D David Reinbacher - EHC Kloten, NL (2023, 5th, MTL)

[the paisanos guy]

So of course you have no bias … lol give me a break and get off your high horse .

you wanna talk about bias, why are 90% of the past few pages of your posts on these forums about Habs prospects?

 

[Hinterland]

Meaningless sample size( 11 games lol ) , games of no consequence . What I was referring to was his underwhelming play in the NL ( 35 game sample ) ; but of course you knew this, hence your silly reply, that has no mention of his quality of play there . Extremely telling

You didn't even watch any NL games. Why would you willingly continue to make a fool of yourself?

 

[TheKrebsCycle]

Why would I be biased and what sort of bias should I have? You're not making any sense here. You're just upset because I exposed you?

My bad . I thought you’d said you were from the same home county or at least intimated it , but that’s not the case . I stand by what I’ve said prior . I don’t think it’s a controversial opinion that the first year didn’t go to plan . But I’ve said in several posts that progress isn’t linear or maybe he’ll be bettter in a different environment. I haven’t painted a doom and gloom scenario imo . Will play NHL games. Should be decent just not much sizzle for a lottery pick .

You didn't even watch any NL games. Why would you willingly continue to make a fool of yourself?

Because I didn’t watch complete games and rather truncated versions means the games didn’t happen ? That the poor results don’t matter ? How was his performance in the NL games oh wise one ?

 

[The Last Red]

Where did I call him a bust . I said he had a poor d plus 1 year .

I wasn’t referring to you specifically. But I wouldn’t say he had a poor year either. His Swiss team went through 3 head coaches so impossible to judge him there. He played well in Laval. I don’t care if it was only 11 games.

 

[TheKrebsCycle]

I wasn’t referring to you specifically. But I wouldn’t say he had a poor year either. His Swiss team went through 3 head coaches so impossible to judge him there. He played well in Laval. I don’t care if it was only 11 games.

I do . I think it matters . And it was such a larger sample of games to glean from in the NL.

 

[The Last Red]

I do . I think it matters . And it was such a larger sample of games to glean from in the NL.

I don’t. Once he got away from the instability there he was fine in Laval, small sample size or not.

 

[Baksfamous112]

We, as fans, see those numbers as important but Yzerman knew early what he had in Drouin (not a guy he could win with) so he made the trade for Sergachev. I’m not saying the Habs could get anyone nearly so good as Sergachev for Reinbacher but imo they should move the pkayer now while he has value. And maybe they get a Sergachev type return.

Yeah I bet this had nothing to do with Drouin asking out and refusing to report to the AHL and everything to do with Yzerman seeing the future.

Good point again, Fatass

 

[Hinterland]

My bad . I thought you’d said you were from the same home county or at least intimated it , but that’s not the case . I stand by what I’ve said prior . I don’t think it’s a controversial opinion that the first year didn’t go to plan . But I’ve said in several posts that progress isn’t linear or maybe he’ll be bettter in a different environment. I haven’t painted a doom and gloom scenario imo . Will play NHL games. Should be decent just not much sizzle for a lottery pick .

It didn't go to plan because he got injured at Habs training camp and picked up even more injuries later in the season. It also didn't go to plan because EHC Kloten was much worse in season 2 compared to season 1 after the promotion. Jeff Tomlinson was forced to step down as head coach. For health reasons he's now in a smaller advisory role. That's what caused Kloten to become a total mess. Three different head coaches (all of them poor ones) caused the team to be outcoached and outplayed pretty much on a nightly basis. Because of Putin's war and the added import slots, the NL has become one of the top leagues in Europe if not THE top league. Either way it's a tough men's league where, as a defenseman, you can't make things happen on your own. Besides, Reinbacher wouldn't even have been allowed to just go full yolo mode. He'd have gotten scratched (like some other prospects in his draft year) in no time.

So looking at stats only, Eliteprospect scouts like you may think that he played poorly when in fact it wasn't even the case. Reinbacher was the highest scoring defenseman on his team and he did it despite all the injuries and despite having to carry a brutal Nathan Beaulieu for parts of the season. Also, Reinbacher's focus wasn't on offense anyway. He said in interviews ahead of the season that he's more than happy with his offensive game but knows he has to hit the gym and work on the defensive side of things. Reinbacher has added quite a bit of weight while not losing any speed and I'd say that he's played his best defensive hockey to date in the back half of the season after Beaulieu was finally sent packing.

