was a disaster for the Leafs but the writing was on the wall and you'd have to think some kind of change was going to happen that summer.

The only human level problem I see is how Dubas tried hard to foster a loyalty and good guy brand. Just seemed like an unnecessary vanity project at the time.

I’m curious for the day Kyle speaks out fully on what deals he felt controlled by or were nixed via Shanahan. Just based on Kadri’s accounts and even the rumours after the series. It feels like Kadri moving was a decision made above Kyle Dubas. I believe that call was made by Shanahan. The timing of the deal felt rushed and everything too. Still a bad deal by Dubas in hindsight but I’d be curious to see who ultimately decided the Leafs need to move on from Kadri.

 

[Stephen]

I’m not surprised you think kadri sucked.

Barrie didn’t suck in Colorado, I never said that. What I’m getting at is that it was an unnecessary and short sighted move with one of our best trade chips, it’s almost exactly the same as the stupid as hell Karlsson move.

This wasn’t needed, we had Rielly and we didn’t need another powerplay qb who had no semblance of physicality or a defensive game. Rielly was coming off a 20G 72P season and was solid in the playoffs. Muzzin was more than enough for PP2.

If Barrie worked here, we couldn’t afford him. If Barrie didn’t work here, it was a waste of an incredible asset

Love the no mention on kerfoot, you must agree how awful he was then.

Kadri still produced at roughly a .5ppg playing with the likes of Connor brown and Leo komorav. Had we tried him on the wing or with better wingers he could’ve had even more success. Not surprising he went on to be great for Colorado in the playoffs. Over a point per game in 3 years and 30+ games for the team with a cup.

Tyson Barrie was more or less a RHD Jake Gardiner with some slightly flashier offensive slider settings and a more consistent shot arsenal in a time when we didn't need that, coming off the loss to Boston. Compared to the TJ Brodie direction they were looking at originally to stabilize the defense and provide two way play, it wasn't the most intelligent or insightful hockey addition, but more like another random flashy name added to the pile, with a too cute and too short contract retention for too short of a runway.

 

[LeafGrief]

Do you not think they had multiple conversations with Kadri? That’s why I’m not sure why everyone is acting surprised. This was like Kadri’s 8th incident within the organization. If you count everything from when he was drafted to that point. How many press conferences did we see Shanny come out and say we’ve talked to Naz about his maturity and ect. The writing was the on the wall.

I wish they would have kept him, but Naz had to have known his days were numbered. He got so many chances to redeem himself within the organization. At some point people who run the show are gonna get tired of your antics affecting the team.

I very much suspect that they did have many of those conversations, which is why a) I believe firing him was legitimate, and b) I'm so surprised that they lied to him when they said he was still in the plans. Just be honest and tell the guy they're going to do everything in their power to trade him that summer. There's a chance you get bitten in the ass if you can't find a good deal when you say something like that, but have the guts to accept that risk and be willing to attempt to rebuild the bridge in good faith if it comes to that.

As @Stephen says, they lied to make themselves look good. Firing Kadri was the cutthroat move, and I can respect that, regardless of whether or not the resulting trade was a success. Lying to try and look virtuous is antics from management, and is not respectable.

 

[francis246]

I very much suspect that they did have many of those conversations, which is why a) I believe firing him was legitimate, and b) I'm so surprised that they lied to him when they said he was still in the plans. Just be honest and tell the guy they're going to do everything in their power to trade him that summer. There's a chance you get bitten in the ass if you can't find a good deal when you say something like that, but have the guts to accept that risk and be willing to attempt to rebuild the bridge in good faith if it comes to that.

As @Stephen says, they lied to make themselves look good. Firing Kadri was the cutthroat move, and I can respect that, regardless of whether or not the resulting trade was a success. Lying to try and look virtuous is antics from management, and is not respectable.

Cant disagree, probably could have worked with him to choose a destination not on his list and get a better deal. I’m not sure why they were so hell bent on trading him immediately. We even ended up taking on more cap trading him.

 

[hotpaws]

I’m curious for the day Kyle speaks out fully on what deals he felt controlled by or were nixed via Shanahan. Just based on Kadri’s accounts and even the rumours after the series. It feels like Kadri moving was a decision made above Kyle Dubas. I believe that call was made by Shanahan. The timing of the deal felt rushed and everything too. Still a bad deal by Dubas in hindsight but I’d be curious to see who ultimately decided the Leafs need to move on from Kadri.

i'm wondering who his fan club can blame for all his bad moves with the Pens ?

