Prospect Info: Cutter Gauthier

[anezthes]

I just hope Drysdale isn’t the next Theodore and Monty that we watch from afar as they become allstars playing in the Cup Finals.

Sky's the limit for Drys. Can only hope Cutter becomes a very good player for us.

 

[forever1922]

I disagree with the idea that Gauthier is a risk. He is widely regarded as a top10 prospect outside of the NHL.

You might even call Drysdale just as risky with a lower ceiling. The whole point is trading away from an area of overwhelming strength to improve the team and this is the best hockey trade I can ever think was available. Of course Verbeek was right to pounce on it. To me it doesn't matter if Gauthier completely flops, as long as it's performance related, this was the right thing to do, no matter how much fans were attached to Drysdale.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

It’s Verbeek’s biggest move and riskiest. Other GMs would have traded their depth via prospects like Zellweger or Luneau, not established 21 year olds. It didn’t help that he added that pick. Well this is what we will measure him by… I just hope Drysdale isn’t the next Theodore and Monty that we watch from afar as they become allstars playing in the Cup Finals.

You act like the Flyers were obligated to take whatever PV offered. You also say that like you know he didn't try that first. You have no idea what conversations went on. There were literally 18-20 teams in the hunt for this kid. He wasn't going for a mystery box and picks. If you don't like the trade, fine, just say so. But don't act like Verbeek could have easily paid less but was too stupid to do so. That's just an uncalled for, cheap shot.

Yeah, it was a big move. PV traded from a position of strength to fill a weakness. Exactly what you want a team to do. I'll miss JD, but I'm not complaining that the GM isn't trying his best to build a very good team here.

 

[DuckTech]

I will chime in and say there is a part of me that had Nick Ritchie PTSD moments after seeing some of the plays of Cutter. So that's my fear on the kid, however, Cutter seems to have a brain and can at least talk in interviews etc. I am hopeful and excited but that little voice is still there too!

 

[Hockey Duckie]

It’s Verbeek’s biggest move and riskiest. Other GMs would have traded their depth via prospects like Zellweger or Luneau, not established 21 year olds. It didn’t help that he added that pick. Well this is what we will measure him by… I just hope Drysdale isn’t the next Theodore and Monty that we watch from afar as they become allstars playing in the Cup Finals.

A few things fell in favor with Philly's ante:

• 1. Cutter raised his stock at the WJC. He was awarded the best forward, tied for most assists, and tied for most points in the tournament.

• 2. Lack of top-end scoring in the system:
  • a. No high scoring forward popped out this year in the system.
    (Verbeek's fault for passing up potential top-6 scorers in the 2022 draft at pick 22)
  • b. No trust in any prospects in the system.
    (RW Colangelo has the same amount of goals as Cutter in the NCAA)
  • c. Doesn't want to wait on a 2024 draftee to get to the NHL level.

• 3. Verbeek is planning to ship off Rico at the TDL. Rico is tied for 3rd in goals with 10 goals and tied for fourth in total points with 22 points on the team.

• 4. Verbeek fell in love with Cutter at last year's World's tournament while scouting Carlsson and Fantilli. Cutter was tied for most goals on team USA with 7 goals and finished third in team scoring with 9 points. At the tournament level, Cutter finished tied-2nd in goals and tied-8th in points.

Because of factor #1, Philly demanded a young, NHL RD. All Philly had to do was see who would set offers and pit those teams against each other. Verbeek was more desperate for NHL offense next year and couldn't blame his hand picked coach for not generating more offense this year. Anaheim has only 9 more goals this year than last year at the 41-game mark.

I don't know if this is Verbeek's biggest and riskiest move, but I'd call it his biggest and riskiest reaction. There were two non-reaction riskier moves he made. First one was who to select at 22nd overall in the 2022 draft. Because we went 3C instead of top-6 scoring, the reaction move of trading for Cutter was made. Snuggerud's goal scoring production at the NCAA level is equal to or better than Cutter's for the past two seasons thus far. Kulich has been a goal scoring machine in the AHL for the past two seasons; along with tied for most goals and points in this year's WJC.

The second biggest risk, with respect to this board and media masses, was selecting Carlsson over Fantilli.

 

[Boo Boo]

I will chime in and say there is a part of me that had Nick Ritchie PTSD moments after seeing some of the plays of Cutter. So that's my fear on the kid, however, Cutter seems to have a brain and can at least talk in interviews etc. I am hopeful and excited but that little voice is still there too!