So yeah...it's fair to say that not everything went to plan but you can't say that Reinbacher had a poor season. He had trouble getting up to speed after injuries and didn't meet expectations in terms of scoring but I'm not sure he could have done much more. Also note that he scored 5 in 11 for Laval and looked very dynamic with the puck. He never did anything like this in Kloten...most certainly because he was told not to. Different systems, different situations require a different approach. Also, hitting the gym and adding weight can be tough on prospects.

His play may not always have been perfect but overall he probably achieved his own personal goals for the season. Ideally he'd have played for a better team and stayed healthy all season long but you can't change the past. Adversity can be a positive as well if handled the right way.

 

[TheKrebsCycle]

I don’t. Once he got away from the instability there he was fine in Laval, small sample size or not.

Guess well see this season

 

[sergejean]

Meaningless sample size( 11 games lol ) , games of no consequence . What I was referring to was his underwhelming play in the NL ( 35 game sample ) ; but of course you knew this, hence your silly reply, that has no mention of his quality of play there . Extremely telling

You're entitled to your opinion but the 11 games were far from meaningless. Laval was battling firm to make the playoffs.

 

[TheKrebsCycle]

It didn't go to plan because he got injured in the Habs training camp and picked up even more injuries later in the season. It also didn't go to plan because EHC Kloten was much worse in season 2 compared to season 1 after the promotion. Jeff Tomlinson was forced to step down as head coach. For health reasons he's now in a smaller advisory role. That's what caused Kloten to become a total mess. Three different head coaches (all of them poor ones) caused the team to be outcoached and outplayed pretty much on a nightly basis. Because of Putin's war and the added import slots, the NL has become one of the top leagues in Europe if not THE top league. Either way it's a tough men's league where, as a defenseman, you can't make things happen on your own. Besides, Reinbacher wouldn't even have been allowed to just go full yolo mode. He'd have gotten scratched (like some other prospects in his draft year) in no time.

So looking at stats only, Eliteprospect scouts like you may think that he played poorly when in fact it wasn't even the case. Reinbacher was the highest scoring defenseman on his team and he did it despite all the injuries and despite having to carry a brutal Nathan Beaulieu for parts of the season. Also, Reinbacher's focus wasn't on offense anyway. He said in interviews ahead of the season that he's more than happy with his offensive game but knows he has to hit the gym and work on the defensive side of things. Reinbacher has added quite a bit of weight while not losing any speed and I'd say that he's played his best defensive hockey to date in the back half of the season after Beaulieu was finally sent packing.

So yeah...it's fair to say that not everything went to plan but you can't say that Reinbacher had a poor season. He had trouble getting up to speed after injuries and didn't meet expectations in terms of scoring but I'm not sure he could have done much more. Also note that he scored 5 in 11 for Laval and looked very dynamic with the puck. He never did anything like this in Kloten...most certainly because he was told not to. Different systems, different situations require a different approach. Also, hitting the gym and adding weight can be tough on prospects.

His play may not always have been perfect but overall he probably achieved his own personal goals for the season. Ideally he'd have played for a better team and stayed healthy all season long but you can't change the past. Adversity can be a positive as well if handled the right way.

Looking forward to his improved play this coming season .

 

[Walksss]

Looking forward to his improved play this coming season .

Bro you just got exposed, don't sit here and say you're looking forward to his improved play. That would be your nightmare and you'd be scouring the internet for any advanced stats that could paint him in a negative light.

I'm looking forward to that.

 

[Frank Drebin]

Stop indulging these jokers guys

 

[MoneyManny]

Leafs prospects win two from Habs. Shouldn’t the Habs have better prospects? They’re the club rebuilding. Hutson looks like a hit. But not a fan of the Reinbacher pick. IMO the Habs should trade him while he has value. Get a good return now. Don’t wait until he’s worthless.
Seen this before when clubs wait in hopes the player will figure it out. Best to admit the mistake early and get a good return.

