Prospect Info: Current #2 overall poll and discussion

[ninetyeight]

Do you really not see the issue? If we pay a 3rd line center bigger money, we have to sacrifice on the wingers in the top 6. That's not even what I was referring to anyways. Some guys wanna be the goto guy, like an ego thing. They don't want to be the 2nd or 3rd guy, even if they are getting decent minutes.

Well maybe, I just think you're making it a bigger issue than what it really is. In salary cap era you have to make compromises anyway. How expensive is your goalie, your d and how do you distribute your elite players. Top heavy vs depth. Hypothetically we take Slaf and he hits his 8m aav level ceiling, bratt gets 7m, both yegor and holtz become 30-40 goal scorers and also gets 7+, mercer hits his ceiling and wants another 7-8m, now we have the same problem but in the wing. It's just one of those things you handle if/when it happens.

And if you have a 7,5m aav guy in the third line, it's not really a regular 3rd line, it's gonna get a lot more ice time. The 4th line would probably play a bit less and the rest somewhat evenly. And naturally which ever line seems to be clicking the most, you'd play more.

The other options are either converting one C to wing, or trading one away. Having too many good players is a pretty good problem to have.

I don't really know what to say about the ego thing. I hope all of these guys are professionals with team first mentality. I have a hard time imagining Nico complaining about not being the goto guy or not getting enough icetime. Plus there's still a loooong way for Wright to outplay Nico, let alone Jack, if we even end up with him. If ego becomes an issue then you look for a trade, and now the player has monster value instead of when he was just a prospect.

No GM would pass on a future 8m market value guy just because they already have guys in that position. Unless ofcourse there's equally skilled players for other positions.

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

Nico doesn't have it, yet I don't see people knocking Nico's ability as a player or calling that a red flag for him.

No, actually it's a common criticism of him and for some here, why people are calling him trash. Nico clearly has the skill, he just doesn't assert himself. Then you see him takeover when no one else can (like when Jack went down). I'm not sure I want yet another player like that.

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

I’d like to say congrats to this Red Wings blog on coming up with the first trade package for the Devils’ first (provided Wright is available) that might actually be an overpay, even though i’m not sure i’d do it: Bertuzzi, Hronek, 8th overall, and another later pick.



Bertuzzi kinda rubs me the wrong way after we had the vax issue with Blackwood, but i have to admit he’s exactly the type of player the Devils should be looking for. I’m not sure of his contract situation.

That's not bad in terms of value but I'm not sure I do it cuz those players aren't really what we need.

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

Well maybe, I just think you're making it a bigger issue than what it really is. In salary cap era you have to make compromises anyway. How expensive is your goalie, your d and how do you distribute your elite players. Top heavy vs depth. Hypothetically we take Slaf and he hits his 8m aav level ceiling, bratt gets 7m, both yegor and holtz become 30-40 goal scorers and also gets 7+, mercer hits his ceiling and wants another 7-8m, now we have the same problem but in the wing. It's just one of those things you handle if/when it happens.

And if you have a 7,5m aav guy in the third line, it's not really a regular 3rd line, it's gonna get a lot more ice time. The 4th line would probably play a bit less and the rest somewhat evenly. And naturally which ever line seems to be clicking the most, you'd play more.

The other options are either converting one C to wing, or trading one away. Having too many good players is a pretty good problem to have.

I don't really know what to say about the ego thing. I hope all of these guys are professionals with team first mentality. I have a hard time imagining Nico complaining about not being the goto guy or not getting enough icetime. Plus there's still a loooong way for Wright to outplay Nico, let alone Jack, if we even end up with him. If ego becomes an issue then you look for a trade, and now the player has monster value instead of when he was just a prospect.

No GM would pass on a future 8m market value guy just because they already have guys in that position. Unless ofcourse there's equally skilled players for other positions.

Yes, I never said let's just avoid Wright and draft Jiricek (or something like that). My preference is getting an impact player for #2 if Slaf gets picked 1st. Why? Because why go through all those hypotheticals and "figure it out" 5 years later if we can just get an impact player now.

