Cup and Game 18 Winners vs Trade Winners

[KingsKnight]

Wow, kind of impressed with Kopitar that he'd throw away the patented deke for the shootout and just roofed it. Good win, nice comeback, got the 2 points. Go Kings!

He was channeling Stoll on that one.

 

[King'sPawn]

I would argue that he was never a #6, especially when you are talking Green and McNab and McBain on the team last season.

And I don't hear anyone advocating for Martinez to be moved now. Not a ****ing peep.

Because he's playing better and there aren't better options, unlike last year.

If the Kings managed to keep Sekera, or if Voynov was innocent, then the conversation would be different. But three defensemen earning $4 million+ is manageable.

 

[deeshamrock]

Not sure if the LA feed (which I don't get when the Kings play in PHilly) mentioned it , but on the CSN post game show, they said the disallowed goal would have not counted anyway, that LA was going to use the coaches challenge because the play was offsides.

Good game. Finally Ghost is up on the team and I've been waiting since the Fliyers drafted him for him to get his skates wet. With 2 defensement out for awhile, he'll his minutes.

Quick was great, but the Kings are too much like last year, relying far too much on Quick, Doughty and the Carter line to get the 2 pts on most nights.

 

[KINGS17]

Solid game by Quick.

Kopitar got abused by Giroux though.

 

[KopitarFAN]

Not sure if the LA feed (which I don't get when the Kings play in PHilly) mentioned it , but on the CSN post game show, they said the disallowed goal would have not counted anyway, that LA was going to use the coaches challenge because the play was offsides.

Good game. Finally Ghost is up on the team and I've been waiting since the Fliyers drafted him for him to get his skates wet. With 2 defensement out for awhile, he'll his minutes.

Quick was great, but the Kings are too much like last year, relying far too much on Quick, Doughty and the Carter line to get the 2 pts on most nights.

Bob & Jim never mentioned that, nor did Daryl Evans on postgame, i'll have to watch the replay at 11.

 

[Trolfoli]

I would argue that he was never a #6, especially when you are talking Green and McNab and McBain on the team last season.

And I don't hear anyone advocating for Martinez to be moved now. Not a ****ing peep.

Don't worry... I'm sure Lombardi's looking to add a D by the deadline. That'll get things started up again!

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Don't worry... I'm sure Lombardi's looking to add a D by the deadline. That'll get things started up again!

I'm still looking at St. Louis. Parayko is making Shattenkirk expendable.

 

[deeshamrock]

I'm still looking at St. Louis. Parayko is making Shattenkirk expendable.

Can't see them trading SHattenkirk or another key D in the Conf where it could bite them, esp since there area boatload of teams looking for a d and if SHattenkirk was available, they'd get some decent offers from Eastern Conf teams. Given it's a seller's market, if that were to occur, the Blues could get overpayment, the demand is that great.

And that Phaneuf rumor is still going strong, I hope DL doesn't go that route but I agree, I think he's been looking to upgrade since year.

 

[Fishhead]

Can't see them trading SHattenkirk or another key D in the Conf where it could bite them, esp since there area boatload of teams looking for a d and if SHattenkirk was available, they'd get some decent offers from Eastern Conf teams. Given it's a seller's market, if that were to occur, the Blues could get overpayment, the demand is that great.

And that Phaneuf rumor is still going strong, I hope DL doesn't go that route but I agree, I think he's been looking to upgrade since year.

I think an upgrade is in the back of his mind, but not anything he's actively considering. The team is now 2nd in GA/G, and their SAT% close is at 57.5, nearly 3 points above the 2nd team

It's not like the team is playing creampuffs either, they have one of the lower difficulty schedules going forward. If Forbort keeps progressing, I can see DL making a more serious run at a center, to be honest. Trying to figure out a fit, though. Maybe Boyd Gordon for faceoffs? Most of the upcoming UFA defensmen are either on good teams or will have steep prices. I would love Neilsen, but I expect him to be re-signed. Hudler would be available probably, but really expensive.

I'm not sure how much cap the Kings could save up. Would Gagner be a decent option? I'm not as familiar with how he's been doing in Philly.

