Celebrini vs Michkov

[Regal]

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Rosters are pretty close by their talent level. So it's about something different than skill and talent.

Disagree. Konecny, Tippett, Farabee and Sanheim are better than anyone on San Jose, and first half Couturier is as well, and if he has a good offseason further removed from injury he might be able to be good through the whole year. San Jose and Chicago are two of the least talented teams we’ve seen in recent years.

 

[Kshahdoo]

Disagree. Konecny, Tippett, Farabee and Sanheim are better than anyone on San Jose, and first half Couturier is as well, and if he has a good offseason further removed from injury he might be able to be good through the whole year. San Jose and Chicago are two of the least talented teams we’ve seen in recent years.

Granlund is good when he plays his game, and it looks like he played his game most of the season. He's maybe on on TK level, but better than anybody else on the Flyers. Of course Granlund is 32, and Philadelphia guys are 24-25, so they can improve, and Sharks will be lucky if Granlund continues to play on this level even one more season, but it's still about can and if and not facts.

On the other side Eklund is pretty young and at his age young players can progress really fast and well.

So while the Flyers roster has probably edge on the Sharks, the difference isn't that big. And Sharks have some really good and talented young kids who can be added to the main team next season.

 

[wetcoast]

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Philadelphia Flyers 2023-2024 - Roster, Stats & more

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Rosters are pretty close by their talent level. So it's about something different than skill and talent.

No they aren't really close and frankly you're pretty knowledgeable and should realize this.

 

[Fatass]

Easy for me. Go with the generational talent in michkov

 

[Juxtaposer]

I lol when people say Philadelphia is the better team. It's better because of its coach and not because of its players. It's a miracle they were fighting for the playoff spot till almost the end of the regular.

Built-in excuse for when Celebrini outscores Michkov.

If Michkov plays in the NHL next season, the Calder is basically his. He’s 18 months older than Celebrini, plays a position where he won’t have to worry about defense at all, plays in a much bigger market, would be on a much better roster, and doesn’t have another potential Calder candidate on his team.

I’d still take Celebrini long term without question.

 

[Kshahdoo]

Built-in excuse for when Celebrini outscores Michkov.

If Michkov plays in the NHL next season, the Calder is basically his. He’s 18 months older than Celebrini, plays a position where he won’t have to worry about defense at all, plays in a much bigger market, would be on a much better roster, and doesn’t have another potential Calder candidate on his team.

I’d still take Celebrini long term without question.

Of course you will, and it's going to look funny in a few years...

 

[Sasso09]

Built-in excuse for when Celebrini outscores Michkov.

If Michkov plays in the NHL next season, the Calder is basically his. He’s 18 months older than Celebrini, plays a position where he won’t have to worry about defense at all, plays in a much bigger market, would be on a much better roster, and doesn’t have another potential Calder candidate on his team.

I’d still take Celebrini long term without question.

In no season will Celebrini have a higher PPG or more goals than Michkov.

This comment will look very silly very fast. Celebrini is getting pumped up for being a 1OA but he goes 4th or 5th with Leo in 23' given it's known michkov comes early and the contract isn't a factor. Fantilli would be clearly ahead of Celebrini. Slightly better/even production in draft year, much bigger, more physical and complete.

That being said, Michkov was seen as clearly the top 2 player in the draft above Fantilli and his D+1 draft solidified that.

 

[TS Quint]

In no season will Celebrini have a higher PPG or more goals than Michkov.

This comment will look very silly very fast. Celebrini is getting pumped up for being a 1OA but he goes 4th or 5th with Leo in 23' given it's known michkov comes early and the contract isn't a factor. Fantilli would be clearly ahead of Celebrini. Slightly better/even production in draft year, much bigger, more physical and complete.

That being said, Michkov was seen as clearly the top 2 player in the draft above Fantilli and his D+1 draft solidified that.

Not by anyone who matters.

 

[AD1066]

I think Celebrini has better physical traits but Michkov's IQ is one of the highest I have seen in a prospect.

 

[FlyguyOX]

Michkov has better supporting cast so I think he'll have higher odds at it.

But if I'm building a team I take Celebrini obviously, since he's a center.

Not by anyone who matters.

The flyers had him 2, so there's that. Seems notable.

 

[TS Quint]

Michkov has better supporting cast so I think he'll have higher odds at it.

But if I'm building a team I take Celebrini obviously, since he's a center.