It's not like his performances are hidden from Other teams pro scouts. They will have the same concerns as we do about him.

We have a bunch of impressive D prospects. Not all of them are ever going to hit based on probabilities and i really like what i'm seeing from Hutson and Mailloux. Reinbacher could end up disappointing, but FOR ONCE i'm not even mad because not all of our hopes rests on him.

I'm all for keeping him and giving him all the time he needs to be where he wants to be.

 

[Walksss]

Drafting a RD like Reinbacher at 5OA is identical to when your NFL team takes a Left Tackle in the top 5 which happens all the time. It's a boring move and results in lots of fanbase squabbling but it is a very important position for team stability and the ability to win consistently.

Dominant left tackles don't get fanbases excited and they don't make the highlights of the night. They win championships. Neither does a Dman like Reinbacher who is a mobile, cerebral defender who is gonna be adept at making breakout passes which will rarely be highlight reel.

You want excitement this isn't gonna be your guy and that's exactly by design.

 

[Jeune Poulet]

That’s all good. But I look at what Yzerman did early when he accepted Drouin wasn’t what was hoped at 3OA and got Sergachev and just think Hughes should consider doing the same with Reinbacher.

We, as fans, see those numbers as important but Yzerman knew early what he had in Drouin (not a guy he could win with) so he made the trade for Sergachev. I’m not saying the Habs could get anyone nearly so good as Sergachev for Reinbacher but imo they should move the pkayer now while he has value. And maybe they get a Sergachev type return.

But your example is backward.

Both Sergachev and Reinbacher are big 6'3", 200 pounds mobile defensemen.

Sergachev was drafted in 2016 and traded in 2017 before he could even be properly tested. And now you want Hughes to trade a defensemen drafted in 2023 a year later.

Drouin was drafted in 2013, threw tantrums in Tampa and Syracuse and was traded by Yzerman 4 years later, in 2017, when the GM became convinced Jojo, who was then 22 years old, was always going to be a p***y. Subsequent events unfortunately proved Yzerman right.

You're not advocating for Hughes to do a trade like Yzerman. You're advocating for Hughes to do a trade like Bergevin and give up after only 1 year on a 19 years old prospect playing a demanding position, who may just need some extra time.

To be clear, I'm not against trading prospects, even at 19, nor am I saying Reinbacher is the next Sergachev. But the younger a guy is, the more difficult it is to predict what the finished product will look like. I'm not super thrilled with Reinbacher so far and I'm sure the organization was hoping for more. But it's extremely early to throw the towel. I think the org will want to see what Reinbacher is made of this year, how much he can soak in.

I mean, everyone has a price and I'd pull the trigger for the right deal, but we're invested in this guy, there's a human side to this game too. We might as well see where this is going.

 

[TheKrebsCycle]

Bro you just got exposed, don't sit here and say you're looking forward to his improved play. That would be your nightmare and you'd be scouring the internet for any advanced stats that could paint him in a negative light.

I'm looking forward to that.

Really guy ? It’s an internet message board it’s not that serious . Exposed ? You on the case detective dog ? He had a poor first season relative to expectations . That remains true no matter what spin doctor magic is attempted to be applied . Nightmare lol ? Common give me a break.

 

[test101]

Really guy ? It’s an internet message board it’s not that serious . Exposed ? You on the case detective dog ? He had a poor first season relative to expectations . That remains true no matter what spin doctor magic is attempted to be applied . Nightmare lol ? Common give me a break.

 

[HawksDub89]

Drafting a RD like Reinbacher at 5OA is identical to when your NFL team takes a Left Tackle in the top 5 which happens all the time. It's a boring move and results in lots of fanbase squabbling but it is a very important position for team stability and the ability to win consistently.

Dominant left tackles don't get fanbases excited and they don't make the highlights of the night. They win championships. Neither does a Dman like Reinbacher who is a mobile, cerebral defender who is gonna be adept at making breakout passes which will rarely be highlight reel.

You want excitement this isn't gonna be your guy and that's exactly by design.

Is it exciting when your left tackle turns into a right guard?

Because that’s what Reinbacher feels like. If he were a top pairing RHD, sure that’s great. But he’s best case scenario a #3. I don’t think he’s ever gonna score enough to be considered more.

