Confirmed with Link: Canes officially match l'offre hostile from MTL for Aho

[My Special Purpose]

Let's say that Laine's agent comes to us and says that if we put the same offer sheet in front of Laine that MTL put in front of Aho, he'll sign it.

Should we do it?

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

Let's say that Laine's agent comes to us and says that if we put the same offer sheet in front of Laine that MTL put in front of Aho, he'll sign it.

Should we do it?

Yup.

Laine at $8.5m would definitely make Winnipeg squirm after the season he had.

 

[Lempo]

Let's say that Laine's agent comes to us and says that if we put the same offer sheet in front of Laine that MTL put in front of Aho, he'll sign it.

Should we do it?

We would be stupid if we didn't. S, P, U, T ,E, D, stupid!

 

[zman77]

 

[GoldiFox]

Give Laine $9 million as a small display of dominance. He's worth the two 1sts.

 

[Chrispy]

But in 99 percent of situations, there is no offer sheet. I'm not sure why we need to realize anything, other than Bergevin is an idiot.

GMs look at this and see Bergevin as a dupe. Players and agents see Aho and his agent as a genius. I think a lot more agents will proactively go for offer sheets in the future when in a stalemate.

The question is whether other GMs besides Bergevin will help them out. I think some will for the chance at the player.

 

[CanesFanBudMan]

Give Laine $9 million as a small display of dominance. He's worth the two 1sts.

Same AVV as Aho, but over 6 years

 

[zman77]

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Same AVV as Aho, but over 6 years

That becomes 4 first round pick territory though.

 

[BB88]

I'm not sure I like your attitude.





The "shouldn't have come to this" and "resorting to an offer sheet" narratives are frankly, pi$$ing me off. The Canes did nothing that TOR, WPG, PHI, COL, and TBL are doing with their high-profile RFAs. It is not Carolina's fault that Marc Bergevin is an idiot. Carolina didn't ask for this, and they didn't "have it coming." They tried to deal with their superstar RFA the same way every other team dealt with theirs, but Montreal blew all that up by sticking their noses where it didn't belong.

Reports say that Point was the original MTL target. If he signs, the BriseBois is the one being told it shouldn't have come to this, and being accused of putting Point in position where he felt an offer sheet was necessary.

The *entire* Carolina narrative here is based on something *they didn't do*! Montreal did it.

You had your franchise player ready to sign a steal on signing day and move on, why it should have never ended up in this.

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

That becomes 4 first round pick territory though.

Still 2 1sts, a 2nd, and a 3rd, I believe. 4 1sts territory is ~$10.5m, so you get ~$52.5m over the course of the contract (no matter how many years over 5) before you do 4 1sts.

So, the max 6 year deal before 4 1sts is ~$8.75m.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Still 2 1sts, a 2nd, and a 3rd, I believe. 4 1sts territory is ~$10.5m, so you get ~$52.5m over the course of the contract (no matter how many years over 5) before you do 4 1sts.

So, the max 6 year deal before 4 1sts is ~$8.75m.

Sorry, I misread his post. I saw the $9M number above and quickly just read the 6 years on that post (and missed the Aho AAV) so my post was aimed at $9M / 6 years due to not being able to read.

$9M over 6 years would be 4 firsts.
You are correct though, same AAV as Aho at 6 years would be two 1sts, one 2nd, and one 3rd.

 

[Lempo]

*THAT WAS OUR PLAN*

We wanted Aho to get more and more stressed out over the course of the summer about this turning into a Nylander-type situation that he was willing to go to six years, then seven, then eight. It's called negotiating. It's called leverage. And the fact that Aho was concerned enough to seek out an offer sheet probably means it could have worked, too.

I certainly didn't want to reward him for 80 point season and ECF by ruining his summer.

And I don't want him under pressure, but on ice. Ice, baby!

 

[CanesFanBudMan]

Sorry, I misread his post. I saw the $9M number above and quickly just read the 6 years on that post (and missed the Aho AAV) so my post was aimed at $9M / 6 years due to not being able to read.

$9M over 6 years would be 4 firsts.
You are correct though, same AAV as Aho at 6 years would be two 1sts, one 2nd, and one 3rd.

Would not want to give him a better contract than Aho and that package sneaks just under the 4 firsts compensation. Although it seems to me that if there was a chance they would not match a trade for his RFA rights would be a better option.

 

[vorbis]

I get that it was the case. I said it was the case. Again, I understand why Aho did what he did. I'm not sure why you continue to miss my point. This is my own tweet from within hours after l'offre hostile hit:



The fact that Aho basically admitted all of this is irrelevant.

My point is that even if the path we were on would have lead to certain death and destruction and certain death and destruction *only*, it was the path *we* chose. And we have every right to choose it.

The offer sheet can only be used as a ploy to keep negotiations from going into the season *if another team offers it*. My problem is not with Aho, and it's not with Dundon/Waddell. It's with Montreal, which gave our player a way to work around our plans -- even if our plans sucked. If Aho was worried about a Nylander situation, didn't want it lasting through the summer, and *didn't get an offer sheet*, it's possible he'd have caved, and we'd have signed him to a non-bonus-laden, eight-year, $72 million deal by now.

