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Speculation: Caps General Discussion (Coaching/FAs/Cap/Lines etc) - 2021 Off-Season Pt. 2

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txpd said:
Not really. More info is required but if the Ovechkin that exploded at Samsonov in full few of the cameras is what results from Kuzy's behavior and that result is common thru the locker room, what comes may well resemble what happens when a coach loses the room.

We know next to nothing. We know Kuzy missed a team function and got a disciplinary scratch. He then got COVID and missed playoff games. We saw Ovechkin's uncharacteristic behavior. We heard MacLellan say Kuzy needed to be the best player he can be or decisions would be made. He said Kuzy hurt the team. Maybe Oshie and Ov and Backstrom and Wilson dont really give a shit if Kuzy is trying or not. Maybe after taking pain killing shots and playing with pain it really pisses them off. Who knows? I dont. I certainly can understand after 3 years of trying to get him back on the program with no success and watching their careers ticking away, that they have had enough.

If that were the case, do you think keeping him works at all?

Thats possibly the choice you are facing.
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That's why I said unless it's an absolute must you have to move him. That would definitely count as a must trade scenario in my book. If the leadership, Ovie, or the lockerroom wants him gone.
 
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tenken00 said:
That's why I said unless it's an absolute must you have to move him. That would definitely count as a must trade scenario in my book. If the leadership, Ovie, or the lockerroom wants him gone.
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I really dont think the Caps will trade Kuzy because they want to. I think it will be a have to. If it happens. I also think the leash will be very short
 
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If Kuznetsov stays then he needs to have a season comparable if not better than '17/'18 when he scored 27 goals and 56 assists. Anything less than that would be unacceptable for a 7.8 player. He will be this season's whipping boy for sure and he'll have to return to form from a few years ago to get out of the dog house as far as I'm concerned. In essence he will have to carry this team a bit.
 
BiPolar Caps said:
If Kuznetsov stays then he needs to have a season comparable if not better than '17/'18 when he scored 27 goals and 56 assists.
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So I guess a big question here is who honestly BELIEVES that Kuznetsov is going to have a rebound season comparable (if not better) than his magical/career-best '17/'18 run? Not hopes, or wishes, or prays he will. And not anything along the lines of, "Well I'd rather gamble on that happening than gambling on what'd happen after a trade."

I mean, straight-up, a show of hands of those who actually believe it's going to happen. (And, if so... why, given what he's actually shown the last few seasons?)
 
HeyMattyB said:
So I guess a big question here is who honestly BELIEVES that Kuznetsov is going to have a rebound season comparable (if not better) than his magical/career-best '17/'18 run? Not hopes, or wishes, or prays he will. And not anything along the lines of, "Well I'd rather gamble on that happening than gambling on what'd happen after a trade."

I mean, straight-up, a show of hands of those who actually believe it's going to happen. (And, if so... why, given what he's actually shown the last few seasons?)
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There lies the issue with many of the Capitals fan base. They're still valuing Kuznetsov strictly on that one year's performance and not any of his more recent seasons. They believe any trades involving Kuzy has to be for a similar player to the Kuznetsov of 17/18. Whereas my weighted value on a trade involving Kuznetsov would be more on how much cap space would be created by the transaction. Thus trading Kuzy straight up for a Ryan Strome. Strome's past two seasons has been just as good as Kuzy's and he's in the last year of a 4.5 contract.
 
BiPolar Caps said:
There lies the issue with many of the Capitals fan base. They're still valuing Kuznetsov strictly on that one year's performance and not any of his more recent seasons. They believe any trades involving Kuzy has to be for a similar player to the Kuznetsov of 17/18. Whereas my weighted value on a trade involving Kuznetsov would be more on how much cap space would be created by the transaction. Thus trading Kuzy straight up for a Ryan Strome. Strome's past two seasons has been just as good as Kuzy's and he's in the last year of a 4.5 contract.
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Would the Caps and Rangers even swap centers with each other as divisional rivals? I guess its possible but both are competing for the same playoff spots. Would be kinda unexpected.
 
Hivemind said:
I think a 60-70 point season for Kuzy is a reasonable expectation, and would right in line with what $7.8M buys in free agency.
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This seems like a reasonable expectation to me as well. That said, it sounds like your answer to my specific question is, "No. No I do not believe Kuznetsov is going to have a rebound season comparable (if not better) than his magical/career-best '17/'18 run." Which is fine. Honestly, I'd be surprised if anyone here thinks he will.

