Chychrun’s Megathread V (poll added)

[rt]

Everyone is voting C - can I ask why? Is this about the pick being Ottawa's and therefore a bit more likely to be earlier?

 

[Jagged Ice]

Everyone is voting C - can I ask why? Is this about the pick being Ottawa's and therefore a bit more likely to be earlier?

Haha! That's what I went with honestly. I know that's a shortsighted and lazy view when considering a package but I think LA is going to take another step forward this season. I like Durzi and everyone knows we need to add to our blue line, but I could see the Kings making the WCF. I don't think Ottawa has done enough to get ahead of even Detroit or Buffalo. They didn't last season and Detroit and Buffalo are both rising teams as well.
The '23 draft is going to be a big one, maybe the biggest in decades, so getting another 1st in or closer to the #10-15 range has much more value than a late 20's pick to me.
With the recent rehab news, I think a GM would be out of his mind to make any of these moves for JC. Chychrun needs to get healthy and return to form or none of this happens.

 

[Arizonatah Coyetis]

Everyone is voting C - can I ask why? Is this about the pick being Ottawa's and therefore a bit more likely to be earlier?

For me it is. I just want the best picks we can get for our guys to use.

 

[JasonDemersWasOkay]

Rehabbing a new (or even old) injury now I don't think we even get a 1st for him at this point..

 

[lanky]

Rehabbing a new (or even old) injury now I don't think we even get a 1st for him at this point..

Good point. Also, the sky is falling. What should I do?

 

[Half Clapper]

Or Chych hold out then comes back and plays poorly because he is discontented, then gets injured again and his value goes down some more. His value a year ago>TDL>draft>this summer>TDL>next summer. The chances of his value going up from here are very slim but going down further are high. I hope I am wrong.

You do not sell low on a 24 year old D-man on a great value contract. Chych is definitely not sitting out and I can easily see him having a bounce back year. I think the Yotes will actually have a better team this year than last also.

It is like buying a stock and then re-selling it at 3/4 or even 1/2 of its value. I'll bet on Chych upping his stock again.

 

[Coyotes19c]

You do not sell low on a 24 year old D-man on a great value contract. Chych is definitely not sitting out and I can easily see him having a bounce back year. I think the Yotes will actually have a better team this year than last also.

It is like buying a stock and then re-selling it at 3/4 or even 1/2 of its value. I'll bet on Chych upping his stock again.

How about if the stock takes years to get back up to “full value” and you need to cash it out in three years?

I guess I’m missing something but it’s far from a guarantee that Chychrun has a great year. In fact it’s more likely he gets injured again.

We can’t screw this up and I feel like BA has already messed this up big time.

 

[rt]

How about if the stock takes years to get back up to “full value” and you need to cash it out in three years?

I guess I’m missing something but it’s far from a guarantee that Chychrun has a great year. In fact it’s more likely he gets injured again.

We can’t screw this up and I feel like BA has already messed this up big time.

Players have max value at the TDL. Prospects and picks have max value at the draft. When BA was fielding offers, they were getting better and better approaching the TDL. It made all the sense in the world to wait for max leverage at the TDL.

Unfortunately, Chychrun got hurt before the big day. That’s not BA’s fault. As soon as the TDL passed, Chychrun’s value got worse, and the value of picks and prospects got better. That’s just how the market works. BA doesn’t control that.

 

[Heldig]

Everyone is voting C - can I ask why? Is this about the pick being Ottawa's and therefore a bit more likely to be earlier?

Mostly. I did consider the Kings one as their may be more potential in the deal. I like Boucher, too.

 

[rt]

Okay. So everyone chose C. Now I want to see how low you’ll go. Which one is your “walk-way” point? Vote for 1st Chychrun deal you would NOT accept:

A.
Zaitsev, Sogaard, Boucher, '23 1st, '23 2nd

B.
Zaitsev, Sogaard, Boucher, '23 1st

C.
Zaitsev, Sogaard, Brannstrom, '23 1st

D.
Zaitsev, Boucher, Brannstrom, ‘23 1st

E.
“I would be willing to go even lower”

 

[XX]

Going lower than B is basically just dumping the player to be rid of him.

Like you need the most charitable read possible on those 2 prospects just to make the value reasonably work with the Zaitsev dump attached.

A good GM could get A all day with Chychrun's contract. That's nothing to a team that has need and also wants a dump to go away.

I feel BA is incorrectly holding out for a true bluechip prospect. That would only be attainable if Chychrun never had any health issues. He should have pivoted to a basket of value at some point but hasn't.