I’m sure he clears Ritchie quite easily in intelligence but I’m not quite sure why his interviews are winning people over. Just from what I’ve seen he seems kind of arrogant.

Not that it’s a bad thing for a pro athlete to be cocky it just hasn’t been endearing so far in my opinion.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Yeah, it was a big move. PV traded from a position of strength to fill a weakness. Exactly what you want a team to do. I'll miss JD, but I'm not complaining that the GM isn't trying his best to build a very good team here.

It isn't necessarily true that we traded from a position of strength. It's true we have amassed a great deal of young, talented d-men talent at the pro level. It's not true that we have amassed a great deal of young, talented RD's.

LD youths/prospects at pro level
- Mintyukov (NHL)
- LaCombe (NHL)
- Zellweger (AHL)
- Hinds (AHL)

Zell is an offensive weapon in the AHL while Hinds is a shutdown d-man. Zell is 3rd in scoring for the Gulls. Hinds has a +5 rating on the Gulls, 2nd on the team behind Hagg.

RD youths/prospects at pro level
- Luneau (juniors)
- Helleson (AHL)

Helleson has lost his shine. He doesn't score a lot (6 pts) and his defense isn't great (-4 rating). There is a caveat, though, Helleson has been playing on the top pair. Maybe there's something there like LaCombe having the Ducks' worst +/- rating, but LaCombe serves a purpose of sheltering the other pairings.

We have no true idea if Luneau can handle RD1 duties next year due to a small sample.

RD prospects on non-pro levels
- Warren (juniors)
- Moore (NCAA)

Warren looks years away from the NHL. Moore is an unknown due to being injured this season. Moore did look good at Dev camp, but Dev camp is against other prospects, not other NHL or AHL'ers.

 

[wesott11]

someone needs to ask Cutter if he knows about time zones. The ultimate Ritchie test

 

[cheesymc]

You act like the Flyers were obligated to take whatever PV offered. You also say that like you know he didn't try that first. You have no idea what conversations went on. There were literally 18-20 teams in the hunt for this kid. He wasn't going for a mystery box and picks. If you don't like the trade, fine, just say so. But don't act like Verbeek could have easily paid less but was too stupid to do so. That's just an uncalled for, cheap shot.

Yeah, it was a big move. PV traded from a position of strength to fill a weakness. Exactly what you want a team to do. I'll miss JD, but I'm not complaining that the GM isn't trying his best to build a very good team here.

You keep defending Verbeek, but we won’t know the results for a few years. The fact still remains that trading on our position of strength isn’t giving up the proven assets. Our defensive prospects can all bust or not develop quickly for all we know. Most GMs aren’t willing to give up established players. I doubt teams would offer Kaiden Guhle, Luke Hughes type of players. Even unproven prospects like Edvinsson and Brandt Clarke wouldn’t be offered because of all the development time and progress made at higher levels. Cutter is an A prospect but isn’t a premier like a Fantilli or Carlsson. Sure many teams want Cutter but most teams don’t have the prospects to make the trade. On top of that the Flyer were in a position of weakness with everyone knowing they wanted to make a trade for half a year. So yeah, acceptbthat Verbeek overpaid, but it should be fine since he really liked him but the results better be justified. That’s called accountability.

 

[robbieboy3686]

Anyone have access to this article? There is a paywall it breaks down the trade

 

[Hockey Duckie]

You keep defending Verbeek, but we won’t know the results for a few years. The fact still remains that trading on our position of strength isn’t giving up the proven assets. Our defensive prospects can all bust or not develop quickly for all we know. Most GMs aren’t willing to give up established players. I doubt teams would offer Kaiden Guhle, Luke Hughes type of players. Even unproven prospects like Edvinsson and Brandt Clarke wouldn’t be offered because of all the development time and progress made at higher levels. Cutter is an A prospect but isn’t a premier like a Fantilli or Carlsson. Sure many teams want Cutter but most teams don’t have the prospects to make the trade. On top of that the Flyer were in a position of weakness with everyone knowing they wanted to make a trade for half a year. So yeah, acceptbthat Verbeek overpaid, but it should be fine since he really liked him but the results better be justified. That’s called accountability.

Actually, no one knew the full issue with Cutter. Cutter did his job and kept quiet. Flyers were shopping him all under the cover of

• Here's what was on the table with Cutter:
  • Before college
    • Elite Skating
    • High end shot
    • Size 6'2 and 190 lbs
  • 2nd year in college.
    • Physically, he's NHL-ready for next season.
    • Scored well at last year's World Championship against men.
    • Just had a great outing at the recent WJC and awarded best forward in the tourney.