The flyers had him 2, so there's that. Seems notable.

Yeah, the Flyers who picked him 7th that is more notable and just like everyone else they had their guy ranked much higher.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

They shouldn’t have been fighting for a playoff spot as but they still have more talent to play with unless the Sharks make some adds. They scored over 50 more goals and I wouldn’t put that all on Torts.

Sharks will be a completely different team up front outside of the ‘Lund’ line. Not sure how many bumps in the road there will be, but those comparing them to last years roster are in for a surprise. Even if they’re horrible again they’ll at least be entertaining and there are lights at the end of the tunnel.

 

[Regal]

Sharks will be a completely different team up front outside of the ‘Lund’ line. Not sure how many bumps in the road there will be, but those comparing them to last years roster are in for a surprise. Even if they’re horrible again they’ll at least be entertaining and there are lights at the end of the tunnel.

Seems like they’re going to be willing to make more moves this offseason than when I posted that. And Philly might be more willing to move off of their players by some of the rumours. We should probably all hold off on predictions until the rosters are set.

 

[Sasso09]

Yeah, the Flyers who picked him 7th that is more notable and just like everyone else they had their guy ranked much higher.

Do yourself a favor and rewatch that entire draft. They talk about Michkov being the CLEAR #2 like 100 times during the draft. They talk about how he MIGHT slip to 5 at worst due to contract. On talent alone and no contract he's competing with Bedard for 1st. Literally everyone said it on the panel;, all the scouts were saying it all year.

Frankly, Celebrini isn't close. He'll be in a group with Fantili, Leo, Cutter, Smith. Elite, not generational

Michkov will be at the big kid's table with Bedard, Hagens, McKenna, McDavid, Matthews.

Disagree? cool, you're wrong.

 

[Albatros]

Do yourself a favor and rewatch that entire draft. They talk about Michkov being the CLEAR #2 like 100 times during the draft. They talk about how he MIGHT slip to 5 at worst due to contract. On talent alone and no contract he's competing with Bedard for 1st. Literally everyone said it on the panel;, all the scouts were saying it all year.

If that year was 2021 maybe. Pre-draft Fantilli and Carlsson were ahead in most rankings, Smith in many.

 

[NatusVincere]

If that year was 2021 maybe. Pre-draft Fantilli and Carlsson were ahead in most rankings, Smith in many.

You should clearly rewatch the draft coverage… the guy you quoted is right, Michkov was talked about as the 2nd most talented prospect behind only Bedard… and so did most of the scouts. That he was ranked behind Fantilli or Carlsson had nothing to do with talent.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/4579232/2023/06/20/matvei-michkov-nhl-draft-decision/

 

[Bounces R Way]

Celebrini is one of the most NHL ready D+1 prospects to enter this league in good long while. His game is extremely mature for his age, even compared to Matthews, McDavid, Eichel, and Hughes. I don't think he's as talented as those players but would not surprise me if he can maintain a more consistent pace than Michkov throughout the year. Could see him in the high 60s or low 70s points wise if his linemates and team aren't total dogshit(which they are more likely than not to be). He is also banged up currently I understand so a slow start could doom his shot early.

Michkov would still be my slight Calder favourite because he can create out of nothing. He has a bit more help around him forward wise. The Calder often comes down to production and as far as pure production goes I think this is one of those rare players that can do it whether he's having a good game or not. I expect he'll have some heaters and cold streaks. Could be as high as point per game, could take more time to adjust to the pace and be much lower.

 

[TS Quint]

Do yourself a favor and rewatch that entire draft. They talk about Michkov being the CLEAR #2 like 100 times during the draft. They talk about how he MIGHT slip to 5 at worst due to contract. On talent alone and no contract he's competing with Bedard for 1st. Literally everyone said it on the panel;, all the scouts were saying it all year.

Frankly, Celebrini isn't close. He'll be in a group with Fantili, Leo, Cutter, Smith. Elite, not generational

Michkov will be at the big kid's table with Bedard, Hagens, McKenna, McDavid, Matthews.

Disagree? cool, you're wrong.

It must be so embarrassing to make these kinds of posts without doing a simple Google search. I don't have to disagree with you I can let McKenzie, Button, Mckeens, Elite Prospects and FCProspects do it for me.

Celebrini isn't close? Yeah, you sound real credible.

"But that one guy on the draft coverage said what i want to hear...." LMAO! hold on to that real tight because that's all you have.

