CXLIII - UPDATED 6/3 - Coyotes arena deal takes next step after Tempe council votes to open negotiations

[fryfunk]

You think that will actually happen? Good god...

I honestly thought that was a joke.

Yes I think it is very likely that a bored 20 year old, with cash in the bank might cause some problems. Especially if that 20 year old doesn't want to play in a given city.

You can spin the wheel and see where that one goes.

Maybe he throws a party and a girl gets wasted and r*&^*%, maybe some kid gets alcohol poisoning etc.

The point is the only people with a vested interested in this working out is the singular team owner.

But yeah there's no way something like this could case problems?

Maple Leafs star Auston Matthews speaks out after disorderly conduct charge

Toronto Maple Leafs star Auston Matthews said he regrets any actions of his that “put a distraction on the team or hurt or stressed any individual” on the heels of facing a charge of disorderly conduct and disruptive behaviour.

toronto.ctvnews.ca

 

[Ernie]

Why didn’t Morgan report “What” then?

A common clause in ASU contracts?

Colour me skeptical, he's a basic water boy. Morals clauses are pretty common but this one seems very specific to the situation. Perhaps it's why it took months to finalize the deal.

But no big deal, right? The only way this goes south is if Meruelo does something exceedingly stupid, good thing he has no history of that..

 

[mouser]

Colour me skeptical, he's a basic water boy. Morals clauses are pretty common but this one seems very specific to the situation. Perhaps it's why it took months to finalize the deal.

But no big deal, right? The only way this goes south is if Meruelo does something exceedingly stupid, good thing he has no history of that..

I’m confident you have no background, knowledge, or objective reasoning to evaluate anything with Meruelo, Coyotes, Tempe or ASU.

You‘ve made up your mind long long ago, and pretty much everything you post is Confirmation Bias seeking the most negative interpretation possible.

 

[TheLegend]

Did you miss the part where I said

"It'd be 1 thing if it was like when I was back in college, but in a world where twitter posts get you kicked out of school, I'd hold my breath if the student union/whatever couldn't find a reason to shut the team down without notice."



Like I said the university faces the issue of student unions etc being over "empowered".




You have not been following the goings ons in universities if you think the university administration can't be pressured. It isn't the good old days where anything can be swept under a rug for a bit of money.

EDIT: All it takes is 1 RFA wanting out of Arizona to make the difference.

Both the schools and players have unions.

Neither the players Union nor the student union have any interest in protecting the arena deal.

The Coyotes are setting aside a block of tickets campus student groups. It's on the end that ASU originally designed it for. Only information at this time is pricing is in the $50-60 dollar range. BTW... ASU has already sold out the upcoming men's hockey season.

If there was gong to be pushback from student groups it would have happened before the AZBOR voted on it. There wasn't any that I know of so you're kind of pushing a "what if" with the notion there's going to be some campus revolt over this.

 

[TheLegend]

That's a huge eye roll right there. Why didn't Morgan report it then? Very relevant given Meruelo's history. Dude is so desperate for the Coyotes to stay alive.

He reported the details of the lease given to him. He wrote Q and A articles about the lease with both Gutierrez and Morgan Olsen who is ASUs CFO in charge of the MPA.

He reported the details regarding the on ice advertising, who controlled what, etc. It's been out there for weeks.

The plain truth here is Shapiro and Strang didn't do their homework. They got a copy of the actual lease and made several assumptions based upon their previous third party knowledge of Meruelo and jumped to conclusions.

One phone call to ASU would have blown away the narrative they tried to sell their readers.

 

[Dirty Old Man]

I’m confident you have no background, knowledge, or objective reasoning to evaluate anything with Meruelo, Coyotes, Tempe or ASU.

You‘ve made up your mind long long ago, and pretty much everything you post is Confirmation Bias seeking the most negative interpretation possible.

*sigh* And if only there weren't soooooooooo many others in the megathread that description fits...i call pretty much everything they post "trolling".

 

[Ernie]

I’m confident you have no background, knowledge, or objective reasoning to evaluate anything with Meruelo, Coyotes, Tempe or ASU.

You‘ve made up your mind long long ago, and pretty much everything you post is Confirmation Bias seeking the most negative interpretation possible.

It's hilarious that Coyotes fans throw around statements like this in total denial of their own biases.

13 years. That's how long this saga of incompetence has been going on. Anyone who thinks this is somehow normal or defendable has their head deeply buried in the sand.

 

[Fatass]

Why didn’t Morgan report “What” then?

A common clause in ASU contracts?

What constitutes a breach of said “.good behaviour”?
Wouldn’t the contract set out actual guidelines? It’s vague otherwise.
Maybe this is more than good morale behaviour, but extends to paying bills and stuff like that?

 

[Stumbledore]

I'm confused. (It happens more after you retire and your brain ages.)

Somebody quoted something to the effect that ASU can cancel the deal if the Coyotes or Meruelo fail to conduct their business affairs with a high degree of integrity and honesty.

Wouldn't that include failing to pay your players, withholding bonuses, failing to pay your taxes, and violating NHL rules on approaching players? Cause the Coyotes have already done that and worse.