Cutter is as advertised, a top-6 scoring forward as his NHL floor. Philly didn't want prospects. They specifically wanted a young RD. Don't blame Philly for what they wanted. Blame Verbeek for putting himself and the org in a desperate situation of needing a top-6 scorer for next season. His desperation is what caused the overpayment, not Philly. Philly took advantage of the situation.

When Drysdale fell to injury last year, our defensive corps felt it and we were, in the infamous words of Charles Barkley, "turrible!"

This year when Drysdale fell to injury, the defense didn't falter. In fact, it was league average, which is a huge improvement over finishing 31st last season. We had enough talent to absorb Drysdale's loss. Our big problem this year was the lack of scoring, especially at ES. We would have more wins if we were a league average scoring team. Now, factor in the probable loss of Rico's scoring at the TDL and our future doesn't have any highly likely solutions for improving scoring. We can hope one or two forward prospect can make the jump, but Verbeek didn't think "hope was a strategy" and decided to pull the trigger. That does make sense, but it came at a high price.

This just means our RD's will be reliant on outside, veteran help. We can keep Lyubushkin for a year or two or we bite the bullet and move one of LD's to the their off-side in LaCombe, Zellweger, or Hinds.

All we can do now is hope for the best with Cutter b/c we're gonna be locked in on him from now on. And Cutter will be here next year in the NHL instead of waiting on the 2024 first round forward to be ready in a couple of years. With Cutter's size and speed, he can complement a line away from McTavish. That gives us two heavies in our two top-6 forward lines.

In a vacuum, is acquiring Cutter a great fit for Anaheim? The answer potentially is yes, especially since we're using him as a winger, not a center.

Only time will tell if both teams win, lose, or a variation between. I feel we lost the better talent in the deal, but we won't know until several years later.

 

[tomd]

If Gauthier comes as advertised then the Ducks made a very good trade.

As I think most of us recognized, there was no way that under a PV regime the Ducks would have both Drysdale and Zellweger on D. No way. So one of them was going to go and it makes sense to me that it was Drysdale. IMO what makes Zellweger the more valuable player between the two is his ability to score goals. Drysdale doesn't have the shot or the hunger for goals that Zellweger does. Drysdale is probably a more elite skater but not by much. Passing is similar between the two. Both will struggle with physical play but I think that Zellweger will be able to handle it better with another year of physical development and getting used to the pro game.

So assuming Gauthier delivers, I like the team with him and Zellweger better than Drysdale and Zellweger. Just my $0.02.

 

[cheesymc]

If Gauthier comes as advertised then the Ducks made a very good trade.

As I think most of us recognized, there was no way that under a PV regime the Ducks would have both Drysdale and Zellweger on D. No way. So one of them was going to go and it makes sense to me that it was Drysdale. IMO what makes Zellweger the more valuable player between the two is his ability to score goals. Drysdale doesn't have the shot or the hunger for goals that Zellweger does. Drysdale is probably a more elite skater but not by much. Passing is similar between the two. Both will struggle with physical play but I think that Zellweger will be able to handle it better with another year of physical development and getting used to the pro game.

So assuming Gauthier delivers, I like the team with him and Zellweger better than Drysdale and Zellweger. Just my $0.02.

For our sake Cutter MUST succeed. My fear is that Minty has a sophomore slump or gets dinged up like Drysdale, and our prospects struggle getting to the next level. Zellwegers defense isn’t close to Drysdale. So there is risk that we extend the rebuild by another year or two until the defense is ready. Luckily that can quickly change if we can sign a single legitimate top pair dman, although there aren’t many available in the next few off seasons.

What if we miraculously get to draft Celebrini? Adding him and Gauthier to our lineup next year is going to make our forwards really crowded, but I guess that would be a good problem.

 

[tomd]

For our sake Cutter MUST succeed. My fear is that Minty has a sophomore slump or gets dinged up like Drysdale, and our prospects struggle getting to the next level. Zellwegers defense isn’t close to Drysdale. So there is risk that we extend the rebuild by another year or two until the defense is ready. Luckily that can quickly change if we can sign a single legitimate top pair dman, although there aren’t many available in the next few off seasons.

What if we miraculously get to draft Celebrini? Adding him and Gauthier to our lineup next year is going to make our forwards really crowded, but I guess that would be a good problem.