 

[Heldig]

Okay. So everyone chose C. Now I want to see how low you’ll go. Which one is your “walk-way” point? Vote for 1st Chychrun deal you would NOT accept:

A.
Zaitsev, Sogaard, Boucher, '23 1st, '23 2nd

B.
Zaitsev, Sogaard, Boucher, '23 1st

C.
Zaitsev, Sogaard, Brannstrom, '23 1st

D.
Zaitsev, Boucher, Brannstrom, ‘23 1st

E.
“I would be willing to go even lower”

@rt you are making me sad.

Lowest I would want GM to go is B. And I would be disappointed in that. But, as a Coyotes fan (and Jets fan) I am used to my teams disappointing me.

 

[PainForShane]

Honestly I would keep Chychrun, imo he's far better than any of those packages. Last year he played on his off side paired with whichever random AHL callup he needed to, and aside from the 1st two months he still put together a better than ok year. Considering his rehab, selling on him now would be selling extremely low.

Also, my guess is he'll be 100% fine staying here long term once he sees what guys like Cooley and Guenther can do in the NHL, especially as the new Tempe arena gets closer. Absolutely no reason to trade him unless we truly get a haul, or unless he does something like refuse to report to training camp (which I can't imagine he's even thinking about)

 

[Coyotes19c]

Players have max value at the TDL. Prospects and picks have max value at the draft. When BA was fielding offers, they were getting better and better approaching the TDL. It made all the sense in the world to wait for max leverage at the TDL.

Unfortunately, Chychrun got hurt before the big day. That’s not BA’s fault. As soon as the TDL passed, Chychrun’s value got worse, and the value of picks and prospects got better. That’s just how the market works. BA doesn’t control that.

So you want him to make the same mistake again and wait until the trade deadline?

 

[rt]

@rt you are making me sad.

Lowest I would want GM to go is B. And I would be disappointed in that. But, as a Coyotes fan (and Jets fan) I am used to my teams disappointing me.

Same. B is as low as I’d go.

So you want him to make the same mistake again and wait until the trade deadline?

It wasn’t a mistake. It was misfortune. I hope your life is so blessed that you never have to learn the difference.

Going lower than B is basically just dumping the player to be rid of him.

Like you need the most charitable read possible on those 2 prospects just to make the value reasonably work with the Zaitsev dump attached.

A good GM could get A all day with Chychrun's contract. That's nothing to a team that has need and also wants a dump to go away.

I feel BA is incorrectly holding out for a true bluechip prospect. That would only be attainable if Chychrun never had any health issues. He should have pivoted to a basket of value at some point but hasn't.

I agree with all of that.

 

[Coyotes19c]

It wasn’t a mistake. It was misfortune. I hope your life is so blessed that you never have to learn the difference.

I do have a great life can’t complain but unfortunately this has nothing to do with me.

I believe BA was being greedy, assuming that what you’re saying is correct. (waiting until the trade deadline)

Now he’s stuck trying to chase that original return that he will never get. Want to know the worst part? It’s only going to get worse from here. Only way it doesn’t is if Chychrun comes out with a monster start of the year. Could it happen? Sure of course. Will it happen before he gets hurt or he gets annoyed because we suck? We’ll find out soon.

 

[rt]

I do have a great life can’t complain but unfortunately this has nothing to do with me.

I believe BA was being greedy, assuming that what you’re saying is correct. (waiting until the trade deadline)

Now he’s stuck trying to chase that original return that he will never get. Want to know the worst part? It’s only going to get worse from here. Only way it doesn’t is if Chychrun comes out with a monster start of the year. Could it happen? Sure of course. Will it happen before he gets hurt or he gets annoyed because we suck? We’ll find out soon.

That’s not being greedy. That’s being prudent.

 

[Mangosteen]

Honestly I would keep Chychrun, imo he's far better than any of those packages. Last year he played on his off side paired with whichever random AHL callup he needed to, and aside from the 1st two months he still put together a better than ok year. Considering his rehab, selling on him now would be selling extremely low.

Also, my guess is he'll be 100% fine staying here long term once he sees what guys like Cooley and Guenther can do in the NHL, especially as the new Tempe arena gets closer. Absolutely no reason to trade him unless we truly get a haul, or unless he does something like refuse to report to training camp (which I can't imagine he's even thinking about)

He may be retired by the time the arena is built. Just saying

BA is playing games I fear. Saying that he would of traded him but put the price so high you won’t have buyers. Than say no trade was made, he tried

 

[Half Clapper]

I do have a great life can’t complain but unfortunately this has nothing to do with me.

