CXLVIII - Coyotes owner Alex Meruelo had 'productive' meeting with Phoenix mayor

[mouser]

If the history of the team is staying behind, NHL should do the right thing and transfer to pre 96 history to the current Jets.

The franchise is staying behind. The “history” is part of the franchise.

Well, unless you do goofy things like pretending the Baltimore Ravens aren’t actually the original Cleveland Browns.


Do the current Ottawa Senators hold the history of the Ottawa Silver Seven?

 

[Tawnos]

They’re saying he doesn’t need BOG approval but there has to be some kind of greenlighting process. Or gaslighting.

I wonder if there's language letting them determine the start date in the event of other expansions. It's hard to imagine "we're doing an expansion draft for our new Atlanta franchise in 28-29... but oh wait, we have to do two this year!"

 

[GKJ]

I wonder if there's language letting them determine the start date in the event of other expansions. It's hard to imagine "we're doing an expansion draft for our new Atlanta franchise in 28-29... but oh wait, we have to do two this year!"

I don’t think they’ll do more than one before knowing what happens in Arizona.

 

[TheLegend]

Winnipeg did what…. 15k+ in 30 minutes??

Great response for sure, but isn’t the thing it’s being framed as.

 

[Tawnos]

I don’t think they’ll do more than one before knowing what happens in Arizona.

As long as Fertitta is serious, I think we're going to have two expansion announcements before the 5 years is up. Remember, Houston doesn't need to build an arena. They could conceivably put a team there in 25-26 or more likely 26-27. Atlanta's new building (if it happens) is looking at 27-28 or 28-29.

I could definitely see two before the Arizona timeline is up, but it depends on Fertitta. IMO, that's a big part of why this push got done now, because how can you justify expansion when the Coyotes are playing in Mullett? To me, that's a big unspoken part of this whole story (unspoken on the part of the league, I mean).

 

[TheLegend]

A hurdle…… a very BIG hurdle imo.

 

[GKJ]

As long as Fertitta is serious, I think we're going to have two expansion announcements before the 5 years is up. Remember, Houston doesn't need to build an arena. They could conceivably put a team there in 25-26 or more likely 26-27. Atlanta's new building (if it happens) is looking at 27-28 or 28-29.

I could definitely see two before the Arizona timeline is up, but it depends on Fertitta. IMO, that's a big part of why this push got done now, because how can you justify expansion when the Coyotes are playing in Mullett? To me, that's a big unspoken part of this whole story (unspoken on the part of the league, I mean).

The league hates feeling like they have to rush into things and deal with unknowns. They're going to know what the lay of the land is, literally. I don't think they're gonna go past 34 until there's clarity. They may get that as soon as June 27. There's also a CBA negotiation.

 

[Tawnos]

The league hates feeling like they have to rush into things and deal with unknowns. They're going to know what the lay of the land is, literally. I don't think they're gonna go past 34 until there's clarity. They may get that as soon as June 27. There's also a CBA negotiation.

You mean the CBA negotiation where the players' union is going to try to get at least some part of expansion fees included in HRR? More reason to announce expansions sooner.

 

[eojsmada]

Winnipeg did what…. 15k+ in 30 minutes??

Great response for sure, but isn’t the thing it’s being framed as.

Winnipeg had several weeks of PR to drum up support and also a mandate from the NHL to get a specific amount. This is pretty organic and in a very rushed fashion. It's quite exceptional considering the circumstances.

 

[CorbeauNoir]

Their client list is very heavy on recent MLS brands, they’ve been behind every MLS expansion team in the past decade more or less

Utah HC it is.

Pretty much, yes. That's the deal. It might not even be 5 years. If the timeline we've been discussing here somehow manages to work out perfectly, then it could happen in 3 years. The target for the new arena was 27-28. That's probably too much to hope for, but 28-29 or 29-30 feel likely to me if he's successful

I work in architecture and the timelines these guys put down on ink based on some renderings makes me laugh out loud. I've had the timelines of small interior reno projects double in projected length because of hurdles from indecisive clients, slow approval turnaround from the city, supply shortages, etc etc. Enlarging all of those hurdles to a project the size of a miniature city you don't even own the land to build on and expecting nothing to go wrong? Best of luck.

 

[Brodie]

The franchise is staying behind. The “history” is part of the franchise.

Well, unless you do goofy things like pretending the Baltimore Ravens aren’t actually the original Cleveland Browns.


Do the current Ottawa Senators hold the history of the Ottawa Silver Seven?

Going to be honest, I have never really understood why fans of the Coyotes are so wedded to getting to have the Jets history as part of their franchise

I could not care less what the Detroit Pistons did in Fort Wayne, what the Detroit Lions did in Portsmouth, or what the Red Wings did as the Victoria Cougars

Winnipeg did what…. 15k+ in 30 minutes??

Great response for sure, but isn’t the thing it’s being framed as.

I don’t think this is a remotely fair comparison

 

[LT]

As long as Fertitta is serious, I think we're going to have two expansion announcements before the 5 years is up. Remember, Houston doesn't need to build an arena. They could conceivably put a team there in 25-26 or more likely 26-27. Atlanta's new building (if it happens) is looking at 27-28 or 28-29.

I could definitely see two before the Arizona timeline is up, but it depends on Fertitta. IMO, that's a big part of why this push got done now, because how can you justify expansion when the Coyotes are playing in Mullett? To me, that's a big unspoken part of this whole story (unspoken on the part of the league, I mean).

