Confirmed with Link: Cole Perfetti signed 2X 3.25AAV

[LowLefty]

Define "physical"

As long as a guy who is 6'0 180lbs has good body position and takes away pass lanes with his stick, he's more than big enough to defend successfully at the NHL level. Some of the best all time have been around that size including Bourque, Coffey, Lidstrom, etc.

He's bigger than Toby was, and he was a great puck retrieval/1st pass guy

IMO, there's more to it than that - although that's part of it.
I like dmen that can take grind out a play along the wall or behind the net, take them out of the play, or move them out of center ice areas -
I think you need more than 180 lbs to do that - unless that 180 is all physical.

We can list players that were the exception as if this player is also the exception - and you've listed some dandies - is that the level you see Ville at?
Personally, if he were one of those exceptions, He'd likely have been on the roster yrs ago.

I do agree that the 180 lb player is likely better than the "big plug" - but most players are.

 

[Buffdog]

IMO, there's more to it than that - although that's part of it.
I like dmen that can take grind out a play along the wall or behind the net, take them out of the play, or move them out of center ice areas -
I think you need more than 180 lbs to do that - unless that 180 is all physical.

We can list players that were the exception as if this player is also the exception - and you've listed some dandies - is that the level you see Ville at?
Personally, if he were one of those exceptions, He'd likely have been on the roster yrs ago.

I do agree that the 180 lb player is likely better than the "big plug" - but most players are.b

So maybe we should have waited to see if Heinola had the requisite size to defend at the NHL level before calling him too small?

I'd also point out that he had no problem defending at the AHL level, which is also a man's league. If size were an issue, it would likely would have shown itself there

Earlier in his career, I'd have agreed that he needed to grow and mature physically... which he has. At this point he's 23 years old

 

[LowLefty]

So maybe we should have waited to see if Heinola had the requisite size to defend at the NHL level before calling him too small?

I'd also point out that he had no problem defending at the AHL level, which is also a man's league. If size were an issue, it would likely would have shown itself there

Earlier in his career, I'd have agreed that he needed to grow and mature physically... which he has. At this point he's 23 years old

This is an old debate and I have no issue rehashing it - but honestly, Ville is not a physical player where ever he has played - and absolutely not in any of the NHL games he has played.
He has stated himself that he had to add some weight and strength to his game to reduce the number of times he was run over in the NHL - we're still waiting to see if he achieved that goal - hopefully he did.

 

[surixon]

So maybe we should have waited to see if Heinola had the requisite size to defend at the NHL level before calling him too small?

I'd also point out that he had no problem defending at the AHL level, which is also a man's league. If size were an issue, it would likely would have shown itself there

Earlier in his career, I'd have agreed that he needed to grow and mature physically... which he has. At this point he's 23 years old

Agreed, but unfortunately he's likely going to have to wait for an injury on e he's healthy to show us what he can do.

This is an old debate and I have no issue rehashing it - but honestly, Ville is not a physical player where ever he has played - and absolutely not in any of the NHL games he has played.
He has stated himself that he had to add some weight and strength to his game to reduce the number of times he was run over in the NHL - we're still waiting to see if he achieved that goal - hopefully he did.

Maybe not at the NHL level but I've seen enough AHL games to say he plays with a chip on his shoulder at that level. To me ita always been a lack of confidence at the NHL level which as lead to him playing timid.

 

[LowLefty]

Maybe not at the NHL level but I've seen enough AHL games to say he plays with a chip on his shoulder at that level. To me ita always been a lack of confidence at the NHL level which as lead to him playing timid.

Maybe, who knows - but up to this point, he has not shown it at the NHL level so until he does, I'll stick with what I know.
The NHL is not the AHL - much stronger, faster, and heavier - I'm sure Ville would agree

 

[surixon]

Maybe, who knows - but up to this point, he has not shown it at the NHL level so until he does, I'll stick with what I know.
The NHL is not the AHL - much stronger, faster, and heavier - I'm sure Ville would agree

Not disagreeing, if he's not able to find that game he won't have a career as anything more then a tweener. The clock is ticking on him and he's had some setbacks at the absolute worst times.

 

[gojetsgo]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1838645605750526031

 

[surixon]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1838645605750526031

He was already good at shielding pucks. This should definitely help more with that and with his board play.

