g00n
Retired Global Mod
- Nov 22, 2007
- 31,046
- 15,468
It is two different things. I may like it or not it doesn't make the rule good. The same goes for you. You may like it or not, this rule is bad.
Your opinion.
It is two different things. I may like it or not it doesn't make the rule good. The same goes for you. You may like it or not, this rule is bad.
We are lucky, We can discuss our opinions freely. And no politburo bolshevik here to oppress us.Your opinion.
Certainly a lot of American politics though. "Most people", "believe me, this is a bad thing", "prove it so I can ignore it", turning it into a war against stats instead of clutter and accessibility.We are lucky, We can discuss our opinions freely. And no politburo bolshevik here to oppress us.
This "clutter and accessibility" is a fabricated argument. Nothing in the @twabby post was "clutter and accessibility" offending. It was hypocritic to bring it here.Certainly a lot of American politics though. "Most people", "believe me, this is a bad thing", "prove it so I can ignore it", turning it into a war against stats instead of clutter and accessibility.
You misunderstand. It's an issue of the thread and walls of graphics. It makes it very hard to have other conversations. But whatever. It's our rule and will be enforced.This "clutter and accessibility" is a fabricated argument. Nothing in the @twabby post was "clutter and accessibility" offending. It was hypocritic to bring it here.
This is the final time I will say this: stats are not prohibited in the general thread. But pages and pages of graphs and walls of text must go to the stat thread or if it's only one chart-heavy post, use colapse tags. You can link in the general thread to the stat post too. This is our rule. It has been in place for ~7 years. That is all.I enjoy Twabby's posts with the graphs because he takes the time to explain them and is honest about their limitations or weaknesses. I have learned a lot, to be honest.
I certainly don't see eye to eye on all things (ie Tom Wilson) but I think it is a bit of a mistake to segregate his analytics to one thread. Then you'll have one sided opinions on certain subjects. (Kuz)
The forum will be poorer, for it. Just my opinion, of course.
This is the final.time I will say this: stats are not prohibited in the general thread. But pages and pages of graphs and walls of text must go to the stat thread or if it's only one chart-heavy post, use colapse tags. You can link in the general thread to the stat post too. This is our rule. It has been in place for ~7 years. That is all.
Yes, let’s make the majority of posters here go to a non stats thread instead of the stat nerds going to a thread that’s already on the forum. Makes sense!Perhaps there should be a thread for those who refuse to read analytics, rather than attempting to stifle legitimate roster discussion? The stat haters can have their own safe space.
Jesus just use the collapse function and this won’t be an issue. This site already is borderline unreadable on mobile and posts with multiple charts and graphs make it so much worseSo again, why isn't there an intangibles thread? Why isn't there an eye-test thread? Why isn't there an appeal to authority thread? Those aren't typically my favorite types of arguments, but I'm perfectly willing to either engage with them or ignore them in this thread and am not asking them to be cast off somewhere else.
How do I engage with people who make a claim in this thread that I disagree (or agree) with? Ask them to go to the stats thread (which they may or may not do) and then merge the discussion from that thread back into this thread? It's unnecessarily tedious, when the alternative is to just ask people to either scroll past analytics posts or simply put me or others on ignore.
Something tells me that if the majority of the recent analytics discussion was focused on Zdeno Chara and how he's been really good, or if I was making the argument that Kuznetsov has been bad that we wouldn't be having this discussion about moving it to the stats thread. It's only because the current discussion is about a polarizing figure in Kuznetsov where I'm taking the unpopular side that I'm being asked to go to a different thread.
Sorry, this seems like a bunch of crap and I'd prefer to keep discussing it here.
I've put on my ignore list ~ten 13yo Kuzy haters and useless trolls including one mod and now my experience on these boards is so good. It is night and day. No need to read all these jalous nervous p**ps trolls do then thet hear Kuzy name or someone say something on their foreverhurt God Nicklas Backslow
I feel like if you can’t make your case in a decent paragraph or 2, you’re spinning your wheels and wasting everyone’s valuable time.
If the diversionary tactics/whataboutisms were removed, intellectual succinctness would be achieved and appreciated by all.
and FWIW that mod who made the stat rule was a total diiiiick, but he ran a tight ship!
I hate to point out the irony of this, but didn't you and several others spend about 30 pages arguing about COVID vaccinations
And then another 30 arguing about the Wilson hit? If ever there was a benchmark for failing to make a case succinctly, surely that was it?
I’ve never once made a single post made up of two entire screens full of eye bleeding charts and graphs and mind numbing analysis.....
so yeah. Anything else?
That’s the point of this all isn’t it....back and forth is fine.....gigantic posts filled with stuff that makes following the conversation taxing or even unbearable is what people seem to be taking issue with here today.
I’m not even at the forefront of this....the Mods are handling it....don’t like it, address it with them.
This is the final time I will say this: stats are not prohibited in the general thread. But pages and pages of graphs and walls of text must go to the stat thread or if it's only one chart-heavy post, use colapse tags. You can link in the general thread to the stat post too. This is our rule. It has been in place for ~7 years. That is all.
This is the final time I will say this: stats are not prohibited in the general thread. But pages and pages of graphs and walls of text must go to the stat thread or if it's only one chart-heavy post, use colapse tags. You can link in the general thread to the stat post too. This is our rule. It has been in place for ~7 years. That is all.
The hfcaps board. It’s a local rule that was put in place about 7 years ago in response to requests from multiple posters (not by me). See the pinned “Local Rules” thread for more info.Out of curiosity, who are the 'we' in 'this is our rule?
I see.The hfcaps board. It’s a local rule that was put in place about 7 years ago in response to requests from multiple posters (not by me). See the pinned “Local Rules” thread for more info.
Ok.In an attempt to try to figure out how to judge Kuznetsov's xGF% based on zone start ratio, I made a scatterplot based on data from Evolving Hockey:
View attachment 408186
This is every player-season from 2014-15 until now, with a minimum of 250 minutes played (since Kuznetsov is just above 250 minutes this year at 5v5, that is why I chose the cutoff at 250).
The x-axis is the zone start ratio. Players further to the left get heavy defensive zone starts, and players on the right get a lot of offensive zone starts.
The y-axis is the xGF%. Higher is better, 50% is average.
Circled in red is Kuznetsov from this season. He is certainly getting a ton of o-zone starts, but based on the rest of the plot doesn't it seem like despite getting these soft starts he's doing well with them? At the very least it seems difficult to make the case that he's doing poorly with these starts.
LOL. [mod edit]Perhaps there should be a thread for those who refuse to read analytics, rather than attempting to stifle legitimate roster discussion? The stat haters can have their own safe space.
I know that guy!!!Some jerkwad powermad mod addressed this in the OP of the fancy stats thread years ago:
View attachment 408237
LOL. I enjoyed and agreed with this. Well said. And I mean it.The fancy stats are trash. Someone needed to say this. All for sending them on another board, let alone another thread.
I see.
Seems to me that while Caps have enjoyed a prolonged period of success, this discussion board remains one of the least active on HF. I am all in favor of long, well-reasoned and coherently formulated posts, even if they do contain some offensive graphs. It generates hockey discussion on a discussion board were more often than not nobody has anything to say.
Just my opinion, though I'm not sure it counts for anything.