 

[StevenToddIves]

Havimg our 1st rounder with the hope of him being a 3C is … underwhelming to me. I knkw on other teams he would / coild be a 2c due to us having Hughes / Nico already but still…… I want the first line potential player instead of the trade .
I also worry about why Yzerman is shopping Bertuzzi around l Maybe not “shopping “ per say , but it has been rumoured for awhile now. Why would the (very good ) GM of a rebuilding team trade away a piece like Bertuzzi? Something is going on behind the scenes with him . The player rubs me the wrong way. Nothing to do with vaccination shit , but rather Wimg fans have their issue with him and are fine moving him.
I pass on Bertuzzi and moving down with him as the main piece for doing so.
If I was Fitz , I stay away from trading with Stevie Y.

Yup, I also said I don't make the trade, I was having fun with the hypothetical.

However, don't sleep on Kasper. He's my #9 prospect for a reason, and clearly NHL scouts see what I do, as the McKenzie poll followed my lead and ranked him at #10. Kasper has a rare combination of elite skating/two-way play/physicality from the center position, and he's also very productive offensively, although not especially dynamic. His intangibles -- hockey IQ and compete -- are as high as any center from the 2022 class. I think he goes to Detroit at #8, setting up a sick 1/2 center combo of Larkin/Kasper for many years to come.

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

I honestly believe we have a good chance of signing Gaudreau.
I wonder if Fitz alters his draft priority with pick #2 if he has a feeling they can sign Johhny? Maybe they would be more likely , or open to tradig down a little and take one of Jiricek or Nemec then if we add an elite winger?

I thimk there’s no way to know for certain enough if Johhny will sign to be able to adjust your drafting plans.

Re: Gaudreau that leads me to believe he could sign here :
1. Wife is pregnant with their first kid. His wife is from the area as well. Having famil and friends around when you have your first child would be massive . Also, I’m sure Johnny and his wife would prefer to have their child born in the US instead of Canada . Amd raise their kid where they grew up too.

2. Gaudreau HATES flying . NJ has kne of the best / least amount of travel in the league. Way more games where they are home vs. in a hotel on the road. This is huge for a new family plus if you hate flying , the less you do that , the better.

3. Close enough to what they consider “home” but maybe not too close. Gives them breathing room for family but yet close enough to plan and make quick trips to visit and help out.

4. Devils habe the cap room ready to go and won’t have to alter their roster to fit him in. Philly would have to get rid of salary to make it work. JVR or very good players like Provorov Seinheim might have to be traded . Philly already has depth issues and not very good prospects coming up and NJ appears to have a better future and promising players. Playing with Hughes or Nico plus old buddy Hamilton would be very appealing .

Only things Phlly has over us is that Hayes is a good friend of his and Johhny grew up a Philly fan I believe.That could be the difference maker but as a grown adult with a new family…. I hope he chooses NJ for the reasons I listed above.

I habe zero clue about the NJ area around where most Devils players live versus the area around Philly where he grew up .
Does one significantly better to live at over the other? Does one have better neighborhoods/ schools / things that are attractive to new families ?

I just think that we have a very good chance to sign him .
With how Fitz last off-season preached family or a brotherhood type atmosphere and building the culture the correct way , makimg promo videos on the area and what it’s like to be a Devils…. I can see that playing a factor in bringing in players……

I only agree with you because I didn't think they had any shot at getting Hamilton who literally had 0 ties to this team. I still can't believe it happened. Johnny G has ties to this area (or at least related enough), and we won't have to blow apart our team to fit him in. Exactly like you wrote.

 

[Guadana]

Ok...I will trade the 2nd pick for Seider. I love that kid. But they really don't have the assets.

In no world is Bertuzzi the center piece for a #2 overall.

If Slaf isn't available, I agree. In any day of the week.

 

[ninetyeight]

Yes, I never said let's just avoid Wright and draft Jiricek (or something like that). My preference is getting an impact player for #2 if Slaf gets picked 1st. Why? Because why go through all those hypotheticals and "figure it out" 5 years later if we can just get an impact player now.