 

[HabzSauce]

To discuss prospects , like everyone else . What are you here for ? Police anyone with anything remotely negative ( and justifably so ) about Hab prospects ? Seems like that’s the agenda ..


Who cares about a handful of games at the end of a write off season. The much larger sample was a struggle . This isn’t even debatable .

Dude this is probably why you're getting rinsed for shouting opinions without watching him play. Which is fine btw, it's a prospect thread. People can say whatever, Who cares....

But statements like this don't help your case whatsoever. I'm not excusing reinbacher but the "much larger sample" was an absolute shit show in sense of playing on crap team, all the coaching changes, etc. Choosing to ignore that context while also ignoring his improved play in Laval is just ignorant.

And it wasn't even a write off season btw - Laval was trying to make the playoffs

 

[Frank Drebin]

Is it exciting when your left tackle turns into a right guard?

Because that’s what Reinbacher feels like. If he were a top pairing RHD, sure that’s great. But he’s best case scenario a #3. I don’t think he’s ever gonna score enough to be considered more.

Hedman scored 89 points in his first 258 games in his first 4 seasons. An average of 28 points per 82 games.

It wasn't till 2013-14, when he was 23 years old where he finally broke .5 ppg and even then he didn't start looking like an elite defenseman statistically till 16-17, when he was 26.

Hawks fans argued who was the better defenseman between Seabrook and Keith till 2008-09 when Keith started to emerge as a #1 offensively. He was 25 that season.

Ottawa chose Wade Reddin over Chara. Chara was 29 when he joined the Bruins.


Now, I'm not saying Reinbacher is going to turn into Hedman or Keith. But are you guys serious with these takes after one season in Europe where no one who is commenting actually watched him play and two rookie games?

 

[Baksfamous112]

Is it exciting when your left tackle turns into a right guard?

Because that’s what Reinbacher feels like. If he were a top pairing RHD, sure that’s great. But he’s best case scenario a #3. I don’t think he’s ever gonna score enough to be considered more.

Would you consider Pietrangelo, Slavin, prime Pesce, Hanifin, Ekholm, Theodore, Andersson, McDonagh top pairing D? Because out of the bunch, they have a combined 3 seasons of over 50+ points in their career.

You don’t need to be point-making machine to be a first pairing D. Montreal has that covered with Hutson, Mailloux and Matheson already.

 

[sansabri]

Is it exciting when your left tackle turns into a right guard?

Because that’s what Reinbacher feels like. If he were a top pairing RHD, sure that’s great. But he’s best case scenario a #3. I don’t think he’s ever gonna score enough to be considered more.

how'd you come to this conclusion

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

how'd you come to this conclusion

Best case scenario!!!

Would you consider Pietrangelo, Slavin, prime Pesce, Hanifin, Ekholm, Theodore, Andersson, McDonagh top pairing D? Because out of the bunch, they have a combined 3 seasons of over 50+ points in their career.

You don’t need to be point-making machine to be a first pairing D. Montreal has that covered with Hutson, Mailloux and Matheson already.

No he needs to be already NHL ready , put up 40 , and stop the best players in the world right now at *checks age* 19 years old in order for the pick to be good.

What if he's really good in 3-4 years? No that's too long , bust

 

[JeffreyLFC]

Is it exciting when your left tackle turns into a right guard?

Because that’s what Reinbacher feels like. If he were a top pairing RHD, sure that’s great. But he’s best case scenario a #3. I don’t think he’s ever gonna score enough to be considered more.

If the right guard is a pro bowler and help you win more games. You take it! At the end of the day the key for all sports franchise is winning games and championships. It also mean you found a way to get a better LT which is great for the team. If a Hutson is the PP QB+ pts provider, then you don't need a Reinbacher to play that role.

That being said, Reinbacher is clearly not a bust. He will never become (based on my viewing of him) a top scoring defenseman in the NHL, not a great shot and not overly creative with the puck but his fundementals, defensive awareness and physical attributes are great for a 19 years old defenseman. I think he can become a Slavin type of defenseman. Which is very valuable, no way the Habs trade him away, certainly not this current management who prioritize player development.