CXLIV - The Tempe era set to begin as ASU opens Mullett Arena

[TheLegend]

Story is unlocked so everyone can read the details.

Tempe mayor has been an ardent supporter for public input and you can’t do it any more than this.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

I don't disagree...Just saying this is "Last Call" for the Coyotes. Either the voters say yes and they stay, or they say no and the NHL probably has no choice but to move them unless they can get in under the Phoenix Suns' renovation plan.

depends on who buys the Suns/Mercury/Footprint Center Lease, because that ship has already been tried from 1996-2003

 

[BKIslandersFan]

I really think Coyotes should try to get ASU basketball team onboard with this project, because their arena needs to be replaced anyway.

 

[TheLegend]

Just scanned the article and this referendum vote wouldn’t take place until 2023 after the city council makes its recommendation votes next month.

Article points out polling with city residents came back 60 percent positive.

Also the article mentions the terms of the proposal have swung more favorably towards Tempe than originally presented.

 

[Devils 3silverones]

So, seeing due process done is not the correct way to go?
I was under the assumption, as posted from multiple posters, that they council vote was presumed a pass.
Is leaving this decision to the actual citizens who will pay for this causing the uncertainty?

All of this is appearing to slowly come apart.

 

[TheLegend]

I really think Coyotes should try to get ASU basketball team onboard with this project, because their arena needs to be replaced anyway.

It’s been reported that there have been some discussion about that. Nothing concrete though.

 

[TheLegend]

So, seeing due process done is not the correct way to go?
I was under the assumption, as posted from multiple posters, that they council vote was presumed a pass.
Is leaving this decision to the actual citizens who will pay for this causing the uncertainty?

All of this is appearing to slowly come apart.

It’s a referendum vote. Not sure if it would be binding considering it’s coming after the council vote.

You can read the article yourself rather than making assumptions.

 

[Devils 3silverones]

It’s a referendum vote. Not sure if it would be binding considering it’s coming after the council vote.

You can read the article yourself rather than making assumptions.

Yes, I have. Im not assuming anthing. There is nothing to EVER assume with this situation.

There seams to be concern, out of posted article.
That's all.

 

[TheLegend]

Yes, I have. Im not assuming anthing. There is nothing to EVER assume with this situation.

There seams to be concern, out of posted article.
That's all.

There’s no concern from me.

There’s enough yes votes on the council right now.

They have a positive poll coming from the residents.

Of course that can change and I have no doubt the airport is going to run more mailers at Tempe residents to sway them their way. But flipping a poll by 10 points isn’t easy.

I’ll wait until I see more details from the proposal, but if it’s actually move favorable to Tempe than it was in the beginning and residents are mostly on board already now I don’t see it failing at this point.

 

[Devils 3silverones]

There’s no concern from me.

There’s enough yes votes on the council right now.

They have a positive poll coming from the residents.

Of course that can change and I have no doubt the airport is going to run more mailers at Tempe residents to sway them their way. But flipping a poll by 10 points isn’t easy.

I’ll wait until I see more details from the proposal, but if it’s actually move favorable to Tempe than it was in the beginning and residents are mostly on board already now I don’t see it failing at this point.

Sounds great! Thank you for your input.

 

[Stumbledore]

and here's the thing they can just lie to get people to vote no.

Wow! Really?

Lying to get people to vote a certain way?

Is such a thing even possible?

 

[Rob]

I’m glad it is going to a referendum. Giving local taxpayers a real say.

Hopefully Calgary will do the same with their potential new arena

 

[TheLegend]

Wow! Really?

Lying to get people to vote a certain way?

Is such a thing even possible?

If he’s referring to Sky Harbor back when the Cardinals wanted to build their stadium in Tempe farther north of where the Coyotes are currently seeking then he’s not far off.

Sky Harbor created a mock up video showing an aircraft crashing into the stadium. They used the paranoia from the recent 9/11 tragedy to cast a pall over it being there. Even though the site was well above the northern runways.

 

[LPHabsFan]

I don't know why but this is the image that popped in my head when I read it.

