Speculation: Coyotes 2021 Offseason Roster Discussion Thread #1

Status
Not open for further replies.

GhostofYotesFan47

Registered User
Jun 16, 2012
4,175
2,105
Phoenix, Arizona USA
Big issue there is how depressed Kreider would be to end up here. How much does he decline if he’s unhappy with the trade?
Neither roster is a world beater, though NY seems more promising currently. We need someone exactly like Kreider (though younger), he's the least expensive acquisition of that type of player I would imagine. We also get NYR's 1st, which could be a lottery pick depending on how their youth progresses. If Kessel and Kreider play well together, I'd even consider extending Kessel at the right price/length.

I also think a lot of people really like Arizona. It's a cool place to live and Scottsdale's name is popping up more and more in pop culture, in a positive light.

Really just looking for options we haven't maybe considered. We seem to be doing the same loop of players.
 

XX

Waiting for Ishbia
Dec 10, 2002
54,965
14,757
PHX
Neither roster is a world beater, though NY seems more promising currently. We need someone exactly like Kreider (though younger), he's the least expensive acquisition of that type of player I would imagine. We also get NYR's 1st, which could be a lottery pick depending on how their youth progresses. If Kessel and Kreider play well together, I'd even consider extending Kessel at the right price/length.

I also think a lot of people really like Arizona. It's a cool place to live and Scottsdale's name is popping up more and more in pop culture, in a positive light.

Really just looking for options we haven't maybe considered. We seem to be doing the same loop of players.

That trade makes you eight years older. It just doesn't work with the timeline the Coyotes are on. Kreider's contract is another Ladd waiting to happen as well.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Coyotedroppings

PainForShane

formerly surfshop
Dec 24, 2019
2,846
3,283
The problem isn't Phil. He'd normally be worth a late first at the deadline to the right team in the right situation, maybe a bit more depending on how the market is for scoring wings and how in love someone is with the idea of Phil. Tampa went in hard on a guy like Savard. It happens.

The problem is that he's older, declining a bit, is not a universal plug-and-play style player, has a full NMC, and is owed bonus money that AZ doesn't want to pay. That means he needs to be shipped out before July, which further limits his market. This is normally a player that would be shuffled off for a pick ala Stepan sometime after FA has settled to fill a need. Can't do that if you want to avoid the bonus.

Retaining on Phil more or less defeats the purpose of the trade as well, so that's out of the window, unless someone blows you away. But why would they? There are lots of scoring wingers out there on the market in trade and in the summer that are easier to fit and digest 5v5. If all you are looking for is mercenary scoring, there's lots for hire.

It's bad timing. And every team in the league will know BA doesn't want to eat that bonus. Once it's paid, that's $4.25m right out of the cash budget for a team that has to be very careful about total cash expenditure, for a player that may or may not even be on the roster.

The 'inverse' of this situation is also true; the Coyotes should not be picky about a return at all if they can better allocate that money.

Agree 100% with the bolded argument up top. But as an aside, need to point out that Savard is actually a good defensive D and I wish we had someone like that.

Either way, see your point about limited leverage, but leverage can be a weird thing. Remember Toronto got a 1st in that Kasperi Kapanen trade even though everyone knew they were up against the cap, if you go back a few years Yzerman somehow got Sergachev for Drouin even after Drouin had held out an entire year (?!). So you never really know. The NMC hurts though but if you look at a perennial playoff contender maybe he might waive.

So, imo we might get value for Kessel IF we want to pursue a trade. Not sure trading a decent offensive player is the best option for a team starved for goals though, why not keep him until next year's deadline and then get a late 1st / 2nd for him. IF we can afford to pay his bonus that is
 

hbk

HFBoards Sponsor
Sponsor
Feb 28, 2002
23,128
9,818
Visit site
Who are the contracts that teams will be including picks for someone to take off their hands?
 

XX

Waiting for Ishbia
Dec 10, 2002
54,965
14,757
PHX
Who are the contracts that teams will be including picks for someone to take off their hands?