As somebody said, this is like inviting an alcoholic into your bar and getting him to pay up front for his drinks before you pitch him out.

 

[jonathan613]

to me the main issue is whether or not the permanent arena will be built. I would imagine that the coyotes are now on a clock where there must be a final resolution regarding the new arena is reached by next year at this time. This is to give enough time to have it ready when the ASU agreement expires. I hope that happens, because i would not see them having any other options in the phoenix market if not. But if it does happen, and i hope it does, i would be shocked, assuming meruelo were to prepay glendale that the parties would not come to some sort of agreement at that time. i might be stupid or naive, but if the new arena is actually a go, the coyotes would have a ton more leverage over glendale and could enter into one last temporary agreement.

 

[fryfunk]

If there was gong to be pushback from student groups it would have happened before the AZBOR voted on it.

The push back from the students isn't gonna occur until something happens.

There wasn't any that I know of so you're kind of pushing a "what if" with the notion there's going to be some campus revolt over this.

It's a what if, but it's the kind of what if that could jeopardize the team.

You think if Evander Kane signs to the yotes they won't have some serious issue with students? I'm not sure if you've been following what has been occuring with universities but I promise you the students have way more influence than they ever had in the past.

My understanding of these morality clauses is that they are not rigidly defined, but used for unexpected situations, where objectivity can be superseded by opinion.

 

[fryfunk]

I’m confident you have no background, knowledge, or objective reasoning to evaluate anything with Meruelo, Coyotes, Tempe or ASU.

You‘ve made up your mind long long ago, and pretty much everything you post is Confirmation Bias seeking the most negative interpretation possible.

I'm sorry but you're gonna get more mileage with "confirmation bias", when you act as if the ASU situation isn't extraordinary.

The kind of extraordinary that requires extraordinary evidence.

Claims by Meruelo/yotes are not things to be given a heavy weighting. He has every financial motive in the literal world to offer up a hyper biased perspective on the situation.

Tempe is being very quiet on the whole thing.

The NHL/players have shown at best a skeptical attitude towards the whole thing.

ASU has to make the case this is happening, and the morality clause is no small deal.


If you want I can apologize for being too harsh in the past, but if we look at current situation it's easy to argue extraordinary evidence is required. I'm open to having a fresh start on this discussion, but if you don't want to be called a goal post mover, please refrain from using past attitudes as part of your arguments. The situation has changed in a way that couldn't have been predicted by anyone.

I will grant you this. There is a chance this can go ahead.

There's a chance that after year 1 honeymoon phase ticket prices will drop or the arena will be have empty.

But there's also a distinct chance this could really work.

With ASU becoming part of the Yotes mythos for decades to come.

i'll admit it can go either way if it does happen.

But again skepticism is absolutely a logical conclusion.

It's been a very long time since there was any good news that would remove any sense of doubt.

If you want us to throw away our biases I'm game, but lets be clear, this is absolutely an extraordinary situation which implies serious skepticism.

 

[TheLegend]

It's hilarious that Coyotes fans throw around statements like this in total denial of their own biases.

13 years. That's how long this saga of incompetence has been going on. Anyone who thinks this is somehow normal or defendable has their head deeply buried in the sand.

Nyah.... it's more hilarious watching fans from everywhere come up with all the doom and gloom scenarios that never materialize.

 

[Dirty Old Man]

Nyah.... it's more hilarious watching fans from everywhere come up with all the doom and gloom scenarios that never materialize.

it's funny coz it's true

 

[TheLegend]

The push back from the students isn't gonna occur until something happens.



It's a what if, but it's the kind of what if that could jeopardize the team.

You think if Evander Kane signs to the yotes they won't have some serious issue with students? I'm not sure if you've been following what has been occuring with universities but I promise you the students have way more influence than they ever had in the past.

My understanding of these morality clauses is that they are not rigidly defined, but used for unexpected situations, where objectivity can be superseded by opinion.

At least you acknowledge this is a hypothetical situation.

And if Meruelo was stupid enough to do something to give ASU cause then I'm not going to argue against them giving him the boot.

But I can tell you that right now ASU has more controversy with its football program than anything Meruelo has done to date.

 

[fryfunk]

At least you acknowledge this is a hypothetical situation.

And if Meruelo was stupid enough to do something to give ASU cause then I'm not going to argue against them giving him the boot.

So where would signing evander kane fit?

Why wouldn't they sign him?

But I can tell you that right now ASU has more controversy with its football program than anything Meruelo has done to date.

Difference is shutting down the program isn't really an option.

It's heavily integrated into the school system.

 

[TheLegend]

What constitutes a breach of said “.good behaviour”?
Wouldn’t the contract set out actual guidelines? It’s vague otherwise.
Maybe this is more than good morale behaviour, but extends to paying bills and stuff like that?

It's whatever ASU determines it to be.

And it'll take a lot more than a Katie Strang article to convince them to trigger that clause.

Also.... if all the previous stories on it are true, Meruelo has paid the bills up front.

 

[TheLegend]

So where would signing evander kane fit?

