Speculation: Caps Roster General Discussion (Coaching/FAs/Cap/Lines/etc) | 2023-24 Regular Season Edition

[Cappy76]

Im not sure how the timing works out. But lets say Leonard goes to rookie and training camp and makes the team. Can he sign with the caps after camp and if he doesnt make the team go back to his college team?

I really cant see him signing without a roster spot locked in. I dont think hes leaving school for the AHL

If he signs he's no longer eligible to return to college.

 

[StrikingDistance]

Im not sure how the timing works out. But lets say Leonard goes to rookie and training camp and makes the team. Can he sign with the caps after camp and if he doesnt make the team go back to his college team?

I really cant see him signing without a roster spot locked in. I dont think hes leaving school for the AHL

He's not. That's part of the deal the Caps offer to attract him from obtaining his eduvacation.

 

[Ovechkins Wodka]

If he signs he's no longer eligible to return to college.

Right but does he have to sign before training camp? Can he have like a tryout and the preseason before leaving school?

 

[Cappy76]

Right but does he have to sign before training camp? Can he have like a tryout and the preseason before leaving school?

He's not able to participate in training camp if he's not under contract.

 

[Brian23]

I would 100% role the dice on a cheap Kakko acquisition. He 1000% feels like a Lavi dog house guy this year.

 

[trick9]

3 years ago, it's a different argument, but I think it's foolhardy today to trade a Connor McMichael for a false hope at another run with a guy like Marner (is this still who we're talking about?) -- the rest of the team is not equipped to make that run, particularly if you subtract some of the quality depth.

And the guy just finished his first full season of actually being given ice time. Would anyone be surprised if he developed into a Carter Verhaeghe or Joel Eriksson Ek (or Dylan Strome, for that matter) level player? Eriksson Ek feels like a pretty safe projection for CMM's eventual floor. Keep him and figure out other way's to add higher end talent

I'm sorry, what? Joel Eriksson-Ek is an elite defensive center and finished 10th in Selke -voting this season.

Floor? That'd be incredible.

 

[um]

I would 100% role the dice on a cheap Kakko acquisition. He 1000% feels like a Lavi dog house guy this year.

Sir we don't do Finns here. Learn the rules.

 

[ClevelandCapsfan]

I would 100% role the dice on a cheap Kakko acquisition. He 1000% feels like a Lavi dog house guy this year.

He was in the Rangers doghouse long before Lavi arrived.

 

[traparatus]

For all those thinking "we can't compete for a Cup without a star that is drafted high"...

Fair to say Stars are Cup competitive, and their top three scorers are...

Johnston - or 27th pick (Sandin)
Hintz - 49th pick
Robertson- 39th pick

Also Robertson had 17 goals in his first full NHL season... that was only 51 games... but I assume they are happy they didn't trade him after that year for "someone with more upside".

That's why we shouldn't rush to move CMM (18 goals in 80 games) until you really know his upside, and that should be only after another year or two at the earliest. And no I'm not saying CMM is going to be Robertson - just that we need a longer look before truly knowing his upside.

Robertson had 45 points in 51 games in his first season. That's miles off anything that any Caps prospect has produced.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

I'm still trying to figure out what Groupon has to do with anything here?

Ted has been on their BOD forever, currently Chairman and was co-CEO briefly long ago…..it’s definitely a weird thing for a poster to hyper focus on….

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

3 years ago, it's a different argument, but I think it's foolhardy today to trade a Connor McMichael for a false hope at another run with a guy like Marner (is this still who we're talking about?) -- the rest of the team is not equipped to make that run, particularly if you subtract some of the quality depth.

And the guy just finished his first full season of actually being given ice time. Would anyone be surprised if he developed into a Carter Verhaeghe or Joel Eriksson Ek (or Dylan Strome, for that matter) level player? Eriksson Ek feels like a pretty safe projection for CMM's eventual floor. Keep him and figure out other way's to add higher end talent

JEE is an elite defensive center — probably one of the five best defensive centers in the world — and Verhaeghe scored 40 goals last season. I’ll do cartwheels in a McMichael jersey if he reaches the level of those two.

I like McMike and think he’ll be a strong middle six center for years but his ceiling is more of a Vinny Trochek or a Sam Bennett in my opinion. Two fine players for sure and guys you can win a Cup with but not quite at that top of the lineup level.

 

[Misery74]

Leonard signing next year would make next year something fun to look forward too. Was basically only looking forward to seeing Miro and Iorio next year.

Lappy keeps getting better. Adding Leonard too would be amazing

 

[StrikingDistance]

I would 100% role the dice on a cheap Kakko acquisition. He 1000% feels like a Lavi dog house guy this year.

TBH, he was in the doghouse pre-Lavi. Generally speaking, he's often referred to as Kraapo Kakko. Butttt, he was also previously coached by a bunch of old-heads, so maybe he has yet to reach potential. But yeah, don't think the Caps are going to start the Finn-Russo Winter War again...