 

[TS Quint]

I like dmen who are able to make an outlet pass. Failed zone exits and the resulting counterattack is one of the major things that killed us vs the Avs

I'll take an averaged sized puck mover over a big plug any day

And I'll also pass on signing 35 year olds to 3 year deals

What killed us against the Avs was we couldn’t get the puck back. Our defense couldn’t handle strong players like Nuke, McKinnon and Rantenen. We also let them screen Hellebuyck because these little fellas couldn’t move them.

Heinola’s “transition game” is the biggest misunderstanding of what Heinola does. He’s bad at it. He’s bad at it because transition starts with getting the puck back from the other team, he doesn’t do that.

Why does the larger guy have to be a plug? Dillon wasn’t a plug. Is a Samberg a plug?

The Stars rolling out Heiskenen 6’2, Lindell 6’3, Harley 6’4, Tanev 6’2 seemed to do much better against the Avs.

It’s not that you can’t be good as a 6foot 190lbs player. But as a team you need to mix in some size. 5 of the same guy isn’t going to give you everything you need in a team. We have Samberg…..Stanley playing 14 minutes for 25 games ain’t going to do it. Make no mistake the Jets are undersized and it’s a real problem when the games matter.

 

[Buffdog]

What killed us against the Avs was we couldn’t get the puck back. Our defense couldn’t handle strong players like Nuke, McKinnon and Rantenen. We also let them screen Hellebuyck because these little fellas couldn’t move them.

Heinola’s “transition game” is the biggest misunderstanding of what Heinola does. He’s bad at it. He’s bad at it because transition starts with getting the puck back from the other team, he doesn’t do that.

Why does the larger guy have to be a plug? Dillon wasn’t a plug. Is a Samberg a plug?

The Stars rolling out Heiskenen 6’2, Lindell 6’3, Harley 6’4, Tanev 6’2 seemed to do much better against the Avs.

It’s not that you can’t be good as a 6foot 190lbs player. But as a team you need to mix in some size. 5 of the same guy isn’t going to give you everything you need in a team. We have Samberg…..Stanley playing 14 minutes for 25 games ain’t going to do it. Make no mistake the Jets are undersized and it’s a real problem when the games matter.

Jets are undersized? Care to do a quick "NHL teams ranked by average size" search? You'll be enlightened about where they rank

Please go watch the series again. Notice all the uncontrolled zone exits that lead to re-entries

Also, do some learning about how NHL teams defend in 2024. Not a single one moves players out from the front of the net like they did in 1986. Lots don't even put a D in front of the net because it's another body for the goalie to have to try to see around/through

 

[LowLefty]

Jets are undersized? Care to do a quick "NHL teams ranked by average size" search? You'll be enlightened about where they rank

Please go watch the series again. Notice all the uncontrolled zone exits that lead to re-entries

Also, do some learning about how NHL teams defend in 2024. Not a single one moves players out from the front of the net like they did in 1986. Lots don't even put a D in front of the net because it's another body for the goalie to have to try to see around/through

There's a balance there that you also alluded to -
I agree the uncontrolled exits were hard to watch and super frustrating - buy you still need to strip pucks and take the man before that process of exiting even starts. There is no doubt that Ville can move the puck - the question is on possession and if he is ready to take it away from someone.

We always seem to talk in terms of what we are missing - and that's fair. But we need to understand all facets that lead up to the nice pass on the exit.
What we watched LY was panic via exhaustion - if you spend 30 seconds or more in our end chasing,, trying to retrieve pucks, odds are the outlet will not be pretty. At that point, they just want to go to get it out and go to the bench. The part that was missing was the ability to regain possession sooner and make a play with some composure.

 

[surixon]

What killed us against the Avs was we couldn’t get the puck back. Our defense couldn’t handle strong players like Nuke, McKinnon and Rantenen. We also let them screen Hellebuyck because these little fellas couldn’t move them.

Heinola’s “transition game” is the biggest misunderstanding of what Heinola does. He’s bad at it. He’s bad at it because transition starts with getting the puck back from the other team, he doesn’t do that.

Why does the larger guy have to be a plug? Dillon wasn’t a plug. Is a Samberg a plug?

The Stars rolling out Heiskenen 6’2, Lindell 6’3, Harley 6’4, Tanev 6’2 seemed to do much better against the Avs.

