Trade: [CAR/CHI] 2023 1st overall pick for 2023 9th overall, 2023 61st overall, 2024 1st, 2025 2nd, and DJ Moore

StreetHawk

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Sep 30, 2017
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I am extraordinarily apprehensive of small QB's that don't have elite mobility.

Stroud was more projectable and is proving those that had him #1 correct thus far.
As you should be. R. Wilson, was elusive. Murray was quick. Young, not just his height, but his frame. Lanky for even a 5'10 guy. I do wonder if we hear rumblings that certain coaches/scouts within Carolina "distance themselves" from the Young selection, saying that it was the owner who wanted him if the gap between Stroud and Young remains this wide.

Stroud was the safer choice. Even if Young becomes the next Brees, at least you could always argue that you drafted a 6'3 210 lbs QB with a good (not elite) arm, who has some mobility, which he showed vs Georgia. Again, the only real question on Stroud was really his less than amazing production given he threw to 3 1st round WR and another one for 2024 in MHJ, plus had a OT who was the first OT off the board this past draft, a RT that went in round 4, and a C who went in Rd 6 in the past NFL draft. With that kind of talent, you expected they'd crush all of their opponents save for maybe Michigan, Wisc. PSU. They sometimes only won by 1 score or had to pull away late in the 4th.
 

Blackhawkswincup

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2023 1OA for 2024 1OA, 2023 9OA, DJ Moore, 2023 61OA, and a 2025 2nd

- Bears traded 9th overall (DT Jalen Carter) to Eagles for 10th overall (RT Darnell Wright) + 2024 4th round pick (?)

- Bears traded 61st overall (TE Brenton Strange ) + 136th overall (LB Yasir Abdullah) to Jaguars for 56th overall (CB Tyrique Stevenson)

So if looking at trade tree/asset management perspective thus far Bears have

WR DJ Moore
RT Darnell Wright (2023 1st, 10th overall)
CB Tyrique Stevenson (2023 2nd, 56th overall)
2024 Panthers 1st round pick (1st overall)
2024 Eagles 4th round pick (?)
2025 Panthers 2nd round pick (?)

Directly related to trade

Moore with 92 receptions for 1,300 yards + 8 TD's this year , Wright is starting RT (Played well this year) and Stevenson is starting at CB (3rd INT of season today)
 
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StreetHawk

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Sep 30, 2017
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Hate this trade more and more.
This is a cautionary tale for teams looking to trade up for a QB. What do you have remaining to surround your QB with should you make the move up?

Cause, it will cost you next year's first rounder.

Mahomes and Watson did,
Goff and Wentz did.
Fields did
Lance did and another one on top of that.
Darnold - Jets had 2 seconds in the same draft so they sent those 2 over along with another 2nd. Ballard of Indy felt 3 2nds he could add depth to the roster
Allen - Buf gave up a pair 2nds in that draft to flip picks with TB.

If you don't have much does it make sense to do that trade up? If the QB is right, answer probably is still yes, but you are unlikely to maximize success on the rookie contract if you need 2-3 years to restock the talent on the team.
 
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SnS

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This is a cautionary tale for teams looking to trade up for a QB. What do you have remaining to surround your QB with should you make the move up?

Cause, it will cost you next year's first rounder.

Mahomes and Watson did,
Goff and Wentz did.
Fields did
Lance did and another one on top of that.
Darnold - Jets had 2 seconds in the same draft so they sent those 2 over along with another 2nd. Ballard of Indy felt 3 2nds he could add depth to the roster
Allen - Buf gave up a pair 2nds in that draft to flip picks with TB.

If you don't have much does it make sense to do that trade up? If the QB is right, answer probably is still yes, but you are unlikely to maximize success on the rookie contract if you need 2-3 years to restock the talent on the team.

Bryce Young is a fraud.
 
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StreetHawk

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Sep 30, 2017
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Bryce Young is a fraud.
I said at the draft, I wouldn't trade up to get him. If he was there when my pick was up, I can see drafting him. Lacks anything that will help him. Russ, has escapability and could throw a great deep rainbow pass. Murray was quick and elusive. Brees accurate.

Young and Baker, kind of the same thing where they have nothing to fall back on should things not go according to schedule.
 

blueandgoldguy

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Oct 8, 2010
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I guess that awful owner of the Panthers was the one who ordered the trade in the first place? Maybe he will fire all the managers and coaches at the end of this season once again to feel better.
 
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blueandgoldguy

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Oct 8, 2010
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I see Young averaged less than 3 yards per pass attempt today. Just another awful game. The 2nd rounder to the Bears could very well be 33rd -35th overall....almost another first rounder
 

Blitzkrug

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Wonder how much more leash he gets before Canales benches him.

Rookie HC ain't going to hitch his wagon to an objectively terrible QB. Especially when they already show shots of his teammates brushing him off/ignoring him. Like the rest of the team around him didn't play that bad. The o-line actually held up, but it doesn't matter because Bryce doesn't understand how to play behind one.

Biggest bust of all time and it only has potential to do worse depending on what the Bears do with the treasure trove of shit they got.
 
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Romang67

BitterSwede
Jan 2, 2011
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Wonder how much more leash he gets before Canales benches him.

