Confirmed with Link: Coleman to Tampa Bay for 1st and Nolan Foote

StevenToddIves

Registered User
May 18, 2013
11,087
28,038
Brooklyn, NY
Considering what Toronto gave up to dump Marleau, that's not a completely unreasonable proposal.

I wasn't kidding or being sarcastic. I think with the Coleman trade, there's just not much of a chance of Boston getting past Tampa in a 7 game series. They certainly aren't doing it with no secondary scoring, especially now with a Cirelli-Coleman combo capable of shutting down their top line. And it's common knowledge that the Bruins can't afford another impact player under the cap unless they unload the Backes contract. Therefore, it's going to cost them. The notion held by uninformed Boston fans that the Bruins will be able to (in one fell swoop) unload the Backes contract, get an impact scorer like Palmieri and not give much of value away -- well, it's just bonkers.

It's still uncertain whether Palmieri gets traded at the deadline, there's no absolute imperative for the Devils to do so. But if he does? It's most likely going to be to a team like Edmonton or Colorado -- both of whom have better assets to trade and more cap room to play with than the Boston Bruins.
 

StevenToddIves

Registered User
May 18, 2013
11,087
28,038
Brooklyn, NY
I am laughing at the reactions of Bolts fans over there.

Pickles is going to be a very good pickup for them but to see them rage over giving up too much makes it worthwhile. :laugh:

Coleman is going to be a huge fan favorite in Tampa, and I can't wait to see him tear it up in the playoffs. He's just an impact player every time he hits the ice.
 

Blender

Registered User
Dec 2, 2009
52,638
46,403
One of the best posts of the year:
Value of: - Kyle Palmieri and Blake Coleman

I love that it took all of 3 days for this to get exposed.
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Forge

Blissfully Mediocre
Jul 4, 2018
13,232
16,461
Vincent Clortho School for wizards
Devils draft Bill Guerin 5th overall in 1989. Trade Guerin in 1998 to Edmonton for Jason Arnott. Devils trade Arnott with Randy McKay to Dallas in 2002 for Nieuwendyk and Jamie Langenbrunner. Devils trade Jamie Langenbrunner back to Dallas in 2011 for 3rd round pick. That pick was Blake Coleman. And now that long ago 1989 draft pick is Nolan Foote and 2020 1st Rounder.

This is pretty amazing.

The other side note I always like to bring up with the Arnott trade was that he came with Bryan Muir. Muir was eventually moved for a third round pick which became Mike Rupp. So basically, both of the pieces that we acquired for Guerin ended up scoring series clinching, game winning goals in the stanley cup finals for us :D
 

PKs Broken Stick

Registered User
Oct 9, 2008
9,717
5,122
I find it hard to believe this. I'll agree that the coaching held them back, but this pile of garbage is miles and miles away from being a complete team, much less even being a legit playoff team.

To say 'goaltending' when MB29 has been truly exceptional this season is pretty ridiculous -

Uh...did you forget about the beginning of the season? He wasn't that good. Miles better than Schneider but nowhere near as good as how he's been post Hynes.
 

billingtons ghost

Registered User
Nov 29, 2010
10,701
7,090
Mack has been exceptional since Hynes was fired (20 starts, 11-5-4 .925 SV% 2.51 GAA), but was was pretty bad the first two months. He had a .896 SV% and 3.17 GAA in 18 starts when Hynes was fired. If you're going to evaluate the season as a whole you have to weigh the good as heavily as the bad.

Schenider and Domingue - who have combined for nearly 40% of the starts this season - are guys struggling even at the AHL level.

It's ridiculous to say that a very good 30% of the season by one goalie outweighs the garbage goaltending we've gotten the other 70% of the season.

You're pointing at SV%. That has nothing to do with quality of the shots.

You alluded to the difference in your own post - the defense got markedly better after Nas stopped them from chasing people into the corners. It still sucks (evidence by 52 shots on goal).

My point is - to say "we would have been a bubble team if only we got better than atrocious goaltending" is absurd. The quality of goaltending hasn't changed, just the quality of shots against has.

Obviously, that's why Domingue can post an 11 game win streak in Tampa whilst being a mediocre goalie but he gets his ass torn out here.

MB29 has been what he is - a good, athletic goaltender. But if they kept Hynes he would've ended the season with a sub .900 SV% and/or on the IR.
 

billingtons ghost

Registered User
Nov 29, 2010
10,701
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Uh...did you forget about the beginning of the season? He wasn't that good. Miles better than Schneider but nowhere near as good as how he's been post Hynes.

The beginning of the season he was fine. The Hynes-system defense in front of him was attrocious and the defensive personnel was bad. Now, just the personnel is bad but at least Nas has the defensemen being less aggressive in the corners and the forwards are doing a better job of knowing where they should be. We still have puckwatching disasters nightly, but it's been marginally better. Now we're just a bad team instead of a complete tire fire.
 

billingtons ghost

Registered User
Nov 29, 2010
10,701
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Wait what? How would Vasilevskiy be garbage from that logic? His stats were considerably better than Domingues last year even despite that record.

All I’m saying is that, even with our porous defense, getting halfway decent goaltending out of anyone else with Blackwood would put us closer to the bubble. Pretty sure you would agree with that, no one is saying it’s make our team a contender. Especially with how much of a bloodbath the Metro is this year.

The defense, of course, needs work.