It’s not that you can’t be good as a 6foot 190lbs player. But as a team you need to mix in some size. 5 of the same guy isn’t going to give you everything you need in a team. We have Samberg…..Stanley playing 14 minutes for 25 games ain’t going to do it. Make no mistake the Jets are undersized and it’s a real problem when the games matter.

There's a balance there that you also alluded to -
I agree the uncontrolled exits were hard to watch and super frustrating - buy you still need to strip pucks and take the man before that process of exiting even starts. There is no doubt that Ville can move the puck - the question is on possession and if he is ready to take it away from someone.

We always seem to talk in terms of what we are missing - and that's fair. But we need to understand all facets that lead up to the nice pass on the exit.
What we watched LY was panic via exhaustion - if you spend 30 seconds or more in our end chasing,, trying to retrieve pucks, odds are the outlet will not be pretty. At that point, they just want to go to get it out and go to the bench. The part that was missing was the ability to regain possession sooner and make a play with some composure.

Lots of things happened that playoffs. One other thing is that our dmen gave up the line far too often because our forwards weren't or couldn't provide the required back pressure to allow our d to gap and force dump ins. Much easier to emerge with the puck when you can retrieve it first.

Much easier for the opposition to maintain possesion and wear a team out is if they can skate the puck into the zone and set up.

 

[Joe Hallenback]

The AVs also fell of the face of the earth after coke fueled Nuke was suspended

 

[Jack7222]

Jets are undersized? Care to do a quick "NHL teams ranked by average size" search? You'll be enlightened about where they rank

Please go watch the series again. Notice all the uncontrolled zone exits that lead to re-entries

Also, do some learning about how NHL teams defend in 2024. Not a single one moves players out from the front of the net like they did in 1986. Lots don't even put a D in front of the net because it's another body for the goalie to have to try to see around/through

This is what I saw as well. Avs pressed hard with speed and skill and we didn't have enough people on the backend who could cope with that and make a play. Just Morrissey really.

There's a reason Morrissey was the only Jet above water in expected goal %, and one of only two (him and Connor) in gf%. Morrissey isn't a big netfront clearer.

With everyone else, Avs would press, we'd mishandle a little bit, introduce a little chaos into our game, and that would compound until Avs were just all over us. The few times we managed to get the puck into their end (when it wasn't a dump in) it was usually a faster player for a one-and-done chance, because in most of the games Avs just became too organized and comfortable on the back of our panic.

 

[TS Quint]

Jets are undersized? Care to do a quick "NHL teams ranked by average size" search? You'll be enlightened about where they rank

Please go watch the series again. Notice all the uncontrolled zone exits that lead to re-entries

Also, do some learning about how NHL teams defend in 2024. Not a single one moves players out from the front of the net like they did in 1986. Lots don't even put a D in front of the net because it's another body for the goalie to have to try to see around/through

You’re pretty arrogant LMAO! What kind of clown reply is this?

I never said the Jets are undersized. But I guess you need a straw man to inflate that ego of yours.

Just because zone exits were bad doesn’t mean what I said wasn’t true. That’s like saying because the sky is blue the grass isn’t green. You’re basically just making things up to be upset about.

You clearly don’t watch playoff hockey. The front of the net is plenty physical and so are the boards. You might want to consider why things went so well all year and why things changed in the playoffs. Playoff hockey is different.

You basically ignored or didn’t comprehend what I said and made things up.

 

[TS Quint]

Lots of things happened that playoffs. One other thing is that our dmen gave up the line far too often because our forwards weren't or couldn't provide the required back pressure to allow our d to gap and force dump ins. Much easier to emerge with the puck when you can retrieve it first.

Much easier for the opposition to maintain possesion and wear a team out is if they can skate the puck into the zone and set up.

There was definitely a huge problem with the Jets at their own blue line.

 

[Buffdog]

You’re pretty arrogant LMAO! What kind of clown reply is this?

I never said the Jets are undersized. But I guess you need a straw man to inflate that ego of yours.

Just because zone exits were bad doesn’t mean what I said wasn’t true. That’s like saying because the sky is blue the grass isn’t green. You’re basically just making things up to be upset about.

You clearly don’t watch playoff hockey. The front of the net is plenty physical and so are the boards. You might want to consider why things went so well all year and why things changed in the playoffs. Playoff hockey is different.

You basically ignored or didn’t comprehend what I said and made things up.

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