Coaching is a serious problem.

[FerrisRox]

Telling you, Lemaire would be my solution. Just clog the middle of the ice, make them hard to play against. And it's easy to learn and execute for the kids. And if guys like Dach who are lost and cannot score goals, they could at least play defense properly, take their men. Just freaking do it. Hughes pride himself to be bold and innovative well that would be freaking bold.

Yeah, hiring a 79-year old man to coach would definitely be bold.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

I come in here and see more and more people realizing/accepting it and I'm liking it.

Next you'll start to question Hughes/Gorton if you haven't already.

 

[Paddyjack]

Vincent should have been the coach of this team. At least the next one. The guy learned 10 years in the school of coaching from Paul Maurice.

At this point, if Vincent replaces Marty I feel bad for the Rocket.

 

[morhilane]

I think the young guys are starving for leadership. Remember when the Habs had Price, Weber, Chariot, Toffolli, Gallagher, Perry, Staal, Edmundson, Allen and compare that to the guys we have now...it ain't pretty

You forgot Monahan.

This year, only Gallagher is left and apparently Evans took a step too. But I don't think anyone looks up to them.

The other 'A' on the team is Matheson, and I have on idea why he has a 'A'.

 

[Tyson]

You forgot Monahan.

This year, only Gallagher is left and apparently Evans took a step too. But I don't think anyone looks up to them.

The other 'A' on the team is Matheson, and I have on idea why he has a 'A'.

Monahan I agree is sorely missed.

 

[Rapala]

I don't think hugo have any intention to fire msl at this particular stage in the game.

Maybe if some corporate stakeholders start ringing the alarm, then I suppose molson might start applying some heat downhill, but otherwise, I expect msl will have his share of time to try and figure things out as we move along.

Full blown rebuilds are ugly, particularly when you don't have the luxury to draft a mcdavid or Crosby.... and even with mcdavid it's been far more ugly than it should be.

He doesn't.
But some kind of message has to come out of that front office soon because he'll need some kind of support.
He's losing his touch with a doubting media and that is never good in this market.
As much as a coach has to have his player's backs management has to have their coaching staff's back.
I'm talking about an action item and not just simple platitudes.

 

[Rapala]

Monahan I agree is sorely missed.

Yeah it was serious wishful thinking Kirby could come in and take on that type of role based on a small sample that didn't run the full course.

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

At this point, if Vincent replaces Marty I feel bad for the Rocket.

Let the Rockets be a winning team for a full year before replacing Marty by Pascal. So Habs will draft soon and the Rocket will build a winning culture.

 

[Rapala]

Let the Rockets be a winning team for a full year before replacing Marty by Pascal. So Habs will draft soon and the Rocket will build a winning culture.

Here is the deal for me.
We are still a year or two away from stock piling enough talent to supply both teams.
Depending on how HuGo want to play their cards going forward I'm not adverse to having another rookie or two come in and play games in the NHL.
We should start seeing more transactions by the end of November as teams decipher their needs.
It looks to me like we should be selling everything that isn't tied down.
I think we need to shake up the top so no one should be untouchable.
One thing is certain in my mind we have to start building a much stronger trench tested support group for the players coming down the pipe.

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

Here is the deal for me.
We are still a year or two away from stock piling enough talent to supply both teams.
Depending on how HuGo want to play their cards going forward I'm not adverse to having another rookie or two come in and play games in the NHL.
We should start seeing more transactions by the end of November as teams decipher their needs.
It looks to me like we should be selling everything that isn't tied down.
I think we need to shake up the top so no one should be untouchable.
One thing is certain in my mind we have to start building a much stronger trench tested support group for the players coming down the pipe.

I agree. I'm a free electron and I think no one is untouchable. I am not in a sect and I am open for anything to change the direction.

 

[Yoor]

Please tell me how sticking with SmartyMarty for the rest of the season will develop players?

His brilliant talent transfer?

Teaching his brilliant systems?

Learning how to win by losing?

HOW is losing with a lousy coach good for young players who are desperate to learn and take it to the next level?

Asking for a Sabres friend...

You can tell that the players are not into whatever is being asked and it seems to me that outside of maybe Gally no one is buying in. So have the players tuned out the coach or just don't like the "system" since it doesn't seem to play to anyone's strengths. Either way a loser culture is creeping in and that's a dangerous thing with so many young players that are supposed to be developing not regressing. How long does management keep this going? How long do we watch the coach shake his head behind the bench? I'm sure the players appreciate that. Let's hope it doesn't get toxic...and we wonder why free agents don't want to play here.

 

[Tyson]

Vincent should have been the coach of this team. At least the next one. The guy learned 10 years in the school of coaching from Paul Maurice.

%

 

[nhlfan9191]

Vincent should have been the coach of this team. At least the next one. The guy learned 10 years in the school of coaching from Paul Maurice.

I imagine he was hired on the basis of having somebody ready if needed. I think he will be the next head coach of our team. It’s just a matter of when you make that switch.

 

[FerrisRox]

You forgot Monahan.

This year, only Gallagher is left and apparently Evans took a step too. But I don't think anyone looks up to them.

The other 'A' on the team is Matheson, and I have on idea why he has a 'A'.

You are completely out to lunch if you don't think players in that locker room look up to Brendan Gallagher.

 

[morhilane]

You are completely out to lunch if you don't think players in that locker room look up to Brendan Gallagher.

I'm talking about what I'm seeing. Gally was apparently yelling at his bench last night and it doesn't appear it had any effect on the team. His playing hard with Evans since the season started and nobody else on the roster is following.

 

[morhilane]

Yeah it was serious wishful thinking Kirby could come in and take on that type of role based on a small sample that didn't run the full course.

I personally think Monahan's leadership is more missed than his play on the ice. Monahan was on the 3rd line quite a bit at the start of the season.

Which is actually the scary part, the players who played top 6 for half the season last year when they were a top 5v5 team are all still with the Habs...

 

[Draft]

There’s nothing wrong with using a hybrid system. Right now, the team lacks confidence and has players in roles they need to grow into. They either learn now or blow it later.

I’m okay if this team struggles and takes time to learn how to play a more optimal defensive system. I’m good with watching guys like Slafkovsky, Dach, Hutson, Barron, and Newhook have ups and downs as they try to establish themselves in bigger roles.

If we get to the end of the season and we see consistency on defence and growth in our players, this period of hard-to-watch hockey will have laid the foundation for future success better than any dinosaur coach or reactionary trade. I’m good with bringing in a vet to provide some support, but I think we stay the course here and see who rises to the occasion.

 

[shenmue16]

There’s nothing wrong with using a hybrid system. Right now, the team lacks confidence and has players in roles they need to grow into. They either learn now or blow it later.

I’m okay if this team struggles and takes time to learn how to play a more optimal defensive system. I’m good with watching guys like Slafkovsky, Dach, Hutson, Barron, and Newhook have ups and downs as they try to establish themselves in bigger roles.

If we get to the end of the season and we see consistency on defence and growth in our players, this period of hard-to-watch hockey will have laid the foundation for future success better than any dinosaur coach or reactionary trade. I’m good with bringing in a vet to provide some support, but I think we stay the course here and see who rises to the occasion.

you can do this kind of system with players who are experienced and have high hockey IQ. On a team with higher level of talent, it would probably work decently. However, it's obvious that there are some massive gaps. Now, against every single team you're going to have certain things that work and certain things that don't work. The issue with MSL's coaching is that he's finding his team's identity and learning how to do his job on the fly, instead of already having hands-on experience. MSL can't adapt his system to evolve and respond to the challenges of teams and their different systems. A few nights ago, the defense was getting beaten on the counter-attack and unable to get back into their zone quick enough to stop the offense. Now, the logical thing to do is get your defenders to play a few steps back and try to not run the offense through them (when they're being dispossessed and turning the puck over). That doesn't seem to happen as much as it should. The team can't adapt to the game and just gets beaten over and over on the same dumb types of plays.
Along with this, your team has to learn how to bounce back and play with more confidence after you lose like this. Since that game against the Flyers (where they allowed 2 garbage goals in the 3rd), they just have lacked any consistency and they've been wallowing in their own mediocrity. MSL has no idea how to get them out of this stretch. That punitive practice did absolutely nothing for this team, and the game last night just showed that this squad has just absolutely given up. The short-handed goal along with the end of the second were really embarrassing to watch. The defense was just completely swimming at the end and Matheson basically left the team on a power play because he was just standing around. He's become a liability to the team at this point, but MSL is refusing to sit him while at the same time benching Arber. The whole "I'm alright with this season as a learning experience" thinking is valid, but quickly becomes invalid when you see that almost every player from last year has taken a huge step back. MSL isn't going to develop talent in the way that they need him to, nor can he win games by coaching alone. He's got two assistants with no NHL head-coaching coaching experience.