Alright that's fair. The reason I wouldn't do it is that we probably wouldn't get anyone that's elite AND fits our timeline (rfa 25yo or younger). They'd be too expensive, so instead we'd get some 28+ year old elite talent who might be past his prime once Luke and such are starting to hit their peak. But that's just me, I think many here agree with you.

 

[nugg]

If the Devils take Wright and he's unhappy with his role within 3 years, then he comes across as an entitled prick. Falling to NJ would probably be excellent for his career. Immediately takes a ton of pressure off of him and puts him in a much better environment to succeed on a team that should be very good very soon. If he's as good as advertised, you find a way to get him his minutes. He also gets to feast on bottom pairing defensemen.

I know Jordan Staal wasn't crazy about being 3rd line center behind Crosby and Malkin, but he stuck it out 6 seasons and was rewarded with a Cup and two Finals appearances. His stats (particularly goal scoring) were also better in Pittsburgh. He probably also missed out on at least another Cup or two by wanting a bigger role elsewhere.

I watched Shane's combine interview and I really liked how he came across. Very personable, level headed. I doubt highly he would be a malcontent regardless of being relegated to 3rd center (sorry you get pushed down Nico!) or the wing. Plus similarly to Jordan Staal having played with Sid and Gino, he would definitely get to work with Jack and Nico (and Bratt) on special teams if 3rd center. Or playing on the wing of either Jack or Nico would be a plus as well. Having the availability to take over one of the two top lines in case of injury (very good possibility) would be a nice bonus. Depth at the center position can be a real saving grace when faced with losing a top center for a big chunk or a whole season.

I agree, I think the pressure of being a 1st overall in Montreal could be very difficult to put up with, especially if he struggles early, like Jack did. Imagine if Jack had to play there his first year? Talk about being Trautwigged (or JimIVed) (Brutal or a disgrace!)

I really like this kid, though I do prefer Juraj, I would be pleased with Shane too. I am a little concerned about his seemingly stalled development. I doubt he'd ever be another Nolan Patrick though. Right?........ right?

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

Alright that's fair. The reason I wouldn't do it is that we probably wouldn't get anyone that's elite AND fits our timeline (rfa 25yo or younger). They'd be too expensive, so instead we'd get some 28+ year old elite talent who might be past his prime once Luke and such are starting to hit their peak. But that's just me, I think many here agree with you.

Well one thing to consider is that we should be trying to start competing sooner rather than later, not worry about if said acquisition would be too old once Luke hits his peak. Why? Because of Dougie Hamilton. We would just be wasting all those years for essentially nothing otherwise. Ideally we'd have a situation where we can get some slightly older guys who have experience while our young players like Holtz and Luke get used to the NHL and hopefully win a cup. Then the older guys retire and our young prospects then become the veterans and lead the next bunch of young guys. Someone within age range of 27 would be perfect imo. Too many people here think that's too old but I really disagree. We need to get more talent and make use of that Dougie contract.

 

[nugg]

It's easy to win when you know their rankings, but it's a fun game anyway.

And you can also have a little fun by tweaking the "team need" and randomness settings. Trading down and grabbing most of the sleeper candidates, etc.

It seems that 9 times out of 10, Juraj gets picked by MTL.

 

[ninetyeight]

Well one thing to consider is that we should be trying to start competing sooner rather than later, not worry about if said acquisition would be too old once Luke hits his peak. Why? Because of Dougie Hamilton. We would just be wasting all those years for essentially nothing otherwise. Ideally we'd have a situation where we can get some slightly older guys who have experience while our young players like Holtz and Luke get used to the NHL and hopefully win a cup. Then the older guys retire and our young prospects then become the veterans and lead the next bunch of young guys. Someone within age range of 27 would be perfect imo. Too many people here think that's too old but I really disagree. We need to get more talent and make use of that Dougie contract.

The thing with Dougie is he doesn't fit the timeline, but it doesn't really matter since he was a UFA signing. I wouldn't have wanted to give up valuable assets for him, I'm extremely happy we got him for just salary. But I do understand your point, I just think older players are riskier since you're usually paying for past accomplishments, you never know when they start to fade out and you don't know if they want to resign with you. So I'd just rather overpay UFAs and wait for our prospects to develop.