An update on Fertitta:

"While Houston Rockets owner Tilman Fertitta has been vocal about his intentions to bring an NHL franchise to Houston, he said in a statement to the Houston Business Journal that he was unable to bid for the Coyotes organization as "the NHL views Houston as expansion target, removing the ability for us to purchase and relocate an existing team.""

https://www.bizjournals.com/houston/news/2024/04/15/nhl-arizona-coyotes-sale-move-fertitta-houston.html

 

[Brodie]

I wonder if AM winning the land auction would be enough for them to open expansion negotiations with Houston

 

[GKJ]

You mean the CBA negotiation where the players' union is going to try to get at least some part of expansion fees included in HRR? More reason to announce expansions sooner.

That's not how it's gonna work.

 

[mouser]

Going to be honest, I have never really understood why fans of the coyotes are so wet to getting to have the Jets history as part of their franchise

I could not care less what the Detroit Pistons did in Fort Wayne, what the Detroit Lions did in Portsmouth, or what the Red Wings did as the Victoria Cougars



I don’t think this is a remotely fair comparison

Conversely I don’t understand why fans of any team think it’s so important to “reacquire” the history of a previous franchise.

Would anyone’s fandom be diminished because the team they love and root for now doesn’t hold the stat records of the prior franchise decades earlier?

 

[BKIslandersFan]

Winnipeg did what…. 15k+ in 30 minutes??

Great response for sure, but isn’t the thing it’s being framed as.

Literally half of that arena is unusable for hockey.

 

[TheLegend]

Going to be honest, I have never really understood why fans of the Coyotes are so wedded to getting to have the Jets history as part of their franchise

I could not care less what the Detroit Pistons did in Fort Wayne, what the Detroit Lions did in Portsmouth, or what the Red Wings did as the Victoria Cougars

We aren’t. Not once the Jets returned.

I don’t think this is a remotely fair comparison

….but a comparison nevertheless.

 

[TheLegend]

Literally half of that arena is unusable for hockey.

Just like AWA/USAC/TSRA/Footprint or Barclays. Except they held more.

 

[TheLegend]

An update on Fertitta:

"While Houston Rockets owner Tilman Fertitta has been vocal about his intentions to bring an NHL franchise to Houston, he said in a statement to the Houston Business Journal that he was unable to bid for the Coyotes organization as "the NHL views Houston as expansion target, removing the ability for us to purchase and relocate an existing team.""

https://www.bizjournals.com/houston/news/2024/04/15/nhl-arizona-coyotes-sale-move-fertitta-houston.html

Fertitta still looking for a bargain deal. That Mason-Dixon comment is still costing him.

 

[LT]

Conversely I don’t understand why fans of any team think it’s so important to “reacquire” the history of a previous franchise.

Would anyone’s fandom be diminished because the team they love and root for now doesn’t hold the stat records of the prior franchise decades earlier?

As a Dallas Stars fan, honestly it's kind of annoying to have the North Stars history attached to ours. I'd happily just give it away if it were up to me.

 

[LT]

Fertitta still looking for a bargain deal. That Mason-Dixon comment is still costing him.

Yep. He said the same kind of stuff in 2017/2018, when teams were half this price. Now he's trying to displace blame for the delay to the league.

I really don't know what the hold-up is, outside of him just not feeling like he's getting a "deal".

 

[blues10]

Winnipeg did what…. 15k+ in 30 minutes??

Great response for sure, but isn’t the thing it’s being framed as.

It is a great response but is not not just deposits and not actually tickets sold at various price points.

Nice start none the less.

Jets were actual season tickets sold not deposits. They were non refundable. I know mine was a $10 000 committment for 3 years.

 

[sneakytitz]

I wonder if AM winning the land auction would be enough for them to open expansion negotiations with Houston

Tilman was meeting with Gary a week or so ago with Vernon Krause. The negotiations are already there.

Fertitta still looking for a bargain deal. That Mason-Dixon comment is still costing him.

Or, and give me some rope here, he wants an expansion draft to build a contending out of the gate team if he's going to spend the exact same amount of money.

 

[TheLegend]

As a Dallas Stars fan, honestly it's kind of annoying to have the North Stars history attached to ours. I'd happily just give it away if it were up to me.

Other than maybe Mike Modano. Can’t think of anyone else who did a stretch between both.

 

[GuelphStormer]

An update on Fertitta:

"While Houston Rockets owner Tilman Fertitta has been vocal about his intentions to bring an NHL franchise to Houston, he said in a statement to the Houston Business Journal that he was unable to bid for the Coyotes organization as "the NHL views Houston as expansion target, removing the ability for us to purchase and relocate an existing team.""

https://www.bizjournals.com/houston/news/2024/04/15/nhl-arizona-coyotes-sale-move-fertitta-houston.html

im rusty so forgive me ... does this suggest the league thinks Houston is either a more viable market or has better ownership/arena capacity than Utah? why wouldn't they move the team to Houston? the expansion fee?

seems recent franchise winners tend to be either deep pocket owners, in high potential markets with an arena or shovels in the ground (i.e., expansion into Vegas and Seattle) or super deep pocket owners, in good enough markets with an arena or shovels in the ground (i.e., relocation back into Winnipeg.) are mr. smith's pockets in utah deep enough to pull this off? is someone else wearing pants too?

on another note, ive given 'yotes fans a rough ride over the years, but man, this is a gut punch while on the ground. feel for ya.