Rookie HC ain't going to hitch his wagon to an objectively terrible QB. Especially when they already show shots of his teammates brushing him off/ignoring him.

Biggest bust of all time and it only has potential to do worse depending on what the Bears do with the treasure trove of shit they got.
If we're being honest though, what does replacing him with Dalton do? Maybe Dalton can be a playmaker (though it's been a while since he was above replacement level), but their defense is as big of an issue as the offense now.

Here is a list of Panthers players who made it into the backfield with some kind of consistency last season (10+ TFL OR 10+ QB hits OR 2+ Sacks):

Derrick Brown
Brian Burns
Frankie Luvu
Yetur Gross-Matos

Brown is out the rest of the season, Burns was traded, Luvu was signed by the Commies, Gross-Matos signed with the 49ers.

The Panthers completely gutted their defense to go all in on offense. Best case scenario, replacing Young with Dalton tells them that yes, offensively, Young is the problem. But unlike last year, you can't really pretend that isn't the case this season. I think they play Young unless he breaks, and even then they may roll him out to keep throwing.
 
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Blitzkrug

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If we're being honest though, what does replacing him with Dalton do? Maybe Dalton can be a playmaker (though it's been a while since he was above replacement level), but their defense is as big of an issue as the offense now.

Here is a list of Panthers players who made it into the backfield with some kind of consistency last season (10+ TFL OR 10+ QB hits OR 2+ Sacks):

Derrick Brown
Brian Burns
Frankie Luvu
Yetur Gross-Matos

Brown is out the rest of the season, Burns was traded, Luvu was signed by the Commies, Gross-Matos signed with the 49ers.

The Panthers completely gutted their defense to go all in on offense. Best case scenario, replacing Young with Dalton tells them that yes, offensively, Young is the problem. But unlike last year, you can't really pretend that isn't the case this season. I think they play Young unless he breaks, and even then they may roll him out to keep throwing.
I think at some point it becomes a locker room issue. If the team is acting like this only two games in, the hand might be forced.

And let me just say i'm not advocating Dalton as some massive upgrade. Like you said, he's been pretty low level for a long while now. It just might get to the point where literally anyone else makes the situation better.
 
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StreetHawk

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Sep 30, 2017
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Wonder how much more leash he gets before Canales benches him.

Rookie HC ain't going to hitch his wagon to an objectively terrible QB. Especially when they already show shots of his teammates brushing him off/ignoring him. Like the rest of the team around him didn't play that bad. The o-line actually held up, but it doesn't matter because Bryce doesn't understand how to play behind one.

Biggest bust of all time and it only has potential to do worse depending on what the Bears do with the treasure trove of shit they got.
No other option really. No sure what playing Dalton does for them aside from getting a win or two more. They need to find out if Young can play or not.

Carolina didn't draft well prior to trading for Young, and gave up assets to get Darnold, Corrall. Then add in the extra assets needed to go from 9 to 1. Moore, 1st and 2 seconds.

Said it then, I don't trade up for Young because his size scares me. If he's there when I pick, I'm ok with rolling the dice on him, but not giving up those premium assets on top to get him.
 

eXile3

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Dec 12, 2020
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No other option really. No sure what playing Dalton does for them aside from getting a win or two more. They need to find out if Young can play or not.

Carolina didn't draft well prior to trading for Young, and gave up assets to get Darnold, Corrall. Then add in the extra assets needed to go from 9 to 1. Moore, 1st and 2 seconds.

Said it then, I don't trade up for Young because his size scares me. If he's there when I pick, I'm ok with rolling the dice on him, but not giving up those premium assets on top to get him.

It’s not about getting a win or two more. It’s about getting a win or two. BY threw for 85 yards yesterday. His longest pass was 12 yards. And it’s not like this is an outlier.

The Panthers will still probably be picking somewhere in the top 3 but at least they stand a chance of looking like a professional football team and not losing every game.

They stick Dalton behind a good run game and some decent WRs and you can probably get a couple wins at least.
 

StreetHawk

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Sep 30, 2017
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Think Carolina needs to know if Young can play or not. If the answer is a no, you move on from him at the end of the season. Not sure what Car did in the pre season with their starters but they needed to play them for a few quarters.

Probably goes down as one of the worst trades of all time. RG3, Goff, Wentz trade ups at least gave the team a good season or 2.

And just as I hit post….. lol….
 
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StreetHawk

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I'm guessing they're benching because he's coming across as shook internally + you can't just keep letting the guy get boo'ed intensely at home.
Next game is in LV. Glad they have Pierce as Josh McDaniels raiders lost to Saturday a first time at any level HC coming out of ESPN and lost to Bagent at QB last season in his first career start.
 

Blitzkrug

Registered User
Sep 17, 2013
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For shits and giggles;

Games started by QB;

Ryan Leaf: 21 games started in 3 seasons. Drafted 1998, final game started in 2001

JaMarcus Russell: 25 games started in 3 seasons. Drafted 2007, final game started in 2009

Bryce Young: 18 games started in 2 seasons.

There's a non-zero chance Bryce's career as a started has burnt out before these guys. Incredible.
 
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