Why wouldn't they sign him?

Why would they??

Difference is shutting down the program isn't really an option.

It's heavily integrated into the school system.

Taking away dozens of scholarships and banning post season participation for multiple years can set a program back for a decade. Tens of millions in income are at stake there.

It's still a problem that brings a bad light onto the university.

 

[fryfunk]

Why would they??

Highly skilled free agent who has economic motivations to not be too picky about whether or not the team is gonna be a playoff contender.

The yotes need to hit the cap floor, ideally getting a superstar free agent is the way to do it.

Regardless the point is whether or not they would or would not do so.

Taking away dozens of scholarships and banning post season participation for multiple years can set a program back for a decade. Tens of millions in income are at stake there.

It's still a problem that brings a bad light onto the university.

As someone who's wife works at a uni, I can tell you they love their scape goats.

 

[gstommylee]

and what the heck has some hypertheical scenario where yotes sign Evander kane suddenly get ASU to trigger the clause...

Seriously fryfunk, stop reaching for things just to create some "reason" that ASU should kick them out.

 

[Dolemite]

​

Arizona State University can break its lease deal with the Arizona Coyotes if the NHL club or its owner violates certain terms on behavior, The Athletic reports.


Reporters Sean Shapiro and Katie Strang write the school can get out of the deal if the Coyotes or owner Alex Meruelo become the subjects of scandal or ridicule or fail to act "as a good corporate citizen."

Report: Arizona State can kick Coyotes out for poor behaviour

Arizona State University can break its lease deal with the Phoenix Coyotes if the NHL club or its owner violate certain terms on behaviour, The Athletic reports.

www.sportsnet.ca

​

According to the document, if the Coyotes or Meruelo become the subject of adverse publicity, contempt, scandal or ridicule for violating “widely held principles of public morality, failing to conduct its business affairs with a high degree of integrity and honesty and/or failing to act as a good corporate citizen,” Arizona State can get out of its deal with the Coyotes.

This includes media coverage of Meruelo and the Coyotes business practices, according to the document, and ASU can cancel the Coyotes tenancy if coverage is proven true and has damaged or could damage ASU’s reputation.

As a tenant, all advertising for the Coyotes will be temporary at the arena. The Coyotes will have full access to the center-hung video scoreboard and the ribbon board. They will also be able to change board advertisements for NHL home games at their own cost on game days.

The Coyotes will be limited in securing some partnerships. Oak View Group has signed a group of exclusive venue sponsors, which the Coyotes will be required to work with or refrain from selling in that space.

Additionally, according to the agreement:

• Any alcohol or beer advertisements must be approved by Arizona State.
• Arizona State maintains the right to object to any advertisement that is “not in good taste or is otherwise not in compliance” with ASU’s rules.
• Arizona State will receive the revenue from naming rights for the arena.
• The Coyotes will not be permitted to sell any temporary advertising that is a competitor or in the same category as whomever ASU sells naming rights to.
• In-ice advertising will be a revenue source for Arizona State, and the Coyotes aren’t allowed to modify the look of the ice surface – including the Arizona State logo at center ice — on broadcasts to protect ASU’s permanent advertisers in the building. It is noted that this doesn’t and shouldn’t impact opposing broadcasts filming at ASU.

​

As someone who has covered this circus since the NHL took over control of the team.

Its much ado about noting. Typical off season garbage article meant to trash the coyotes for no reason…yet again. You can set your watch to it now.

 

[WingsMJN2965]

why relocate if everyone's committed to the market

It seemed obvious that not everyone is committed considering their landlord evicted them.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

It seemed obvious that not everyone is committed considering their landlord evicted them.

Glendale has done what the last 20 years..... Westgate wasn't happening and Moyes blamed the NHL and walked away.....

 

[Spring in Fialta]

As someone who has covered this circus since the NHL took over control of the team.

Its much ado about noting. Typical off season garbage article meant to trash the coyotes for no reason…yet again. You can set your watch to it now.

You were asked about this before and came up empty.

 

[fryfunk]

and what the heck has some hypertheical scenario where yotes sign Evander kane suddenly get ASU to trigger the clause...

Seriously fryfunk, stop reaching for things just to create some "reason" that ASU should kick them out.

I'm sorry but I have connections to actual universities. I'm well aware of how common it is for students to charge the doors of a university president.

All it takes is one twitter tweet etc and people will be looking into some of his anti social behaviors of the past.

Those good behavior clauses usually include removing employees who are known to be problematic etc.

Which is not a problem in an environment without a union.

The point is these policies put the team in vulnerable position.

The team can't buy out a player every time something controversial pops up.

In the last year we've had serious contoversies with Chicago, a Montreal draft pick, Deangelo affecting which affects two teams, Bertuzzi and Kane who affects two teams.

That's 7 teams out of 32 being linked to very publicized controversies. Not to mention controversies associated with organizations who've defended abusive coaches, who hired staff from chicago etc.

And that all occurred without these teams being near coeds.

The argument the team is gonna be on their best behavior would hold weight, if the players wanted to be in ASU.