Minnesota will want to upgrade on Rask to help shelter Boldy. They would like Schmaltz I'd think. They have an extra first.

Schmaltz makes $3m more cash this year than last, the highest upward ratchet on the team. I have him marked for deletion based on his inconsistent play and his backloaded contract. I would not at all be surprised to see him traded this summer. Problem is the FA market for centers is hot garbage and Hayton isn't ready.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jakey53

GhostofYotesFan47

Registered User
Jun 16, 2012
4,175
2,105
Phoenix, Arizona USA
I also just noticed a NYR/ARZ proposal on the main boards. Dvorak + Crouse for Chytil + Lundkvist. Not sure how I feel about this one. Dvorak for Chytil seems kinda linier though I'm not against it because we flip Crouse for Lundkvist.

Max Pac is another name I have been thinking would be a great add to this roster. Not sure what we would need to give up for him, but a winger like that could be an awesome addition to this roster.
 

GhostofYotesFan47

Registered User
Jun 16, 2012
4,175
2,105
Phoenix, Arizona USA
Minnesota will want to upgrade on Rask to help shelter Boldy. They would like Schmaltz I'd think. They have an extra first.

Schmaltz makes $3m more cash this year than last, the highest upward ratchet on the team. I have him marked for deletion based on his inconsistent play and his backloaded contract. I would not at all be surprised to see him traded this summer. Problem is the FA market for centers is hot garbage and Hayton isn't ready.
Minny also needs to figure out if they are ok potentially losing Saucy to ED. Schmaltz for Dumba is my dream.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MayDayMayDay

GhostofYotesFan47

Registered User
Jun 16, 2012
4,175
2,105
Phoenix, Arizona USA
That trade makes you eight years older. It just doesn't work with the timeline the Coyotes are on. Kreider's contract is another Ladd waiting to happen as well.
It does, it also adds 2 picks in the next 2 years, and gives us an additional bottom 6 center.

I have a hard bias towards Keller though, just never been high on the player and have wanted to move on for a while.
 

rt

Clean Hits on Substack
I also just noticed a NYR/ARZ proposal on the main boards. Dvorak + Crouse for Chytil + Lundkvist. Not sure how I feel about this one. Dvorak for Chytil seems kinda linier though I'm not against it because we flip Crouse for Lundkvist.
I think you'd kinda have to do that trade to get Lundkvist. Hate to lose Dvorak, but Chytil is pretty good. Hate to lose Crouse, too. But gotta pull the trigger for Lundkvist if he's there.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jakey53

RemoAZ

Let it burn
Mar 30, 2010
11,232
7,629
Glendale, Arizona
We need to figure out deals that add to Dvo, not include him in trades. We don't have the center depth in the organization at any level to move Dvo imo.
 

Heldig

Registered User
Apr 12, 2002
17,647
11,341
BC
I think you'd kinda have to do that trade to get Lundkvist. Hate to lose Dvorak, but Chytil is pretty good. Hate to lose Crouse, too. But gotta pull the trigger for Lundkvist if he's there.
I just commented that, too. Even suggested swapping Lundkvist with Schneider would still work.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jakey53

Heldig

Registered User
Apr 12, 2002
17,647
11,341
BC
That kills it for me.
Really? It is closer to value IMO. Chytil is decently close to Dvorak. Both Lundkvist and Schneider are worth a lot more than Crouse. I like Schneider though.

Chychrun - Schneider
OEL - Soderstrom

could be a terrific top 4
 

Sm00chy

Registered User
Sep 29, 2017
883
1,208
Really? It is closer to value IMO. Chytil is decently close to Dvorak. Both Lundkvist and Schneider are worth a lot more than Crouse. I like Schneider though.

Chychrun - Schneider
OEL - Soderstrom

could be a terrific top 4
I think Soderstrom should be in Tucson next year...at least for a portion of the season. Him and Hayton need some more time and Armstrong has used the term "overbake" when referencing prospects. I dont anticipate either of them starting the year on the Yotes roster.
 

Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
30,698
9,556
I think Soderstrom should be in Tucson next year...at least for a portion of the season. Him and Hayton need some more time and Armstrong has used the term "overbake" when referencing prospects. I dont anticipate either of them starting the year on the Yotes roster.
"Overbake" is fine for most prospects, but high end prospects don't need or shouldn't need to be "baked". The way it sounds, Hayton had no business being picked that high, so our expectations of him will have to be adjusted, and BA himself said Soderstrom will have a chance to make our team. I hope both come to training camp and make a big impact.
 

Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
30,698
9,556
We need to figure out deals that add to Dvo, not include him in trades. We don't have the center depth in the organization at any level to move Dvo imo.
If you can get a better C than DVO in a trade why not? Especially if the player is younger and cheaper.
 

Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
30,698
9,556
Really? It is closer to value IMO. Chytil is decently close to Dvorak. Both Lundkvist and Schneider are worth a lot more than Crouse. I like Schneider though.

Chychrun - Schneider
OEL - Soderstrom

could be a terrific top 4
Either D would be interesting.
 

Sm00chy

Registered User
Sep 29, 2017
883
1,208
"Overbake" is fine for most prospects, but high end prospects don't need or shouldn't need to be "baked". The way it sounds, Hayton had no business being picked that high, so our expectations of him will have to be adjusted, and BA himself said Soderstrom will have a chance to make our team. I hope both come to training camp and make a big impact.
One thing I continue to preach is that not every prospect is equal. Just because one Top-5 pick makes an immediate impact doesnt mean the next will do so.

Let me be clear... I would like Hayton to be making an immediate impact, but I certainly am not ready to write him off because he hasnt instantly become a #1C. If the new coaching staff start him down in Tucson and he underperforms I would alter my expectations. But I have no problem with him starting down there...I actually think it could be good for him.
 

Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
30,698
9,556
One thing I continue to preach is that not every prospect is equal. Just because one Top-5 pick makes an immediate impact doesnt mean the next will do so.

Let me be clear... I would like Hayton to be making an immediate impact, but I certainly am not ready to write him off because he hasnt instantly become a #1C. If the new coaching staff start him down in Tucson and he underperforms I would alter my expectations. But I have no problem with him starting down there...I actually think it could be good for him.
Yup, drafting is a crap shoot, and like you said every prospect is different. In my opinion Hayton will never be a 1C, and I think we all have to adjust Hayton's ceiling. Hayton had the chance of a lifetime to make this team last year with our C situation, and yet he could not stick. That was very disappointing.
 

RemoAZ

Let it burn
Mar 30, 2010
11,232
7,629
Glendale, Arizona
If you can get a better C than DVO in a trade why not? Especially if the player is younger and cheaper.
I don't think we've seen the best of Dvo yet. I think a different coach can help him simply by utilizing him better. Plus, trading him for center still leaves us lacking centers. Unless it's in a trade for a young star, I'm not moving Dvo.

Also, we've been rebuilding for a freaking decade. At some point we need to ADD to the few good players we have.
 

Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
30,698
9,556
I don't think we've seen the best of Dvo yet. I think a different coach can help him simply by utilizing him better. Plus, trading him for center still leaves us lacking centers. Unless it's in a trade for a young star, I'm not moving Dvo.

Also, we've been rebuilding for a freaking decade. At some point we need to ADD to the few good players we have.
We missed the playoffs, so there will be changes, and in my opinion not one player is untouchable, and that includes Chychrun. We probably have a few players that are close to untouchable and BA will add to those, but you never know what offers will be presented.
 

Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
30,698
9,556
Have a feeling Armstrong will be talking to Hamilton based on his comments about filling some holes on the back end via Free Agency.

Also mentioned our budget will be rising
The only way we look at Hamilton is if we move OEL, other than that, it's wishful thinking. Also, why is Hamilton traded so often? I heard our budget will be increasing but weren't we near the cap last year?
 

Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
30,698
9,556
Have a feeling Armstrong will be talking to Hamilton based on his comments about filling some holes on the back end via Free Agency.

Also mentioned our budget will be rising
I wonder if BA means cap space?:dunno:
 
  • Like
Reactions: RABBIT
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad