Coaching is a serious problem.

[Lafleurs Guy]

I mean, I guess he has? I have seen a few good games from him but mostly inconsistent play and the poor guy can't stay healthy. Even though Hughes made the call to him on air at the draft and people were excited by it, he also kept his cards close to his vest by giving him a short term contract. He didn't do that on a whim.

Health is the big issue. He’s missed a lot of time and that’s hurt him for sure. As for him looking bad this year, everyone does. We’re now close to 15 games in and it’s enough to begin to take stock of where we’re at.

I’m sure the hybrid system decision wasn’t made in a vaccuum. It’s not just MSL that decided to go this way. They are being patient to see if the players can adjust. And that makes sense from a long term strategic view.

However, the Canadiens analytics are worst in league. I’m not sure how long you should stick with a system like this. It’s clearly not working and I don’t know if we’re going to see any improvement there. They’re a better club than they’ve shown.

The article I posted above talks about how when it works? The hybrid system can be incredibly effective. Totally get why they’d want the kids to learn it. But maybe they should swap it out for zone coverage for now. Simplify things for the kids and maybe they’ll respond. Interesting point that was raised - last year Edmonton tried the hybrid system and they really struggled with it. Brought in a new coach with a zone system and the team took off.

Maybe hybrid is the way to go long term. Totally get why they’re taking the painful route now. But with the team being so young, it won’t surprise me if they go back to the basics and bring back hybrid later.

 

[teamfirst]

Maybe hybrid is the way to go long term. Totally get why they’re taking the painful route now. But with the team being so young, it won’t surprise me if they go back to the basics and bring back hybrid later.

Amen... except for the bolded,, they've been taking the painfull route for 2 and half seasons now and they ruined 2 and half seasons of developpment for our young D, not to mention the usage of Ghule on his weak side.

 

[Hannibal]

Cool article on the coaching and how we may want to change systems.

Why the Montreal Canadiens need to change their defensive system – Sportsnet.ca

So our system was use by the four of the last 5 stanley cup champs but we fail to execute it lol

We are bad.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

So our system was use by the four of the last 5 stanley cup champs but we fail to execute it lol

We are bad.

Read the article. The system doesn’t always work. If you master it, it can be really effective. But the team is young and it might make more sense now to shelve it until the players are a little more mature.

Edmonton dropped the hybrid system and went on a tear last year. And they came within one game of a cup. They looked like crap for the first 15 games too.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Amen... except for the bolded,, they've been taking the painfull route for 2 and half seasons now and they ruined 2 and half seasons of developpment for our young D, not to mention the usage of Ghule on his weak side.

I think they played really well last year considering the injuries and youth. That’s why this year looked so promising.

And maybe sticking it out is better in the long run. I’m not sure. But those are probably the conversations they’re having now.

 

[angusyoung]

I'm going with coaching is a problem along with under-performing players.

 

[teamfirst]

Developpemnt wise only Slaf and Suzuki played really well last season Caufield was ok and that was only for the last 40 games or so, all of our young D regressed.

Lowering the bar is really a thing for some here.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Developpemnt wise only Slaf and Suzuki played really well last season Caufield was ok and that was only for the last 40 games or so, all of our young D regressed.

Lowering the bar is really a thing for some here.

Caufield consistently put up shots and played well all year. The only thing that went South for him was his shot.

Ghule played well. Newhook played well. Slaf improved by leaps and bounds. Sytruble, Xejak developed well.

I’m not sure what the hell you’re talking about man.

 

[teamfirst]

Caufield consistent put up shots and played well all year. The only thing that went South for him was his shot.

Ghule played well. Newhook played well. Slaf improved by leaps and bounds. Sytruble, Xejak developed well.

I’m not sure what the hell you’re talking about man.

We clearly not seeing the game the same way cuz to me Ghule Struble Xhekaj all regressed.

As for Caufield he had a good second half no problem with that he was coming back from a shoulder operation and Newhook is a streaky player couples of good game and he dissapear.

that narrative that we overachieved last seasons is quite funny......Montembault overachieved is what we should say.

 

[MarkovsKnee]

So our system was use by the four of the last 5 stanley cup champs but we fail to execute it lol

We are bad.

We don't have the players to play it. Considering all of Guhle, Xhekaj, Struble & Savard play on our D, we'd be much better off with a system where the D defends the front of the net rather than a forward.

Trying to watch Caufield & Newhook fend off guys like Parayko or Tkachuk (Ottawa) is hilarious.

Upfront, we have guys like Anderson, Gallagher, Dvorak, Armia, Heineman, players who would also be better in more of a grinding game than a match meet.