I'd ask, "Don't you think $7.8M should, in addition to getting you 60-70 points, get you a player who can win a faceoff and play a 200-foot game and isn't a defensive liability?" But, to be fair, IIRC he couldn't win a faceoff and didn't play a 200-foot game back in 2017-2018, either. So that's kind of beside the point, if I'm asking about the likelihood of him repeating that season's success.
 
tenken00 said:
Would the Caps and Rangers even swap centers with each other as divisional rivals? I guess its possible but both are competing for the same playoff spots. Would be kinda unexpected.
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I think Drury still wants Eichel, but Kuzy could be a back up option with the idea of him being a linemate for the bread man.
 
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BiPolar Caps said:
I think Drury still wants Eichel, but Kuzy could be a back up option with the idea of him being a linemate for the bread man.
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Oof. Imagine facing a heated Kuzy who wants to beat the Caps bad 4 times a year. Would rather trade him out West if it comes down to that lol.
 
HeyMattyB said:
This seems like a reasonable expectation to me as well. That said, it sounds like your answer to my specific question is, "No. No I do not believe Kuznetsov is going to have a rebound season comparable (if not better) than his magical/career-best '17/'18 run." Which is fine. Honestly, I'd be surprised if anyone here thinks he will.

I'd ask, "Don't you think $7.8M should, in addition to getting you 60-70 points, get you a player who can win a faceoff and play a 200-foot game and isn't a defensive liability?" But, to be fair, IIRC he couldn't win a faceoff and didn't play a 200-foot game back in 2017-2018, either. So that's kind of beside the point, if I'm asking about the likelihood of him repeating that season's success.
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Barring something like an Eichel trade out of nowhere, I think we’re not likely to get better use out of the $7.8M than we will out Kuznetsov. I think it’s possible, albeit unlikely, he matches his 2015-19 stretch, and the Capitals need a center that’s capable of taking over games if they want a deep run.

The Caps are going to be underdogs from here on out until the Ovie era ends. We aren’t going to be one of the top 3 or 4 or 5 teams to win the Cup anymore. We may not even be one of the top 3 teams in the division. In order for an underdog to make a run, they need some players that are capable of popping off and upsetting a better overall team. Backstrom isn’t really that player anymore. Ovie can still do it on rare occasion, but it’s less and less common as he ages and becomes more of a complimentary scorer within his line rather than the play driver. Kuzy doesn’t do it every night, but he gives the Caps a weapon capable of it. He’s a big part of why the Capitals could have a punchers chance.
 
You know what I liked about Matty Perreault when he was a Capital, his effort. Hell, I remember when Ovie was suspended for a game and all PRO did was score a hat trick. Perreault of course never had the talent that Kuzy has, but then again I don't ever recall PRO taking a night off
 
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BiPolar Caps said:
You know what I liked about Matty Perreault when he was a Capital, his effort. Hell, I remember when Ovie was suspended for a game and all PRO did was score a hat trick. Perreault of course never had the talent that Kuzy has, but then again I don't ever recall PRO taking a night off
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If we had someone with Kuzy's talent and Perreault's work ethic, we wouldn't even be having this discussion. More like talking about which championship ring had more bling!
 
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I wish I had a better memory, and could offer a relatively accurate breakdown of Kuzzy's play the last three seasons in terms of:

Games in which Kuznetsov popped off
vs
Games in which Kuznetsov played... acceptable
vs
Games in which Kuznetsov was lazy/listless and/or a detriment to the team.

Especially during the last three playoffs seasons.
 
Hivemind said:
Barring something like an Eichel trade out of nowhere, I think we’re not likely to get better use out of the $7.8M than we will out Kuznetsov. I think it’s possible, albeit unlikely, he matches his 2015-19 stretch, and the Capitals need a center that’s capable of taking over games if they want a deep run.

The Caps are going to be underdogs from here on out until the Ovie era ends. We aren’t going to be one of the top 3 or 4 or 5 teams to win the Cup anymore. We may not even be one of the top 3 teams in the division. In order for an underdog to make a run, they need some players that are capable of popping off and upsetting a better overall team. Backstrom isn’t really that player anymore. Ovie can still do it on rare occasion, but it’s less and less common as he ages and becomes more of a complimentary scorer within his line rather than the play driver. Kuzy doesn’t do it every night, but he gives the Caps a weapon capable of it. He’s a big part of why the Capitals could have a punchers chance.
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Maybe I am misunderstanding. The Caps lost the division last season on a tie breaker. You are saying they drop from that to a playoff bubble team?
 
txpd said:
Maybe I am misunderstanding. The Caps lost the division last season on a tie breaker. You are saying they drop from that to a playoff bubble team?
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Yes. Add the Hurricanes back to the division, improvements from New York without David Quinn, and they don’t get to spend 25% of the season beating up on the Sabres and Devils anymore
 
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