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

Don’t think the Caps are in a position to look down their nose at any potential forwards. Strome didn’t fully develop into what he is until his third team and his eighth season. If the Caps are serious about a retool and being competitive they need to take chances.

Don’t get the Marner hate from an on-ice perspective. He’d instantly be this team’s best forward the moment he landed in Washington.

 

[Langway]

I like McMike and think he’ll be a strong middle six center for years but his ceiling is more of a Vinny Trochek or a Sam Bennett in my opinion. Two fine players for sure and guys you can win a Cup with but not quite at that top of the lineup level.

He'll need to develop a fair amount of grit to amount to those two. At 23 it's not like physical immaturity should still be an excuse. He's going to need to continue not just getting stronger but also developing the mentality to play more fearless and determined. He debuted on the PK this season and it's not a bad start. But he's got a way to go all-around. I probably see him as more of a McCann or Ryan Strome ultimately. Sort of crafty but a bit of a 2C lite. Even that may be optimistic if he doesn't make some key adjustments.

While I agree the Caps shouldn't be turning their noses down on potential I also don't think they ought to be too heavily into more reclamation projects. If marquee talent isn't available to them, fine, but I don't think they ought to throw their extra 2's and 3's at a generic available younger player sort of for the sake of it. Maybe in isolation more moves along those lines are sensible. Value is value...but in terms of the whole it'd be underwhelming.

Adding Leonard may be the best move they can realistically make this off-season. But I'm not sure it's a lock even with Smith signing. BTW I think Smith signing first from that trio makes him the de facto alpha of that group. Sorry, Lendawg. You had your chance.

 

[DWGie26]

Make no mistake. We are in a rebuild (disguised as a retool). Sure it is not with 5 top 10 picks and years of misery but look at the age of our lineup with Protas, McMichael, Lapierre, Leonard, Miro. Heck even Milano and Malenstyn are 27. And then Fever, Sandin, and Alexyev on defense with Iorio and Chesley waiting in the wings when we can rid the old RD in Jensen and TVR. JC74 still elite. Marner does fit in well if we can get him because Toronto panics and can’t find a buyer. They need to free up space.

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

Make no mistake. We are in a rebuild (disguised as a retool). Sure it is not with 5 top 10 picks and years of misery but look at the age of our lineup with Protas, McMichael, Lapierre, Leonard, Miro. Heck even Milano and Malenstyn are 27. And then Fever, Sandin, and Alexyev on defense with Iorio and Chesley waiting in the wings when we can rid the old RD in Jensen and TVR. JC74 still elite. Marner does fit in well if we can get him because Toronto panics and can’t find a buyer. They need to free up space.

Chicago, San Jose, and Anaheim are rebuilds. The Caps just made the playoffs. They are not the same. They are very mid, as the kids say, and certainly are a regression candidate next season but you’re not a full blown rebuild if you’re making the playoffs. Besides last year, the Caps haven’t picked in the top ten since 2007 and the last time they even picked in the teens was 2013. They’re certainly on the downswing and may be in for a rebuild at some point but I don’t think they’re there yet.

Or maybe we have different definitions of rebuilds, which is fine.

 

[Nice]

I think Leonard is more ready for the NHL than Smith is. I hope he reconsiders. I wonder if Smith would've stayed at BC if the sharks hadn't won the draft lotto

 

[DWGie26]

Chicago, San Jose, and Anaheim are rebuilds. The Caps just made the playoffs. They are not the same. They are very mid, as the kids say, and certainly are a regression candidate next season but you’re not a full blown rebuild if you’re making the playoffs. Besides last year, the Caps haven’t picked in the top ten since 2007 and the last time they even picked in the teens was 2013. They’re certainly on the downswing and may be in for a rebuild at some point but I don’t think they’re there yet.

Or maybe we have different definitions of rebuilds, which is fine.

I think we see it very similarly. A rebuild is turning over the roster and getting younger.

My point is, what started as a retool turned into a rebuild. We have a lot of good (not great) assets. They could mature into the next generation of caps in 2-3 years without being Chicago, San Jose or Anaheim. But the roster has been rebuilt with Backstrom, Kuzy, and now perhaps Oshie out. Lots of young, internally developed talent (and a couple of free pickups and a trade). They won’t be the Dallas stars next year, but they are on their way.

I see the caps having two options (and I’m not totally sure which i want):
1. Go full youth movement and be competitive for OV last couple of years and potentially have a dangerous, established team in a 2-3 years.
2. Trade some of the assets (players and picks) to get 1-3 established stars and run for the cup in the next couple of years

both would be fun. Option 2 will be a roller coaster ride, but if your pieces are Reinhart and or Marner maybe it is smoother.

but there are options. Two paths the way i see it.

 

[Misery74]

I think we see it very similarly. A rebuild is turning over the roster and getting younger.