Suzuki & Slafkovsky would be fine in that system as well. Caufield would have better defensive support and we could free him up a bit if we allow the weak side winger to leave the zone early.

It is likely that Mailloux would be more effective in a zone type defense, too.

A left-wing lock (Scotty Bowman's system) or a neutral zone trap (Jaques Lemaire's system) would be far better with this team.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

We clearly not seeing the game the same way cuz to me Ghule Struble Xhekaj all regressed.

It was X and Struble’s first year. How could they have regressed?

As for Caufield he had a good second half no problem with that he was coming back from a shoulder operation and Newhook is a streaky player couples of good game and he dissapear.

Wrong.

He had a great year all the way through. Yes the puck went in for him at the end of the year but that’s not indicative of his play. He played a very consistent game all season. He just couldn’t score from mid ice and it cost him 20 something goals.

As for Newhook, his season was derailed by injury. Without that he puts up 50-60 points and 20 something goals. He’s on pace for 20 now and the whole team - including him - has been bad.

that narrative that we overachieved last seasons is quite funny......Montembault overachieved is what we should say.

Montie was fantastic. Nobody disagrees. But the team looked a lot better last season than it does now and that’s backed up by the analytics. The first line is nowhere near where they usually are. Caufield’s shots are way down and it’s going to bite us.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

Read the article. The system doesn’t always work. If you master it, it can be really effective. But the team is young and it might make more sense now to shelve it until the players are a little more mature.

Edmonton dropped the hybrid system and went on a tear last year. And they came within one game of a cup. They looked like crap for the first 15 games too.

The problem isn’t that the kids can’t play the system imo, it’s we don’t have a system, it’s period and the coaches can’t seem to put one in place. We have a bunch of running around.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

We don't have the players to play it. Considering all of Guhle, Xhekaj, Struble & Savard play on our D, we'd be much better off with a system where the D defends the front of the net rather than a forward.

Trying to watch Caufield & Newhook fend off guys like Parayko or Tkachuk (Ottawa) is hilarious.

Upfront, we have guys like Anderson, Gallagher, Dvorak, Armia, Heineman, players who would also be better in more of a grinding game than a match meet.

Suzuki & Slafkovsky would be fine in that system as well. Caufield would have better defensive support and we could free him up a bit if we allow the weak side winger to leave the zone early.

It is likely that Mailloux would be more effective in a zone type defense, too.

A left-wing lock (Scotty Bowman's system) or a neutral zone trap (Jaques Lemaire's system) would be far better with this team.

I don’t want to see the trap but I think it’s pretty clear that the team is struggling with the system we currently have. We’re almost at the 15 game mark, I haven’t seen improvement. I think it may be time to ditch it.

It’d be one thing if we were playing mediocre but we’re dead last in some stats and the players look lost. This isn’t helping anyone.

The problem isn’t that the kids can’t play the system imo, it’s we don’t have a system, it’s period and the coaches can’t seem to put one in place. We have a bunch of running around.

It’s not working. I get they want us to learn something that’s had success for some cup winning teams but I think there’s time for that later. And as @MarkovsKnee pointed out, the club makeup may not be right for it. It certainly didn’t work for the Oilers.

They look completely lost I agree.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

We played much better last season which leads me to believe that as much as it seems like only a MSL problem to the eye test , it's probably alot of things put together all at once.

This is a management thing as much as a coaching thing for not anticipating that Savard and Matheson are the ones getting babysat and not the other way around. Also couldn't anticipate Laine going out. I liked the move.

Me personally? I couldn't care less if we lose as long as Slaf Hutson Caufield Ghule and Suzuki don't look like garbage since I am a tank commander myself and would love to add some more potential top 6 forwards and top 4 d with high-medium picks in the next 2 drafts.

I respect our management because they actually had the balls to announce to us that this wasn't a 2-3-4 year thing they were coming in to do. I know they said they wanted to be in the mix this year and i wouldn't have said it if I were them but I'm not gonna scream to fire everybody just for my Tuesday night enjoyment in November.

2 of our 3 top 5 picks aren't even on the team yet. So it's kinda hard to panic imo.

That's just my opinion though I know alot of people want to win now and be competitive , there's no excuse to how the guys are playing right now but its hard to panic when 70% of the roster won't be there when we are good imo , that's just the reality of transition years during rebuilds.

We have long ass timeline , did people think Caufield and Suzuki would be our two best players on a cup run?

 

[holy]

We played much better last season which leads me to believe that as much as it seems like only a MSL problem to the eye test , it's probably alot of things put together all at once.