Fair enough - my point was mostly that the poor saps that have played for us (including Domingue) aren't BAD goalies (except for maybe poor Cory who is a long term victim of our D) - just that under Hynes's system it was a complete train wreck - with us making the worst of our pretty bad personnel on D; and now under Nas, everyone looks a little better.

Louis on Tampa this year would probably still have an 11 game win streak like he did last year - I doubt that it was his play that 'dropped off a cliff' - more like it was pushed off by our D. Even Louis played some pretty good back-to-backs against WSH/TB this year.

The difference is, MB29 is really quite good and the others are just mediocre.
 

glenwo2

JESPER BRATWURST
Oct 18, 2008
52,564
25,125
New Jersey(No Fanz!)
So in essence, the Devils now have two First-Round players from this past draft :

Hughes(#1) and Foote(#27) - Cannot state this enough as it never really hit me until now.

And add the picks we are getting in the first round (3 possibly, if the Canucks do their job and get into the playoffs, then be one and done), and we're golden.
 
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haak84

Registered User
Oct 18, 2017
4,144
2,313
Coleman was a late bloomer and got better every year he played. Not sure when that stops? Hopefully he's a 35-40 goal scorer by the end of next season and get handsomely rewarded in free agency. Plus he's going to kill it in the playoffs. So happy for him.
 

Whaddagoal

The Sheldon Keefe Era Begins
Nov 28, 2005
12,259
10,958
New Jersey
Coleman is an awesome player and we got some hell of a return for him.

I understand why Fitz made the move with that kind of return available, but I don't like it and i feel its just one of those triggers you don't pull.

Coleman is the type of player (to me) that you keep always in your core. He's one of those foundational core glue players. In a way he was like a younger Zajac with a slightly shaken mix of skills with more energy.

With that said, Coleman will always have a home with NJ fans. Don't know if we will see him back here in a few years, but... He was consistency good and improving each season.... We'll miss him as fans for sure.

Feel real gutted still that we are taking so many steps back as a team for the near future.
 

ninetyeight

Registered User
Jun 3, 2007
2,092
3,124
Finland
Feel real gutted still that we are taking so many steps back as a team for the near future.

The way I see it, is we’ve been going in the wrong direction for the past few years, and are now finally taking steps back to get back on the right track.

If the team as a whole is not competitive it’s a waste to have someone in their prime play here. So in that sense it’s the right call to transform that skill in to future success.

I get that rebuilding is tough and it’s not fun to watch games if we don’t win. But for me personally the bubble team years were the worst. Just to miss the playoffs or exit in the first round, while not being improve the team is brutal. If I can’t have success right away, I rather have potential and a bright future instead of just being average with no progress.
 

MachoDiablo

Registered User
Mar 12, 2012
1,400
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Jersey City
The way I see it, is we’ve been going in the wrong direction for the past few years, and are now finally taking steps back to get back on the right track.

If the team as a whole is not competitive it’s a waste to have someone in their prime play here. So in that sense it’s the right call to transform that skill in to future success.

I get that rebuilding is tough and it’s not fun to watch games if we don’t win. But for me personally the bubble team years were the worst. Just to miss the playoffs or exit in the first round, while not being improve the team is brutal. If I can’t have success right away, I rather have potential and a bright future instead of just being average with no progress.
Pretty much; Lou's tenure ended in large part because he was always trying to patch things up rather than engage in a rebuild, which was feasible while Marty was still strong but not so much once he faded, and Shero had a hard time getting a rebuild going in earnest due to the lack of resources the Devils had to deal that might've netted him some extra first rounders or prospects. He did seem to kind of attempt a background rebuild (e.g. last year's draft having so many picks in it) but would also try and keep the team competitive through a lot of his trades, and while I never knocked the deals he made given how much sense it made to get guys like Hall, Palmieri, and Vatanen for the relatively low costs they came at, it didn't change that the organization still lacked young depth to draw from, despite getting lucky on the Nico and Hughes lotteries.

Someone made a great post earlier about how the best teams in the East all seem to have strong homegrown cores that they then augmented with smart deals and signings (e.g. adding Kessel a few years back to the Crosby/Malkin/Letang core), and while the Devils put together some decent talent it felt like we were trying to build a core out of those trades instead of having them supplement a preexisting, internal one. That's just not as much of a formula for long term success, so I'm glad to see the organization deciding it needs to really get serious about it. On the bright side, Shero's trades did leave us guys who could net those high level draft picks in trades, so it's definitely helping that part along.
 

NJDevs26

Once upon a time...
Mar 21, 2007
68,533
34,108
The way I see it, is we’ve been going in the wrong direction for the past few years, and are now finally taking steps back to get back on the right track.

If the team as a whole is not competitive it’s a waste to have someone in their prime play here. So in that sense it’s the right call to transform that skill in to future success.

I get that rebuilding is tough and it’s not fun to watch games if we don’t win. But for me personally the bubble team years were the worst. Just to miss the playoffs or exit in the first round, while not being improve the team is brutal. If I can’t have success right away, I rather have potential and a bright future instead of just being average with no progress.

How many real ‘bubble team’ years have we had since 2012 though?

2013 - 9th overall pick
2014 - 10th overall (albeit bounced to 30 cause of Lou and Kovy)
2015 - 6th overall pick
2016 - 11th overall pick
2017 - 1st overall pick
2019 - 1st overall pick
2020 - top five pick

The only ‘borderline’ team seasons you could really argue were the season we actually MADE the playoffs, and the shootout of doom year (2013-14) where we weren’t getting a top pick regardless. Maybe 2015-16. I don’t consider top ten picks borderline team in limbo.
 

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