 

[cyclones22]

Yep, defensively the team is going fine. More balanced scoring is the issue, but we have a tendency to completely underrate our own defensive and possession dominance because we've seen it at super-elite levels during championship years. Forbort is playing like he should with his development and pedigree. Now we just need Gravel to continue his trajectory and replace Greene next season.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Yep, defensively the team is going fine. More balanced scoring is the issue, but we have a tendency to completely underrate our own defensive and possession dominance because we've seen it at super-elite levels during championship years. Forbort is playing like he should with his development and pedigree. Now we just need Gravel to continue his trajectory and replace Greene next season.

Exactly.

And to add to what Fishhead said, it's tough to find anything that's a true upgrade worth giving up assets for that won't gut another area. Like I said elsewhere, I can't see any d-men available that would be a clear improvement, and the ones that COULD be available (Byfuglien? Shattenkirk/Parayko?) are going to hurt to acquire. A depth C would be great at this point and Boyd Gordon may be an interesting name for faceoffs but I get the feeling the org is just letting these guys ripen.

 

[YP44]

I would argue that he was never a #6, especially when you are talking Green and McNab and McBain on the team last season.

And I don't hear anyone advocating for Martinez to be moved now. Not a ****ing peep.

If we brought in an upgrade on D than I still would be ok moving his contract out. Like A-Mart but if DL is able to secure an upgrade than he would have to go for cap reasons

Edit: Wanted to say great thread name

 

[deeshamrock]

I think an upgrade is in the back of his mind, but not anything he's actively considering. The team is now 2nd in GA/G, and their SAT% close is at 57.5, nearly 3 points above the 2nd team

It's not like the team is playing creampuffs either, they have one of the lower difficulty schedules going forward. If Forbort keeps progressing, I can see DL making a more serious run at a center, to be honest. Trying to figure out a fit, though. Maybe Boyd Gordon for faceoffs? Most of the upcoming UFA defensmen are either on good teams or will have steep prices. I would love Neilsen, but I expect him to be re-signed. Hudler would be available probably, but really expensive.

I'm not sure how much cap the Kings could save up. Would Gagner be a decent option? I'm not as familiar with how he's been doing in Philly.

WHen Gagner came over in the AZ deal, it was assumed he'd get bought out but Hexy ended up keeping him, with (just my opinion) the eye on the trade deadline and getting something back for him.

He's 26, his 3.25 cap is done this year. I've felt since he hit the NHL, he's had confidence issues, for whatever reason and I still see that, his 26% in the faceoff circle this year , to me, is a sign of that, not competing, feeling inferior in the circle. I don't think he has the competive fiesty edge I like in a center. Offensiveliy, he's been okay, 5 pts so far, some games pretty good and career wise, he's at .59 which is decent. He still struggles in puck battles and is (IMO) weak defensively. Having watched ALOT of hockey over the years and a huge huge fan of defensive and 2 way players, I think that is IQ, vision and instinct, he doens't have any of that and that's not the type of thing you learn. I don't see much change in him in that he shies away from hitting, being hit and I don't see him as someone you can count on to step up when needed. Basically, the same stuff he's shown so far. He' s not a kid anymore, he's in his 9th season, this is the player he is and will continue to be.

For a team , a playoff team, looking for scoring depth on wing and not worried about defensive lapses, or reliability there, he'd be a nice fit. But I'm not sure he'd fit in LA , he doesn't seem to fit the mold of what DL likes.

I don't think the Flyers will keep him, they have some young forwards they could bring up next year much cheaper, so I believe he'll be on the block in Feb

 

[Fishhead]

WHen Gagner came over in the AZ deal, it was assumed he'd get bought out but Hexy ended up keeping him, with (just my opinion) the eye on the trade deadline and getting something back for him.

He's 26, his 3.25 cap is done this year. I've felt since he hit the NHL, he's had confidence issues, for whatever reason and I still see that, his 26% in the faceoff circle this year , to me, is a sign of that, not competing, feeling inferior in the circle. I don't think he has the competive fiesty edge I like in a center. Offensiveliy, he's been okay, 5 pts so far, some games pretty good and career wise, he's at .59 which is decent. He still struggles in puck battles and is (IMO) weak defensively. Having watched ALOT of hockey over the years and a huge huge fan of defensive and 2 way players, I think that is IQ, vision and instinct, he doens't have any of that and that's not the type of thing you learn. I don't see much change in him in that he shies away from hitting, being hit and I don't see him as someone you can count on to step up when needed. Basically, the same stuff he's shown so far. He' s not a kid anymore, he's in his 9th season, this is the player he is and will continue to be.

For a team , a playoff team, looking for scoring depth on wing and not worried about defensive lapses, or reliability there, he'd be a nice fit. But I'm not sure he'd fit in LA , he doesn't seem to fit the mold of what DL likes.

I don't think the Flyers will keep him, they have some young forwards they could bring up next year much cheaper, so I believe he'll be on the block in Feb

Thanks. He actually sounds like the anti-King from that description.

Like D-men, the market for centers this year is kind of high end/low end, with little in the middle.

 

[Butch 19]

Quick stole that game.

nice to see the offense score late to bail Quick out for a change.

Quick has saved them plenty over the years.

 

[tsanuri]

Yep, defensively the team is going fine. More balanced scoring is the issue, but we have a tendency to completely underrate our own defensive and possession dominance because we've seen it at super-elite levels during championship years. Forbort is playing like he should with his development and pedigree. Now we just need Gravel to continue his trajectory and replace Greene next season.

I have optimism that the scoring balance will come. We have some players shooting at all time low numbers: Brown, Gaborik, Doughty just to name 3. And even though we have some really hot players on the shooting side in Lucic and Toffoli, who is coming down closer to realistic numbers, the team itself is still low overall at 7.94%. That's about .5% lower than they normally are and just over 1% lower than the league average.

 

[YP44]

Can't see them trading SHattenkirk or another key D in the Conf where it could bite them, esp since there area boatload of teams looking for a d and if SHattenkirk was available, they'd get some decent offers from Eastern Conf teams. Given it's a seller's market, if that were to occur, the Blues could get overpayment, the demand is that great.

And that Phaneuf rumor is still going strong, I hope DL doesn't go that route but I agree, I think he's been looking to upgrade since year.

Depends on the deal IMO. If toronto retains and LA is able to get Dion at <$6m/year I think he could be worthwhile.
Cap would need to go the other way too.

Probably better options out there (one of which is just keep current group)

 

[deeshamrock]

Depends on the deal IMO. If toronto retains and LA is able to get Dion at <$6m/year I think he could be worthwhile.
Cap would need to go the other way too.

Probably better options out there (one of which is just keep current group)

I'm not a fan of PHaneuf so paying him north of 5M until 2021 to me is not worth it.
However, I will say I think he's under too much pressure in Toronto, with another team if he was slotted in the 2nd pairing and didn't have the albatross 'C' on his chest that was an awful decision(he's not a leader and in that town, it's lke being in a pressure cooker) he might be more relaxed and maybe correct some of the errors he continues to make, like penalties.

I think they should trade him, it would allow Gardiner and Rielly to get more minutes and grow their game which I think they have earned.

I don't see Dion as a part of their future, so it would be best to eat part of his cap and trade him, unless they find a team that has a bad contract to exchange it for.

 

[Captain Mittens*]

If Toronto ate half of that contract I would be all over Phaneuf.

Since 2014, we have lost Rehger, Mitchell , and Voynov. We need another top 4 dman and he would be our 3rd best. Think about that...

 

[Buddy The Elf]

It's because he is earning his paycheck this season.

That's because he's been given the opportunity to. It's to no fault of his that the Kings have had glutenous depth on D for the past few years. He now has been thrust into a role that suits his pay grade. He did struggle a bit out of the gate but it's hard to go from being paired with Matt Greene and playing 15 guarded minutes a night to playing on the second pairing the following year. I think he’s held up well. BTW, this post isn't just directed at you, just responding to your comment.

The same can be said for Brayden McNabb who is in his second full season. I think people ought to take a step back and realize that he went from playing on the third pairing for the most part to playing on the top pairing. The guy is going to make mistakes but it’s like some of the people on this board expect no player to ever make a mistake. I think McNabb is well on his way to being a good NHL defender. It’s obviously a work in progress but the glimpses that he shows of what he is capable of are very encouraging especially when you consider he is only 24 years old in his second year. He’s averaging 5 minutes more ice time per game. He's also making <$1M. Food for thought before people get eager to skewer the guy.

