Canadian Government Freezing Hockey Canada Funding- (2018 Canada World Jr Team Alleged Sexual Assault)
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Jordan Belfort
Registered User
I doubt very much there will be any convincing evidence either way. Even the reported videos have little evidentiary value because they were recorded in the moment with the supposed victim in the presence of the players.
The text messages might provide some insight.
There are people out there who will always believe one side or the other based on personal bias.
Lets hope they don't wind up in a jury pool.
Objectivity is in short supply these days while ignorance is flourishing.
Off Sides
Registered User
- Sep 8, 2008
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I am not disagreeing with anything you are saying, I agree in essence with all of that.
More so, suggesting another layer. I think from that testimony they are seemingly pointing out no government funds were used.
There must be a motivation behind them using that as part of their defense.
Almost like it's a way of them saying to those who would (should) care about tax payer money used towards this, they did not use it. Yet if HC knew nothing was wrong about paying this off, why would it be necessary to differentiate between public funding versus other funding being used?
Yesterday I asked if they would question if HC changed anything after learning about these accusations, I see they replied something to the effect of changing their code of conduct. (which seems a little odd that it did not already cover sexual abuse) Now I am hoping the government asks some other pertinent questions, and is not distracted by them saying no public money was used (fully understanding no one who reads this has any way to ask those questions, just something I hope is asked)
Howden released a statement yesterday saying he never had contact with the victim. Steenbergen did the same today.
Tad Mikowsky
Only Droods
Oh I am calm. It’s just if you’re going to talk shit, back it up. Bit ridiculous to assume that I’d make a document and leave out a player because I cheer for a team.
Jeune Poulet
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- Oct 31, 2019
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I have never, ever read anything... any statement that the police believes this girl consented. And I believe I have read them all. That's a pretty heinous accusation you are throwing there.
A lot of posts in this thread, particularly in the last 24 hours, illstrate why it's so difficult for victims to come forward when they know they'll be sullied and blamed for what happened to them.
99% of the population may say they are anti-rape, but a lot of the indifference and insensitive victim-blaming we are seeing in this thread suggest that the percentage of people who are careful about not perpetuating rape culture is a lot lower than that.
The girl wants to remain anonymous (imo, for good reasons, considering the treatment of victims in the process) so it's unlikely that any criminal case comes out. Without the victim as a witness, even if they have her written sworn affidavit, it won't work.
You can't equate the players not being charged with the police thought there was consent.
The police won't make an arrest if they know for certain it will not be prosecuted, and it can't be prosecuted if the victim won't testify. And the fact that some victims don't want to testify doesn't mean there wasn't a crime, it just means it can't be enforced in our legal system.
robertmac43
Forever 43!
- Mar 31, 2015
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Exactly. It should have been police matter for starters and NO HC involvement. And the biggest circle jerk now will be Hockey Canada executive with the government politicians.
- Feb 5, 2010
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The lawsuit was literally against Hockey Canada.
calder candidate
Registered User
I agree that taking the money is kinda shady but I could see them being convinced by a bunch of high powers layers that keeping quiet was best, over quickly, big check, not wanting this to be known and have this follow there child for ever… imagine meeting a girl you start dating and you Google her name and find a bunch of article about her being gang rape by a bunch of hockey player, Her knowing that everyone she meet might have knowledge of who she is and why… The people that get away with stuff is because the victims are ashamed and don’t want to be stuck reliving this story every day and the put their personal being before the collective « other girls » blaming the victim for putting them self first is easy when you don’t have to live with the consequences, it doesn’t always mean that they were out for money… if they were trying to get money I’m sure that hockey Canada would have put there money to defend those claim instead of covering it up… maybe throwing some money is easier but multi million payout… this isn’t, this isn’t worth the trouble, time or hassle, this is we need to cover this up.
calder candidate
Registered User
So in a court hockey Canada could be held responsible for something players did to this girl… the lawyer got together and decided that was the easiest way FW hockey Canada can’t pay or protect anyone if they aren’t being sued… I had a Q team in my town and back then there would be 2 guy per room and girls would wait in line at he local motel waiting for there turn to get F… billet mom sucking player on the way to practice there a lot of wild stuff that happen and most of it is completely consensual but I can also definitely see thing getting out of hand…
oldunclehue
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- Jun 16, 2010
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Do we know how much the settlement was? If it was in the millions it might not indicate a "cover-up", but most civil lawyers are very well versed in what type of settlements and how much a victim would get if the trial proceeded therefore they already have a dollar figure. As far as what the victim here would need/or use the money for can be far ranging. If she has suffered mental anguish over time which caused her to lose out on employment/education etc, then it can be assessed as lost potential income over a period of time. Also she may have medical bills for say therapy which is ongoing. Or perhaps some other things going on that will be a continuous cost. So the millions may not be a "cover-up" amount, it may simply be some form of equation that the lawyers used to calculate the damages/loss of potential employement/education and other items.
But I in no way support Hockey Canada using a secret fund to pay off a victim from this incident. It should have fallen on the players themselves to deal with this. Yes it was after a Hockey Canada event, but how/why does Hockey Canada have to be responsible for something these horrible adults did after an after party/bar situation.