Just out of interest who do you think we could realistically get for 2OA?

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

You do have to wonder....it kinda feels like a situation where Wright will struggle in Montreal but actually do quite well in NJ. Maybe just bias from me haha

Just out of interest who do you think we could realistically get for 2OA?

I honestly have no clue. I know plenty of people are going to be against it, but the only player I trade #2 for is an elite goalie. Trading a high draft pick for an older forward is not very good use of your assets imo. Goalies are ridiculously difficult to scout, project, and develop and on top of that take a long ass time to even see if they're going to be good or not so I think it's worth trading the high pick for an established elite goalie.

 

[Team Concept]

I honestly believe we have a good chance of signing Gaudreau.
I wonder if Fitz alters his draft priority with pick #2 if he has a feeling they can sign Johhny? Maybe they would be more likely , or open to tradig down a little and take one of Jiricek or Nemec then if we add an elite winger?

I thimk there’s no way to know for certain enough if Johhny will sign to be able to adjust your drafting plans.

Re: Gaudreau that leads me to believe he could sign here :
1. Wife is pregnant with their first kid. His wife is from the area as well. Having famil and friends around when you have your first child would be massive . Also, I’m sure Johnny and his wife would prefer to have their child born in the US instead of Canada . Amd raise their kid where they grew up too.

2. Gaudreau HATES flying . NJ has kne of the best / least amount of travel in the league. Way more games where they are home vs. in a hotel on the road. This is huge for a new family plus if you hate flying , the less you do that , the better.

3. Close enough to what they consider “home” but maybe not too close. Gives them breathing room for family but yet close enough to plan and make quick trips to visit and help out.

4. Devils habe the cap room ready to go and won’t have to alter their roster to fit him in. Philly would have to get rid of salary to make it work. JVR or very good players like Provorov Seinheim might have to be traded . Philly already has depth issues and not very good prospects coming up and NJ appears to have a better future and promising players. Playing with Hughes or Nico plus old buddy Hamilton would be very appealing .

Only things Phlly has over us is that Hayes is a good friend of his and Johhny grew up a Philly fan I believe.That could be the difference maker but as a grown adult with a new family…. I hope he chooses NJ for the reasons I listed above.

I habe zero clue about the NJ area around where most Devils players live versus the area around Philly where he grew up .
Does one significantly better to live at over the other? Does one have better neighborhoods/ schools / things that are attractive to new families ?

I just think that we have a very good chance to sign him .
With how Fitz last off-season preached family or a brotherhood type atmosphere and building the culture the correct way , makimg promo videos on the area and what it’s like to be a Devils…. I can see that playing a factor in bringing in players……

Salem, New Jersey is a heck of a lot closer to Philly than the Rock. What makes you think that the Flyers wouldn't make a run out at him?

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

Salem, New Jersey is a heck of a lot closer to Philly than the Rock. What makes you think that the Flyers wouldn't make a run out at him?

Well, players don't always just chase the money. The flyers are pretty much in a really bad state and aren't really going anywhere anytime soon (even with him on the team) and on top of that they'd need to break their team apart even more to fit him. It probably would be a factor in his decision.

 

[Eggtimer]

Salem, New Jersey is a heck of a lot closer to Philly than the Rock. What makes you think that the Flyers wouldn't make a run out at him?

I addressed that in my post.
I never said Philly won’t make him an offer.
And about the location , yes Philly is closer but perhaps him and his wife want to be close to friends and family but not too close lol. Havig people drop in all the time unannounced etc. It’s not perfect but NJ is close enough where it’s not hard to plan a quick visit or rip up there for the day etc.

Yes Philly has the advantage on that but NJ is still very reasonably close compared to other teams, plus we have the cap space , and a very good young promising roster and …. No Torts for a coach .