Yes, the risk/reward for this trade is all on the Ducks. If Cutter flops it will set the rebuild back a lot. But if he does flop then a LOT of people will have misjudged him. I'm willing to stipulate that Drysdale is better defensively than Zellweger today but I think that will even out as Zellweger gets more experience. Until both are tested under playoff conditions I don't think either one can earn the label of 1D or 2D that has been thrown around (especially regarding Drysdale).

Getting Celebrini would be a good problem indeed. At that point, Zegras can begin to pack his bags more than likely.

 

[FiveTacos]

It’s Verbeek’s biggest move and riskiest. Other GMs would have traded their depth via prospects like Zellweger or Luneau, not established 21 year olds.

Trading either of those guys would likely land you a lesser prospect, or a good but limited upside NHLer, or someone really good but with other issues (age, bad contract, almost UFA, etc). Prospects better than Gauthier generally aren't traded at all, certainly not for a talented guy who misses 100 games in a year and a half.

It obviously would have been far safer to trade Luneau or Zell for a comparable forward prospect, but safer also likely means more flawed or less upside.

Getting Celebrini would be a good problem indeed. At that point, Zegras can begin to pack his bags more than likely.

Actually my inclination at that point would be to build 3 scoring lines and light teams up.

Otherwise yeah you might move Zegras, or it'd be one of those rare situations where you consider trading that pick for a big return.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

You keep defending Verbeek, but we won’t know the results for a few years. The fact still remains that trading on our position of strength isn’t giving up the proven assets. Our defensive prospects can all bust or not develop quickly for all we know. Most GMs aren’t willing to give up established players. I doubt teams would offer Kaiden Guhle, Luke Hughes type of players. Even unproven prospects like Edvinsson and Brandt Clarke wouldn’t be offered because of all the development time and progress made at higher levels. Cutter is an A prospect but isn’t a premier like a Fantilli or Carlsson. Sure many teams want Cutter but most teams don’t have the prospects to make the trade. On top of that the Flyer were in a position of weakness with everyone knowing they wanted to make a trade for half a year. So yeah, acceptbthat Verbeek overpaid, but it should be fine since he really liked him but the results better be justified. That’s called accountability.

First of all I don't keep defending Verbeek. I hardly comment one way or the other on every move he makes. You on the other hand always seem to know exactly what he's thinking and what all the other GMs in the league would and would not do.

As I said before, if you don't like the trade, fine, express yourself as such and move on. But when you start claiming you know exactly what every other GM would do, and act like you know all the conversations that went on, and then choose to degrade the GM because you have some superior knowledge to his, you just look like one of those MB clowns people try to avoid.

 

[shach1]

 

[cheesymc]

First of all I don't keep defending Verbeek. I hardly comment one way or the other on every move he makes. You on the other hand always seem to know exactly what he's thinking and what all the other GMs in the league would and would not do.

As I said before, if you don't like the trade, fine, express yourself as such and move on. But when you start claiming you know exactly what every other GM would do, and act like you know all the conversations that went on, and then choose to degrade the GM because you have some superior knowledge to his, you just look like one of those MB clowns people try to avoid.

I expressed it and have moved on, it’s you that can’t accept my opinion and feel like you need to go on the offensive.

I never claimed that I know what every GM is thinking. I’m making a circumstantial judgement that these trades don’t happen often because historically GMs don’t offer what Verbeek did. When a player asks to be traded and is public knowledge and he ain’t a Bedard, the return would typically be a high end prospect or two plus picks. So like a Luneau, 2nd, Perreault offer. That is trading from a positional of depth. Sure not great of a return for a former top pick but it’s the circumstance. So when the flyers got Drysdale that is a huge win for them… and that pick was a big bonus. GMs prefer to offer quantity over quality to avoid making a big mistake, and that is what I preferred to have been done.

It’s fine that you don’t mind the overpay. Some people don’t mind paying 10k more for a Toyota truck. I’m wired differently than you and I prefer to pay under MSPR because I don’t feel the pressure to buy knowing there are other opportunities. It’s ok… we are different. Let’s move on and start looking ahead at the trade deadline and draft for another lost season.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

I expressed it and have moved on, it’s you that can’t accept my opinion and feel like you need to go on the offensive.