I believe BA was being greedy, assuming that what you’re saying is correct. (waiting until the trade deadline)

Now he’s stuck trying to chase that original return that he will never get. Want to know the worst part? It’s only going to get worse from here. Only way it doesn’t is if Chychrun comes out with a monster start of the year. Could it happen? Sure of course. Will it happen before he gets hurt or he gets annoyed because we suck? We’ll find out soon.

I think you're wrong. BA can't predict that Chych was going to get hurt. BA remaining patient is the right move in this situation. Chych is still young and under team control for 3 more years. He has no obligation to trade him until he feels like he gets the right offer for the player. If he doesn't well then Chych sticks around and plays out his contract in Arizona. By that point maybe Chych has a change of heart with the team steadily improving and sticks around longterm.

The Coyotes are not running a charity here and giving away players for lower value than what management thinks they're worth is not the move.

 

[rt]

Honestly I would keep Chychrun, imo he's far better than any of those packages. Last year he played on his off side paired with whichever random AHL callup he needed to, and aside from the 1st two months he still put together a better than ok year. Considering his rehab, selling on him now would be selling extremely low.

Also, my guess is he'll be 100% fine staying here long term once he sees what guys like Cooley and Guenther can do in the NHL, especially as the new Tempe arena gets closer. Absolutely no reason to trade him unless we truly get a haul, or unless he does something like refuse to report to training camp (which I can't imagine he's even thinking about)

I’ve never wanted to trade Chychrun. I hate that he asked for a trade. This whole thing is miserable. I wish he would’ve just shut up and put his head down and got to work like Keller did.

I’m not mad at Chychrun but this whole thing sucks and it would’ve been much better if he did like Keller. I think Chychrun and Keller are great fits, age-wise, to be part of this master plan. Especially if we get Bedard.

 

[cobra427]

You do not sell low on a 24 year old D-man on a great value contract. Chych is definitely not sitting out and I can easily see him having a bounce back year. I think the Yotes will actually have a better team this year than last also.

It is like buying a stock and then re-selling it at 3/4 or even 1/2 of its value. I'll bet on Chych upping his stock again.

Do you mean like the stock market today, don't sell META because its down in value, wait for it to go back up? His value has already gone down, long shot that it goes back up and it could go down.

 

[Half Clapper]

Do you mean like the stock market today, don't sell META because its down in value, wait for it to go back up? His value has already gone down, long shot that it goes back up and it could go down.

What gives you the basis that his value will not ever go up again?

 

[rt]

Durzi is still unsigned and LA only has 1.5 in capspace. LA has a ton of offensive minded RD. They need an LD badly.

Vilardi is on a 1way deal and is also out of waiver exemption (as is JAD, who at least has a 2way). Losing one or both for nothing would be a very tough pill to swallow but they don’t have much leverage.

They’re both 23 years old, and are likely NHL players this season. So they’re a little older than what most of us expect for Chychrun but they’re still young enough to fit into the plan. If we were able to get 2023 1st in the deal, I imagine that would be tempting. Those seem to be highly prized and closely guarded.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

Chych will not sit or hold out. There is no benefit for him if he sits out. IF he wasn't hurt last year he may have had much more leverage, but other GM's I think are being cautious, (and that could be why you haven't see a deal yet,) until Chych plays this year. IF Chych still wants out, he might have to play his way out. Sitting at home only helps the Coyotes tank.

But the sky is falling Jakey!
I’ve never read so much Chicken Little crap in my life.

 

[Coyotes19c]

I think you're wrong. BA can't predict that Chych was going to get hurt. BA remaining patient is the right move in this situation. Chych is still young and under team control for 3 more years. He has no obligation to trade him until he feels like he gets the right offer for the player. If he doesn't well then Chych sticks around and plays out his contract in Arizona. By that point maybe Chych has a change of heart with the team steadily improving and sticks around longterm.

The Coyotes are not running a charity here and giving away players for lower value than what management thinks they're worth is not the move.

No one said give him away. Let’s all be honest here. No one knows what offers he has received. For all we know BA has received several offers that are higher than RT’s.

You want to keep a player for 3 more years when we want to lose games and lose him for nothing? That’s a bold strategy.

BA gambled and lost last year on this. Would be silly to just run it back and hope for a different outcome. Let’s face it, Chychrun is injury prone.