 

[R8Devs]

Fanduel's odds for the number 2 pick:
Slafkovsky: -172
Wright: +164
Cooley: +790
Nemec: +4000
Jiricek: +4000
Gauthier: +10000

 

[Derps]

Fanduel's odds for the number 2 pick:
Slafkovsky: -172
Wright: +164
Cooley: +790
Nemec: +4000
Jiricek: +4000
Gauthier: +10000

 

[oxman44]

After listening to that great podcast interview Devils in the details posted a couple days ago, I decided to spring for the Hockeyprospect.om Back book. Man what a phenomenal resource. Totally worth it. The scouting reports are great and by far the most in depth anywhere I've ever read. On top of that there are tons of quotes from NHL scouts. sometimes the top prospects had 10 or more. a few things that i thought were very interesting before i head to work,

They did not make a very strong case for Wright. did not like his lack of compete and aggressiveness but still have him at 2. Multiple scouts said he was "too nice" and thought he did not work the inside of the ice hardly at all. Still an insanely high IQ playmaker and top notch shooter though, but a kind of a perimeter player, at least this year.

Despite being so High on most peoples lists, they did not like Gauthier as much, and had him at 16. the surprising thing was how many NHL scouts agreed with that and also did not have him as High as people might think. Cited his lack of consistency and questionable IQ at times.

 

[Unknown Caller]

Pronman’s 7 round mock draft released today has Slafkovsky going 1st to Montreal and Jiricek going 2nd to the Devils. This is all based on what he’s personally been hearing from league sources.

Of course it’s still speculation and he’s been wrong in the past (saying he heard the Devils were taking Makar 1st overall on draft day in 2017).

 

[HBK27]

Pronman’s 7 round mock draft released today has Slafkovsky going 1st to Montreal and Jiricek going 2nd to the Devils. This is all based on what he’s personally been hearing from league sources.

Of course it’s still speculation and he’s been wrong in the past (saying he heard the Devils were taking Makar 1st overall on draft day in 2017).

I'd puke if this happens.

Here's what Pronman wrote:

1. Montreal Canadiens: Juraj Slafkovsky, LW, TPS (FINLAND)

Trying to pin down what Montreal will do with the No. 1 pick has been a challenge. There are quite a few people in the league who believe this pick will be Shane Wright. However, based on discussions with people in the league over the last few weeks, the winds seem to be blowing in the direction of Slafkovsky — to the point that I think this is the slightly more likely scenario at the No. 1 slot.

2. New Jersey Devils: David Jiricek, RHD, Plzen (CZREP)

If the Habs take Wright, I think for the Devils it’s a simple scenario and they take Slafkovsky. If Slafkovsky goes No. 1, it opens up the possibilities. League sources seem somewhat skeptical they will take Wright, or at least they don’t view this as the likeliest scenario. The most common scenario proposed to me for New Jersey with Slafkovsky going first is the Devils taking one of the top two defensemen in Jiricek or Simon Nemec, or trading the pick. Jiricek is the more common name I’ve heard attached to the Devils between the two defensemen.

 

[Saugus]

Pronman’s 7 round mock draft released today has Slafkovsky going 1st to Montreal and Jiricek going 2nd to the Devils. This is all based on what he’s personally been hearing from league sources.

Of course it’s still speculation and he’s been wrong in the past (saying he heard the Devils were taking Makar 1st overall on draft day in 2017).

Well that's bizarre. I would hope we explore trading down if Slafkovsky is gone and Jiricek is our guy. Wright slipping to #3 would be insane and Arizona would be thrilled with that.

 

[HBK27]

Well that's bizarre. I would hope we explore trading down if Slafkovsky is gone and Jiricek is our guy. Wright slipping to #3 would be insane and Arizona would be thrilled with that.

Spoiler alert - he has Cooley going to Arizona and Wright dropping to 4th.

 

[youryeah]

it's fine if they want to pick jiricek (I guesssss...) but trade down a few spots if possible. I would have to imagine some team would want to trade up to 2.

 

[Mgd31]

Pronman’s 7 round mock draft released today has Slafkovsky going 1st to Montreal and Jiricek going 2nd to the Devils. This is all based on what he’s personally been hearing from league sources.

Of course it’s still speculation and he’s been wrong in the past (saying he heard the Devils were taking Makar 1st overall on draft day in 2017).

Would not be surprised by that. Jiricek screams Tom Fitzgerald, whether we like it or not.