My point is, what started as a retool turned into a rebuild. We have a lot of good (not great) assets. They could mature into the next generation of caps in 2-3 years without being Chicago, San Jose or Anaheim. But the roster has been rebuilt with Backstrom, Kuzy, and now perhaps Oshie out. Lots of young, internally developed talent (and a couple of free pickups and a trade). They won’t be the Dallas stars next year, but they are on their way.

I see the caps having two options (and I’m not totally sure which i want):
1. Go full youth movement and be competitive for OV last couple of years and potentially have a dangerous, established team in a 2-3 years.
2. Trade some of the assets (players and picks) to get 1-3 established stars and run for the cup in the next couple of years

both would be fun. Option 2 will be a roller coaster ride, but if your pieces are Reinhart and or Marner maybe it is smoother.

but there are options. Two paths the way i see it.

Reinhart is a UFA. Marner is not.

I’m not comfortable give up assets.

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

He'll need to develop a fair amount of grit to amount to those two. At 23 it's not like physical immaturity should still be an excuse. He's going to need to continue not just getting stronger but also developing the mentality to play more fearless and determined. He debuted on the PK this season and it's not a bad start. But he's got a way to go all-around. I probably see him as more of a McCann or Ryan Strome ultimately. Sort of crafty but a bit of a 2C lite. Even that may be optimistic if he doesn't make some key adjustments.

While I agree the Caps shouldn't be turning their noses down on potential I also don't think they ought to be too heavily into more reclamation projects. If marquee talent isn't available to them, fine, but I don't think they ought to throw their extra 2's and 3's at a generic available younger player sort of for the sake of it. Maybe in isolation more moves along those lines are sensible. Value is value...but in terms of the whole it'd be underwhelming.

Adding Leonard may be the best move they can realistically make this off-season. But I'm not sure it's a lock even with Smith signing. BTW I think Smith signing first from that trio makes him the de facto alpha of that group. Sorry, Lendawg. You had your chance.

McMike has a ways to go — I was positing that his ceiling is probably a strong two-way center who can pot 20-25 goals and take on hard matchups defensively, plus play on both special teams units. He doesn’t have the asshole factor that Trochek and Bennett have but maybe he can find some hate deep within. He’s still a good young player on both sides of the puck and just understands hockey and I don’t really get the calls to trade him.

I’m not looking for them to throw a 2nd round pick around for a Panik type talent but if there’s a legitimate hockey trade to be made they should be looking for deals. Bennett was traded for a 2nd and a mediocre prospect. Again if the Leafs are dumb enough to give a 90-point player away for cents on the dollar to force a change then the Caps should be aggressive given the cap space they’ll have if Oshie’s career goes tits up. Buchnevich, Zegras, Marchessault all have had some smoke around them at various points since the TDL. Buch is 29 and Marchessault is 33 so they may be too old for their timeframe but wouldn’t hurt to kick the tires. Need to do a bit more digging to see what cap casualties could be available.

They shouldn’t be making deals for the sake of making deals because that’s normally a surefire way to waste assets on an inevitably poor return but there is a lot of white space on the paper for them to draw on — more so than in any other offseason in recent memory.

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

Reinhart is a UFA. Marner is not.

I’m not comfortable give up assets.

I have little interest in Reinhart. Maybe I need to do more investigating but it seems like he’s making his money on the PP in the bumper spot and I’m not sure I want to pay for his heater this year. Prior to his explosion this year his previous career high was 33 goals. He also plays the same position as Leonard and Wilson. Feels like they could use that money on a better fit, even if he comes without having to use assets to get him. I could be totally wrong here but that’s kind of my gut feeling.

 

[kicksavedave]

Ted has been on their BOD forever, currently Chairman and was co-CEO briefly long ago…..it’s definitely a weird thing for a poster to hyper focus on….

I get Ted's resume, just still have no idea why it matters to this discussion. Ted has been an excellent hockey owner. Almost always spent to the Cap and paid to keep the players we needed to keep. 3rd most points in the league since he took over a team about to fall into a full rebuild in 2000.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

I get Ted's resume, just still have no idea why it matters to this discussion. Ted has been an excellent hockey owner. Almost always spent to the Cap and paid to keep the players we needed to keep. 3rd most points in the league since he took over a team about to fall into a full rebuild in 2000.

Dude was just rambling about him lol…

 

[bacchist]

I have little interest in Reinhart. Maybe I need to do more investigating but it seems like he’s making his money on the PP in the bumper spot and I’m not sure I want to pay for his heater this year. Prior to his explosion this year his previous career high was 33 goals. He also plays the same position as Leonard and Wilson. Feels like they could use that money on a better fit, even if he comes without having to use assets to get him. I could be totally wrong here but that’s kind of my gut feeling.

What's wrong with picking up a 30 goal guy that's good on the power play? I don't want to overpay, either. But if there aren't any other obviously better options to spend the money on, does it even matter all that much at the end of the day?

I don't know what "fit" means when we have one of the worst offenses in the league.