All Montreal did was take away *our* right to negotiate with *our* player.

TOR, COL, TBL, WGP, PHI and others have chosen their path in negotiations with their high-profile RFAs, and to this point, they have been allowed by the rest of the league to stay on that path. It could very well be that at least one of them has chosen their path very poorly. But that is their right, and their choice.

Our path was chosen by Montreal. The fact that it ended up being an OK path doesn't change the fact that it is *not* the path we wanted, and it doesn't necessarily mean it was a *better* path. Like I said, our path could have ended up working out even better for us. But we'll never know.

unrelated to your compelling point, I clicked on your twitter and we have one common follower. and I’m kind of itching to know how you know my weirdass buddy Jay who went to UNC, worked at Video Bar back in the day, and a whole bunch of other mischievous and strange stuff that I probably shouldn’t divulge on a random internet forum. did not expect to see his name pop up as someone we have in common.

 

[Lempo]

All Montreal did was take away *our* right to negotiate with *our* player.

If we got that right, and MTL was supposed to respect our right, we are in collusion. Because the CBA is very explicit that MB and Aho got the right to do what they did, and we in fact don't got a right in the CBA that would negate it. It may not be how the game has been played, but the rule is right there in the book.

He was a Free Agent. And apparently he didn't like being one.

 

[My Special Purpose]

my weirdass buddy Jay

He sounds just like *my* weirdass buddy Jay! He and I worked at IBM together around 2005. Strange dude, but in a good way. Just a lot of fun to be around.

 

[My Special Purpose]

If we got that right, and MTL was supposed to respect our right, we are in collusion. Because the CBA is very explicit that MB and Aho got the right to do what they did, and we in fact don't got a right in the CBA that would negate it. It may not be how the game has been played, but the rule is right there in the book.

He was a Free Agent. And apparently he didn't like being one.

OK, and *again* ... I'm quite certain Marner, Rantanen, Laine, Point and Provorov *want* their deals done sooner than later as well. Why did MTL choose to disrupt our plans and not theirs?

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

OK, and *again* ... I'm quite certain Marner, Rantanen, Laine, Point and Provorov *want* their deals done sooner than later as well. Why did MTL choose to disrupt our plans and not theirs?

I think there are a few potential reasons.

1) the agent was pushing this and maybe has a favorable relationship with Bergevin. He's the agent for Point also and reports said they did try/consider to offer him first. He's a common link in this.
2) the Canes were viewed, incorrectly, as "ripe for the picking". The Habs were sold on the premise that that the upfront money would be problematic so they had a chance. Hard to sell that on these other guys/teams.
3) And maybe Aho is more cutthroat than these other guys and had the gumption to actually go through with it as a negotiating tactic. Until now, the other guys haven't been willing.
4) MTL wanted a center, first and foremost, and the only 2 guys that are centers are Aho and Point.

 

[Roboturner913]

You had your franchise player ready to sign a steal on signing day and move on, why it should have never ended up in this.

Why don't you go lecture at somebody else, like all those other teams with pending RFAs that are still unsigned.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

MTL fans (at least one of them) are insisting that they know for sure that it was all about money and if more money was offered, Aho would have easily signed a longer term deal. That "may" be the case, but given how he asked for a 5 year deal and he got MTL to agree to offer a 5 year deal, I don't think "more money" was the only motivating factor here. Not to mention there will be a new CBA and a likely higher cap in 5 years so he's going to likely make a boatload of money on his next deal.

If I was a 21 year old in his position, it's very unlikely I'd sign an 8 year deal with a team. A lot can change in 5 years and I wouldn't want to be locked into 1 contract for all of my prime years. If the Canes have another playoff drought (and I don't think they will), I'd want the flexibility to choose my next spot sooner, rather than later.

 

[Roboturner913]

OK, and *again* ... I'm quite certain Marner, Rantanen, Laine, Point and Provorov *want* their deals done sooner than later as well. Why did MTL choose to disrupt our plans and not theirs?

Well, I think it's obvious why. They thought they could take advantage of the "poor" "cash-strapped" and "cheap" Carolina Hurricanes.

 

[DaveG]

New CBA in the coming couple years, new US TV deal in 3 years with the next projected one expected to go up at least a billion over a similar 10 year term. Extremely smart on his part to stick to a 5 year deal in this situation.

 

[Roboturner913]

MTL fans (at least one of them) are insisting that they know for sure that it was all about money and if more money was offered, Aho would have easily signed a longer term deal.

Well, of course they're saying that.

They're also saying the second he becomes UFA in five years he's on a jet to Montreal to fulfill his longtime dream of playing for the Habs.

They'll say any goddamned thing at this point because they don't want to admit their prestigious, 24-cups-having, hallowed-mecca-of-hockey franchise is just another mediocre team who got used by a player who would rather play for a team in the south.

Too bad, so sad, your dad

 

[My Special Purpose]

Well, I think it's obvious why. They thought they could take advantage of the "poor" "cash-strapped" and "cheap" Carolina Hurricanes.

Right, which is on Bergevin. Therefore, his fault.