Finally, I thought the 3rd and 4th lines held their own last night. I was a bit surprised to see Sutter put the full 3rd and 4th lines out for at least one shift (I think the 3rd got two shifts) down by a goal with less than 5 minutes playing.

 

[tsanuri]

That's because he's been given the opportunity to. It's to no fault of his that the Kings have had glutenous depth on D for the past few years. He now has been thrust into a role that suits his pay grade. He did struggle a bit out of the gate but it's hard to go from being paired with Matt Greene and playing 15 guarded minutes a night to playing on the second pairing the following year. I think he’s held up well. BTW, this post isn't just directed at you, just responding to your comment.

The same can be said for Brayden McNabb who is in his second full season. I think people ought to take a step back and realize that he went from playing on the third pairing for the most part to playing on the top pairing. The guy is going to make mistakes but it’s like some of the people on this board expect no player to ever make a mistake. I think McNabb is well on his way to being a good NHL defender. It’s obviously a work in progress but the glimpses that he shows of what he is capable of are very encouraging especially when you consider he is only 24 years old in his second year. He’s averaging 5 minutes more ice time per game. He's also making <$1M. Food for thought before people get eager to skewer the guy.

Finally, I thought the 3rd and 4th lines held their own last night. I was a bit surprised to see Sutter put the full 3rd and 4th lines out for at least one shift (I think the 3rd got two shifts) down by a goal with less than 5 minutes playing.

I saw something today and didn't save it so not going to go looking but the 3rd line last night held Philly to 0 shot attempts while they had 19. So that is some great work by them. So they earned every bit of ice time they got. I'm sure that type of number had something to do withit.

 

[Captain Mittens*]

I would argue that he was never a #6, especially when you are talking Green and McNab and McBain on the team last season.

And I don't hear anyone advocating for Martinez to be moved now. Not a ****ing peep.

It's because he is earning his paycheck this season.

That's because he's been given the opportunity to. It's to no fault of his that the Kings have had glutenous depth on D for the past few years. He now has been thrust into a role that suits his pay grade. He did struggle a bit out of the gate but it's hard to go from being paired with Matt Greene and playing 15 guarded minutes a night to playing on the second pairing the following year. I think he’s held up well. BTW, this post isn't just directed at you, just responding to your comment.

.

It is partially playing time, but Jazz Hands has been getting better each season. We have good coaches y'all

 

[deeshamrock]

If Toronto ate half of that contract I would be all over Phaneuf.

Since 2014, we have lost Rehger, Mitchell , and Voynov. We need another top 4 dman and he would be our 3rd best. Think about that...

Not going to happen. THe Red Wings wanted him last year and despite the amount of time sthey 'talked' to the Leafs, the sticking point was that the Wings wanted the Leafs to eat 2.5 and that ended that.
THere's no way they retain 3.5 for 6 more years.

 

[YP44]

I'm not a fan of PHaneuf so paying him north of 5M until 2021 to me is not worth it.
However, I will say I think he's under too much pressure in Toronto, with another team if he was slotted in the 2nd pairing and didn't have the albatross 'C' on his chest that was an awful decision(he's not a leader and in that town, it's lke being in a pressure cooker) he might be more relaxed and maybe correct some of the errors he continues to make, like penalties.

I think they should trade him, it would allow Gardiner and Rielly to get more minutes and grow their game which I think they have earned.

I don't see Dion as a part of their future, so it would be best to eat part of his cap and trade him, unless they find a team that has a bad contract to exchange it for.

If Toronto didn't get babcock and Dion was having a pretty dang good season I would agree with you. Remember babcock wanted him in Detroit, so I do not see him being moved out of TO...this year anyway

 

[YP44]

Not going to happen. THe Red Wings wanted him last year and despite the amount of time sthey 'talked' to the Leafs, the sticking point was that the Wings wanted the Leafs to eat 2.5 and that ended that.
THere's no way they retain 3.5 for 6 more years.

I would think that Toronto is even less likely to retain now as they are retaining on Phil. Last year they were not.