At what point does Hockey Canada's responsibility end after an event?
Spearmint Rhino
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- Sep 17, 2013
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If HC was supplying booze they’re potentially on the hook for anything that happens that night. It is why corporations are struggling to have company parties anymore, liability makes it damn near impossible
WatchfulElm
Former "Domi a favor"
At this rate we're gonna have more sexual misconduct threads in the NHL talk than actual hockey threads.
Virtanen, Katz, Reid Boucher, Hockey Canada... maybe it's time to add a Doug Gilmour thread!
Still glad those stories are getting out.
Virtanen, Katz, Reid Boucher, Hockey Canada... maybe it's time to add a Doug Gilmour thread!
Still glad those stories are getting out.
- May 3, 2021
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It's not the severity of the crime that makes it a civil or criminal case. The standard of proof is different, the punishment is different (jail time or money) and the outcomes can be different for the same crime. (See OJ Simpson case)
The civil approach is the obvious one in most rape cases because "beyond a reasonable doubt" is a very difficult standard to meet, even when the woman has significant injuries. (Defendant: "She likes it rough!") When you have 7 guys all implicated by their presence, and bonded by their team experience so no one will break rank, and one woman alone with a different story, the chances of a criminal conviction are zero.
The alternative, a criminal trial, involves subjecting the woman to an absolute shitstorm of slu+ shaming and blame; this is true EVEN when the woman was raped publicly, with witnesses, and was UNCONSCIOUS! She can still be blamed and men will still claim that she enjoyed it!
See Stanford swimmer Brock Turner case: Telling the Story of the Stanford Rape Case
Read the linked victim impact statement about the trauma, not of the rape itself which she was unconscious for, but everything that happened afterward, the loss of sense of safety and bodily integrity, the humiliation and degradation, and the realization that the criminal justice system treats assaulted women as trivial, and that the legal system itself allows the prosecution to assault the victim's character, gaslight her, invade her privacy, claim that the assault was desired, the psychological effects minimal, all while doing everything possible to protect the career of the assaulting athlete.
Anyone who knows anything will go civil. If you win, you can afford therapy and you can feel that someone was made to pay for what happened to you.
An example from last week of how insanely biased the criminal justice system is against raped women: a man sexually assaulted and photographed a sleeping woman, who woke up during the assault. There was no question as to his guilt as the woman escaped the room and others were present in the apartment. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/sexual-assault-trois-rivieres-1.6510610
The judge gave him a conditional discharge (NO jail time; NO criminal record) because according to the judge: the assault "did not last that long," the aggressor was "otherwise of good moral character," having previously sexually assaulted only one other woman, and because a criminal conviction would make it difficult for him to travel for his work.
Consideration of the consequences of this assault for the woman in the criminal system? Zero.
She could have gone the civil route, and she should have, and I hope she still does.
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Oh, yeah, a court case. Or the second rape as it's known in the business.
I am toxic
. . . even in small doses
I wonder what Samson will have found in the forensic audit, given that field work should have completed by the 7th.
I would be very curious if there were any large payments to other law firm's legal trust funds or large financial institutions booked between July 2020 and June 2021, specifically for a couple of large payments (or two distinct series of payments starting sometime late fall, early winter of 2020/2021) totalling anywhere between $5m and $13m.
I would be very curious if there were any large payments to other law firm's legal trust funds or large financial institutions booked between July 2020 and June 2021, specifically for a couple of large payments (or two distinct series of payments starting sometime late fall, early winter of 2020/2021) totalling anywhere between $5m and $13m.
Gsus
MVP
Who are the remaining players yet to make a statement? Something wrong when you haven't come forward yet when most of them have.
I know Hart has made his 2-3 days ago through his lawyer.
I know Hart has made his 2-3 days ago through his lawyer.
the dynamics of what happened seem pretty obvious. whether or not the actions are deemed legal by technicality of the video doesnt change it being a f'd up thing to do. hc appearing to bury it is obviously going to be the bigger spotlight story.
what i cant get over what a first class scumbag the ringleader of this group was. seems like he knew the girl wouldnt say no to him and enjoyed abusing that. the video recordings of consent...guess it wasnt his first rodeo. the texts the following day almost exclusively concerned with his own well being then appearing to drop her like a bad habit once she said what he wanted to hear. that kid is a goddamn sociopath. id bet good money the foot dragging in public comment from a lot of the players who werent involved was because he/others involved begged teammates not to say anything to prevent the list from being whittled down until it exposed names.
what i cant get over what a first class scumbag the ringleader of this group was. seems like he knew the girl wouldnt say no to him and enjoyed abusing that. the video recordings of consent...guess it wasnt his first rodeo. the texts the following day almost exclusively concerned with his own well being then appearing to drop her like a bad habit once she said what he wanted to hear. that kid is a goddamn sociopath. id bet good money the foot dragging in public comment from a lot of the players who werent involved was because he/others involved begged teammates not to say anything to prevent the list from being whittled down until it exposed names.
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