So for me, all this does is further exasperate the problem. IF this is true, because until it's announced it's just a rumor, what does that do the timing? TL mentioned the next time they can do a referendum is 2023 but when exactly in 2023?

Already I saw people in here mention that the project would require at least 4 years to complete meaning 4 years in the current setup. How much does that go up by if it now goes to a referendum? That also doesn't include any potential lawsuits that might push things.

Again though there's the elephant in the room that nobody is talking about. Yes, revenues might be at or close to the same level, but what does that mean for the losses? And more importantly, who is covering all of those losses? All this does is make the losses bigger than they already were.

Can, or will, the NHL continue paying the bills of the losses if this continues to get pushed?

 

[AZDesertKnight]

Can, or will, the NHL continue paying the bills of the losses if this continues to get pushed?

You're assuming the NHL is paying the bills on losses??

 

[LPHabsFan]

You're assuming the NHL is paying the bills on losses??

100% they are through lines of credit. If Meruelo is, then he's a horrible businessman and based on what he's done in the past, he at least appears to be relatively competent one but even then who knows.

 

[Ernie]

You're assuming the NHL is paying the bills on losses??

The Coyotes are basically the league's welfare bums.

 

[AZDesertKnight]

The Coyotes are basically the league's welfare bums.

Remember the Canadian assistance plan? I do

 

[Ernie]

Remember the Canadian assistance plan? I do

That was a pittance compared to the $30m or more the Coyotes receive. If the Jets had this kind of money back in the day the Coyotes wouldn't ever have happened.

 

[Llama19]

[snip]...they can do a referendum is 2023 but when exactly in 2023?[snip]

In all likelihood...any citizen referendum would be voted on in May 2023...

Now...you may ask why May 2023...the answer is four councilmembers...including the mayor...will be up for re-election in 2024...that election cycle will start in March 2023...

 

[Snarky Coyote]

Pretty sure the referendum will be in



Wait for it





one more moment






TWO WEEKS

 

[BKIslandersFan]

That was a pittance compared to the $30m or more the Coyotes receive. If the Jets had this kind of money back in the day the Coyotes wouldn't ever have happened.

Wasn’t it also because of the arena?

 

[Yukon Joe]

Now I'm certainly no expert on local politics in Tempe Arizona, but that never stopped anyone on social media before...

The way Tempe city council is justifying the arena deal as a way to help pay for needed land remediation. But that's a slightly more complicated argument.

In a public referendum the counter argument of "no taxpayer money for billionaires!" can go a long way and is pretty simple to understand (even if perhaps simplistic).

 

[TheLegend]

That was a pittance compared to the $30m or more the Coyotes receive. If the Jets had this kind of money back in the day the Coyotes wouldn't ever have happened.

You mean if the original Jets had someone to prop it up.

They didn’t.

Meruelo has sunk close to $40 million of his own money just to keep this going so far. When he leaves ASU he’s not getting any of that investment back.

Maybe the original Jets needed an Alex Meruelo back in the day.

 

[Yukon Joe]

Wasn’t it also because of the arena?

Jets had a deal in 1995 to build a new arena. Where it fell apart at the very end is they couldn't figure out how to cover the team's losses until a new arena was built.

So yes - if Jets 1.0 had the kind of support from the league the Yotes had they'd still be in Winnipeg.

You mean if the original Jets had someone to prop it up.

They didn’t.

Meruelo has sunk close to $40 million of his own money just to keep this going so far. When he leaves ASU he’s not getting any of that investment back.

Maybe the original Jets needed an Alex Meruelo back in the day.

The difference between 1995 and 2022 is franchise values.

Back in the early 90s the City of Winnipeg started financing some of the Jets 1.0 losses, but by 1995 when the new arena deal was struck projected losses until the new arena was built was something like $25 mil. The problem being the entire franchise was only worth something like $50 mil, so they couldn't justify those kind of losses compared to the value of the franchise.

Meruelo sunk $40 mil into the team - but it's a team worth something like $500 million, not $50 mil.