 

[Rapala]

I'm talking about what I'm seeing. Gally was apparently yelling at his bench last night and it doesn't appear it had any effect on the team. His playing hard with Evans since the season started and nobody else on the roster is following.

One is trying to justify his existence and good on him but the other is playing for a contract.
Still not a team of guys playing for each other.
The entire pack mentality example Marty tried to sell us during the pre-season was just wishful thinking.

 

[le_sean]

So his bright idea now is to keep Dach on the wing and have Caufield centred by f***ing Jake Evans? This guy is clueless

 

[Tyson]

So his bright idea now is to keep Dach on the wing and have Caufield centred by f***ing Jake Evans? This guy is clueless

Rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic

 

[Draft]

you can do this kind of system with players who are experienced and have high hockey IQ. On a team with higher level of talent, it would probably work decently. However, it's obvious that there are some massive gaps. Now, against every single team you're going to have certain things that work and certain things that don't work. The issue with MSL's coaching is that he's finding his team's identity and learning how to do his job on the fly, instead of already having hands-on experience. MSL can't adapt his system to evolve and respond to the challenges of teams and their different systems. A few nights ago, the defense was getting beaten on the counter-attack and unable to get back into their zone quick enough to stop the offense. Now, the logical thing to do is get your defenders to play a few steps back and try to not run the offense through them (when they're being dispossessed and turning the puck over). That doesn't seem to happen as much as it should. The team can't adapt to the game and just gets beaten over and over on the same dumb types of plays.
Along with this, your team has to learn how to bounce back and play with more confidence after you lose like this. Since that game against the Flyers (where they allowed 2 garbage goals in the 3rd), they just have lacked any consistency and they've been wallowing in their own mediocrity. MSL has no idea how to get them out of this stretch. That punitive practice did absolutely nothing for this team, and the game last night just showed that this squad has just absolutely given up. The short-handed goal along with the end of the second were really embarrassing to watch. The defense was just completely swimming at the end and Matheson basically left the team on a power play because he was just standing around. He's become a liability to the team at this point, but MSL is refusing to sit him while at the same time benching Arber. The whole "I'm alright with this season as a learning experience" thinking is valid, but quickly becomes invalid when you see that almost every player from last year has taken a huge step back. MSL isn't going to develop talent in the way that they need him to, nor can he win games by coaching alone. He's got two assistants with no NHL head-coaching coaching experience.

I’m fairly confident MSL has the experience necessary to analyze and identify other teams’ systems and adjust accordingly. It’s not magic or rocket science (even if many in this thread seem to think it is). If he’s learning how to make in-game adjustments better, I’m fine with that too. I’m not going to agree with every one of his choices, but I find the team to typically respond well, even if the outcomes aren’t always there. I really don’t think this is an issue related to MSL’s analytical/tactical capacity or fit with the club. I’d be fine if they brought in an experienced assistant coach to provide more support for the defensive group specifically though.

When it comes to Matheson’s minutes, I’d rather Matheson take the heat than Guhle or Hutson. Xhekaj played very poorly to start the year at both ends of the ice and he earned a spot in the press box. Struble and Barron have also sat. This is a non-issue when guys are still getting good minutes. I’d be happy to take Matheson off PP1, but I don’t mind Hutson having the play flow through him with his own unit - even if it’s with fewer skilled players. Matheson isn’t a 1D and shows us that every game, but putting one of our young guys in that position isn’t going to benefit them or the team if they aren’t ready… and I don’t think they are.

The hybrid system is proving to have a steep learning curve for some of our players. That’s the regression. The team might have marginally better outcomes if they moved back to man-to-man or played zone. If things don’t shift soon I’m expecting they might. I don’t expect them to change coaches unless MSL himself wants out.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

We hired a guy who never coached to be the coach of the montreal canadiens. I know its old news but its so silly to think about. Our GM hired his friend with zero coaching experience to coach one of the most high pressure and attention hockey franchises in the world.

 

[OldCraig71]

It could be the end for MSl this summer.

If this keeps up he will be gone by Christmas.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Telling you, Lemaire would be my solution. Just clog the middle of the ice, make them hard to play against. And it's easy to learn and execute for the kids. And if guys like Dach who are lost and cannot score goals, they could at least play defense properly, take their men. Just freaking do it. Hughes pride himself to be bold and innovative well that would be freaking bold.

Assuming you’re talking systems and not the actual coach right?

That would work in the short term. No doubt about it. But you’re stunting the skill development of younger players.

The system needs a change but I don’t think the trap is the way to go.