 

[Sasso09]

It must be so embarrassing to make these kinds of posts without doing a simple Google search. I don't have to disagree with you I can let McKenzie, Button, Mckeens, Elite Prospects and FCProspects do it for me.

Celebrini isn't close? Yeah, you sound real credible.

"But that one guy on the draft coverage said what i want to hear...." LMAO! hold on to that real tight because that's all you have.

You just named a bunch of Bozos strengthening my case.

Celebrini isn't close.

Celebrini is equal with Fantilli at best.

If that year was 2021 maybe. Pre-draft Fantilli and Carlsson were ahead in most rankings, Smith in many.

you're 2000% wrong, watch the draft again

it was a consensus, not debatable.

 

[sensfan4lifee]

It must be so embarrassing to make these kinds of posts without doing a simple Google search. I don't have to disagree with you I can let McKenzie, Button, Mckeens, Elite Prospects and FCProspects do it for me.

Celebrini isn't close? Yeah, you sound real credible.

"But that one guy on the draft coverage said what i want to hear...." LMAO! hold on to that real tight because that's all you have.

I don't think he sounds embarrassing at all, Michkov is a superior prospect to Celebrini in terms of ceiling, its not me or anyone else making up facts its simply the truth. Michkov is the best Russian prospect since Ovie, and he has the potential to put #s up like Kucherov, Mcdavid and Mackinnon, this is me bending facts, this is me speaking the truth, these are two very different levels of prospects, Michkov was challenging Bedard for the 1st ova and he could very well end up being better.

 

[TS Quint]

You just named a bunch of Bozos strengthening my case.

Celebrini isn't close.

Celebrini is equal with Fantilli at best.


you're 2000% wrong, watch the draft again

it was a consensus, not debatable.

You have no case. You have one random guy. I have a list and at least 6 NHL teams. Stop this clown show.

I don't think he sounds embarrassing at all, Michkov is a superior prospect to Celebrini in terms of ceiling, its not me or anyone else making up facts its simply the truth. Michkov is the best Russian prospect since Ovie, and he has the potential to put #s up like Kucherov, Mcdavid and Mackinnon, this is me bending facts, this is me speaking the truth, these are two very different levels of prospects, Michkov was challenging Bedard for the 1st ova and he could very well end up being better.

Your opinion of a guy you have barely seen play is not the truth. You're are really showing your bias when you are listing him with McDavid, McKinnon etc. Never going to happen. What a joke.

 

[Albatros]

you're 2000% wrong, watch the draft again

it was a consensus, not debatable.

You're entitled to your own opinions, not your own facts. McKenzie (consensus) had him #5.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

You're entitled to your own opinions, not your own facts. McKenzie (consensus) had him #5.

I think that’s probably not a good way to assess this particular case. If we are talking about best prospect, I think he would’ve been higher than 5. Add in the contract and team need (two things that are quite frankly irrelevant for this discussion), that’s how he’s fifth. I think he’d end up second if you polled people without those factors in play, even if not a consensus second.

 

[sensfan4lifee]

You have no case. You have one random guy. I have a list and at least 6 NHL teams. Stop this clown show.


Your opinion of a guy you have barely seen play is not the truth. You're are really showing your bias when you are listing him with McDavid, McKinnon etc. Never going to happen. What a joke.

Actually the only joke here is you, he absolutely is capable of putting up those types of numbers in his peak, he was rated as high as Bedard in his draft year, and I think if he had of been Canadian he could have gone #1 and I've seen him play plenty from highlights, sadly he just over here this year but I ll bet this year he scores at a PPG, and he has the potential to hit 120 points a year at his peak. Will he? I'm not sure but the potential is there, you to even deny that shows your own ignorance and bias.

 

[Sasso09]

You're entitled to your own opinions, not your own facts. McKenzie (consensus) had him #5.

McKenzie is a joke. And McKenzie had him 2nd best prospect, 5th due to 3 year KHL contract and russian factor.

No one had him worse than 2nd best player in the draft, this isn't debatable

You have no case. You have one random guy. I have a list and at least 6 NHL teams. Stop this clown show.


Your opinion of a guy you have barely seen play is not the truth. You're are really showing your bias when you are listing him with McDavid, McKinnon etc. Never going to happen. What a joke.

You talk about one embarrassing themselves, yet here you are, being the only one to do so in this thread.