 

[DarkKnight]

"I definitely don't have it in me to go anywhere else," Dubas said. "It'll either be here or it'll be taking time to recalibrate, reflect on the seasons here. You won't see me next week pop up elsewhere. I can't put (my family) through that after this year."

 

[sxvnert]

Writing a memoir while still playing hockey is peak Kadri ego.

 

[ACC1224]

"I definitely don't have it in me to go anywhere else," Dubas said. "It'll either be here or it'll be taking time to recalibrate, reflect on the seasons here. You won't see me next week pop up elsewhere. I can't put (my family) through that after this year."

 

[All Mod Cons]

"I definitely don't have it in me to go anywhere else," Dubas said. "It'll either be here or it'll be taking time to recalibrate, reflect on the seasons here. You won't see me next week pop up elsewhere. I can't put (my family) through that after this year."

He seems like an incredibly slimy individual.

 

[The Shrike]

If Kadri is being truthful about this, my assessment of Dubas improves. My biggest beef with Kyle is he coddles the players too much. Managements job isn't to be buddies with the players, it's to improve the team at any cost. He's not George McPhee though, otherwise he would have accomplished more here.

 

[ULF_55]

Kadri greatly benefited from being traded.
Won a Cup.
Won a retirement contract.

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AI Overview
Nazem Kadri, a center for the Colorado Avalanche, has been suspended multiple times, including:

• May 2021: Eight-game suspension for delivering a high, forceful check to the head of St. Louis Blues defenseman Justin Faulk in Game 2 of the first round of the playoffs. The NHL called Kadri "a player with a substantial disciplinary record" and considered his prior history when determining the length of the suspension.
  
  
  
• April 2019: Five-game suspension for cross-checking Bruins forward Jake DeBrusk in the head.
  
  
  
• April 2018: Three-game suspension for boarding Bruins forward Tommy Wingels in back-to-back first-round series games.
  
  
  
• April 2016: Four-game suspension for cross-checking Red Wings center Luke Glendening in the head.
  
  
  
• March 2015: Four-game suspension for an illegal check to the head.
  
  
  
• November 2013: Three-game suspension for interference.

 

[Skullz]

I think a lot of you are reacting with hindsight. The trade was brutal, but there is not a member on this board that did not want Kadri traded after his second playoff suspension, and that did not say, "good riddance" after his third suspension in Colorado.

The context seems a little shady, but I would guess its not uncommon.

 

[Tie Domi Esquire]

Barrie was okay in Colorado until his knee injury then he was straight up trash. Not that it matters, Barrie at his best (Rielly-lite) was not a fit on this team. Maybe in EA NHL on the Sony Playstation. Awful awful trade. Much worse than anything Lou did here, but for some reason it's okay to talk about Lou's bad moves and not our precious God.

 

[Strangle]

What were the timelines between points 2, 3 and 5 above? Context is everything.

It sucks that his family was uprooted, but this is a part of the reason these guys are compensated the way they are. Part of the business. It is clear they were trying to trade him, certainly after the failed CGY trade attempt.

It’s clear most people reading this haven’t managed their way through a family bbq, let alone an organization

 

[seanlinden]

You tell him he’s part of the plan and then when the time comes you inform him about the possibility of trading him to a team on his no move list so he’s not hearing about from players on the other team.

That might not have been on Dubas to be fair. If I recall, TJ Brodie was part of that deal, and also declined to waive his NTC to go to Toronto.

Situation could have been that Dubas & Treliving agree to the deal, but because both players had NTCs that blocked the trade, they had to approach both players. Word gets out to the players, and they take it upon themselves to reach out to Kadri to try and welcome him.

 

[Strangle]

I don't see what's so bad. He was lucky he was told anything.

The way the meeting is framed is super misleading, as well.

Look, I love Naz, but saying “I was called into a meeting after the season and told I was in their plans for the future….”

Is a lot different than “during end of season one on ones it sounded like I was still in the teams plans”

I don’t really see anything bad. I’m not the biggest Dubas fan but he was cut throat and made a decision. People want us to be like Vegas and this is the kind of stuff you do.

What’s Dubas supposed to do?

“f*** I told Naz he was still in our plans, now I can’t trade him”

That’s ridiculous. A player is part of their plans until the day they are traded