This is a management thing as much as a coaching thing for not anticipating that Savard and Matheson are the ones getting babysat and not the other way around. Also couldn't anticipate Laine going out. I liked the move.

Me personally? I couldn't care less if we lose as long as Slaf Hutson Caufield Ghule and Suzuki don't look like garbage since I am a tank commander myself and would love to add some more potential top 6 forwards and top 4 d with high-medium picks in the next 2 drafts.

I respect our management because they actually had the balls to announce to us that this wasn't a 2-3-4 year thing they were coming in to do. I know they said they wanted to be in the mix this year and i wouldn't have said it if I were them but I'm not gonna scream to fire everybody just for my Tuesday night enjoyment in November.

2 of our 3 top 5 picks aren't even on the team yet. So it's kinda hard to panic imo.

That's just my opinion though I know alot of people want to win now and be competitive , there's no excuse to how the guys are playing right now but its hard to panic when 70% of the roster won't be there when we are good imo , that's just the reality of transition years during rebuilds

I'm voting you President of the Tank Committee.

 

[OnTheRun]

I don’t want to see the trap but I think it’s pretty clear that the team is struggling with the system we currently have. We’re almost at the 15 game mark, I haven’t seen improvement. I think it may be time to ditch it.

It’d be one thing if we were playing mediocre but we’re dead last in some stats and the players look lost. This isn’t helping anyone.


It’s not working. I get they want us to learn something that’s had success for some cup winning teams but I think there’s time for that later. And as @MarkovsKnee pointed out, the club makeup may not be right for it. It certainly didn’t work for the Oilers.

They look completely lost I agree.

You guys better buckle up, because the hybrid system exposed an unexpected crack.

This team is just bad at man-to-man defense AND zone defense, if you can't execute either defensive fundamental properly, what are you gonna play? Every system variation out there is built on either m2m or zone.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

You guys better buckle up, because the hybrid system exposed an unexpected crack.

This team is just bad at man-to-man defense AND zone defense, if you can't execute either defensive fundamental properly, what are you gonna play? Every system variation out there is built on either m2m or zone.

Cant be worse than this. Look at the difference in the Oilers once they flipped the switch.

 

[Habs13]

Checked my phone for news and this pops up... a little bit extreme, don't you think??

 

[OnTheRun]

Cant be worse than this. Look at the difference in the Oilers once they flipped the switch.

It can be the same tho. The execution level is waaaay below where it should be, odds is you end up playing something different just as poorly.

 

[Habs]

It's weird how the players aren't even making simple passes and plays. Are they just not prepared to play? Passes nowhere near the tape, and directly lead to icings. confusion on the half wall and all over the ice. We didn't look this unorganized last year at all. We were in many more of the games and not out of it after the second period. God I hope we somehow win the lotto and get the #1 or 2 pick this year and get that franchise C we need to properly rebuild

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

It can be the same tho. The execution level is waaaay below where it should be, odds is you end up playing something different just as poorly.

We’ve looked better in the past, I think we’d have at least some improvement

 

[Rapala]

The problem isn’t that the kids can’t play the system imo, it’s we don’t have a system, it’s period and the coaches can’t seem to put one in place. We have a bunch of running around.

Many of us were saying last season that we couldn't even play the man to man system properly as a team.
The Hybrid is far more complicated with quadrants and hand offs I don't think we are suited for either.

I find it a bit strange that we never achieved a decent level of success using a basic system before trying more complicated ones.
The entire argument about playing it until we grow into it is counter intuitive and bringing up 4 of the last 5 SC champions used it is funny.

We are struggling to play .400 hockey so we won't be needing this hybrid system for 3 to 5 years yet.
Patience works in many ways and this is one where we need to stop trying to run before we can even walk.

 

[Tabarouette]

it's a constant battle in my mind between giving coaches/players the benefit of the doubt, because they're professionals and they usually know a lot more than us, and remembering that it took these guys 100 years to admit that 4 forward on a PP is viable

using this thread as my own personal journal

 

[OnTheRun]

We’ve looked better in the past, I think we’d have at least some improvement

We looked "less lost" and had better goaltending, but we were never effective at defending.

It's pretty obvious that the learning curve of an hybrid system is steep when you can't execute the basics of m2m or zone defense.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

We looked "less lost" and had better goaltending, but we were never effective at defending.

It's pretty obvious that the learning curve of an hybrid system is steep when you can't execute the basics of m2m or zone defense.

I don’t expect us to be great. We’re a young team so it wouldn’t be surprising to see us struggle.

Dead last though? No, I expect better than that.