I never claimed that I know what every GM is thinking. I’m making a circumstantial judgement that these trades don’t happen often because historically GMs don’t offer what Verbeek did. When a player asks to be traded and is public knowledge and he ain’t a Bedard, the return would typically be a high end prospect or two plus picks. So like a Luneau, 2nd, Perreault offer. That is trading from a positional of depth. Sure not great of a return for a former top pick but it’s the circumstance. So when the flyers got Drysdale that is a huge win for them… and that pick was a big bonus. GMs prefer to offer quantity over quality to avoid making a big mistake, and that is what I preferred to have been done.

It’s fine that you don’t mind the overpay. Some people don’t mind paying 10k more for a Toyota truck. I’m wired differently than you and I prefer to pay under MSPR because I don’t feel the pressure to buy knowing there are other opportunities. It’s ok… we are different. Let’s move on and start looking ahead at the trade deadline and draft for another lost season.

Oh, I see. I didn’t realize this was really about the price of Toyota trucks. Nice segue.

 

[DuckDuckGetz]

Maybe a hot take but I don’t see either Cutter or Drysdale becoming major impact players and I think the trade ends up pretty even, all things considered.

The deciding factors will be supporting cast and injuries more than either player themselves.

 

[JAHV]

I expressed it and have moved on, it’s you that can’t accept my opinion and feel like you need to go on the offensive.

I never claimed that I know what every GM is thinking. I’m making a circumstantial judgement that these trades don’t happen often because historically GMs don’t offer what Verbeek did. When a player asks to be traded and is public knowledge and he ain’t a Bedard, the return would typically be a high end prospect or two plus picks. So like a Luneau, 2nd, Perreault offer. That is trading from a positional of depth. Sure not great of a return for a former top pick but it’s the circumstance. So when the flyers got Drysdale that is a huge win for them… and that pick was a big bonus. GMs prefer to offer quantity over quality to avoid making a big mistake, and that is what I preferred to have been done.

It’s fine that you don’t mind the overpay. Some people don’t mind paying 10k more for a Toyota truck. I’m wired differently than you and I prefer to pay under MSPR because I don’t feel the pressure to buy knowing there are other opportunities. It’s ok… we are different. Let’s move on and start looking ahead at the trade deadline and draft for another lost season.

This is begging the question. What evidence is there that it's an overpay? As I, and others, have pointed out ad nauseum, it's hard to find anyone in hockey media who thought the Ducks did poorly in the trade.

If we're using the truck analogy: if there's a guy who sells you a truck for $40,000 and sells me the same truck an hour later for $50,000, we can pretty safely say I overpaid. But there's only one Gauthier, and we know the Ducks are the only ones who offered something the Flyers would accept. We'll never know if they would have accepted less. The only way we can evaluate this is by blending our own knowledge of the players with what the experts are saying.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

This is begging the question. What evidence is there that it's an overpay? As I, and others, have pointed out ad nauseum, it's hard to find anyone in hockey media who thought the Ducks did poorly in the trade.

If we're using the truck analogy: if there's a guy who sells you a truck for $40,000 and sells me the same truck an hour later for $50,000, we can pretty safely say I overpaid. But there's only one Gauthier, and we know the Ducks are the only ones who offered something the Flyers would accept. We'll never know if they would have accepted less. The only way we can evaluate this is by blending our own knowledge of the players with what the experts are saying.

Drysdale and Gauthier are kinda equal players. Drysdale is a known product who missed all of last year. Gauther is still and unknown NHL product, but shows lots of potential at the NCAA, Juniors, and World Champion levels. We threw in a 2nd round pick for the 2025 draft. That sweetener is the overpayment.

Now, if Verbeek truly wanted Gauthier, then it's well worth the overpayment to secure acquiring Cutter from the 12-17 others vying for the same prospect. Seeing how we're lacking offense while missing Carlsson, Z, and Minty, adding a prospect of Gauthier's caliber is a great swing. We won the Cutter sweepstake at a costly price. So be it.

We had two second round picks in 2022. We had three second round picks in 2023, last year. And this year, we have at least two 2nd round picks for th 2024 draft. Who knows if we're adding more picks this year or next? Rico, Lyubushkin, and Silf could all be on the trading block.

 

[Gliff]

View attachment 802286Anyone have access to this article? There is a paywall it breaks down the trade

Breaks down each players and shows upside and downsides for both. Interesting breakdown but nothing we haven’t heard from other places.

 

[Leonardo87]

What a snipe goal by Cutter.

 

[Leonardo87]

2nd goal of the night.

Was the 3rd assist on the 2nd BC goal. Also, had a great play short-handed with a slick pass, but they couldn’t score.