NitHeel
Kimmo Forever
Oh, so you make a claim, have it refuted and the comeback is "no, I'm going to ignore that". Cool.
Proposal: Calgary - Philly
- Thread starter MustardTigers
- Start date
Johnnybegood13
Registered User
- Jul 11, 2003
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- 996
Gaudreau won't cost Calgary a $8.25m cap hit(10m salary) anytime soon, any player with a career high of 23 goals and averages about 60 pts shouldn't be making that either.
1865
Alpha Couturier
Voracek isn't a goalscorer, he's an elite level playmaker. You don't need to score 25 to be a great player, you know that...right?
Henrik Sedin has only scored over 25 once in his career, is he crap too?
Tripod
I hate this team
Except that you are missing details.
Voracek has paced for 70 points over the last 4 years.
Voracek was an upcoming UFA whereas JG is a RFA.
Voracek's agent was able to see Kessel getting 8 million, Perry getting 8.625, Nash 7.8, etc.. And Voracek was 5th in the league in points.
Voracek was only making 4.25 million in the last 4 years while pacing that 70 points. Philly got great value from him....and rewarded him for being underpaid for so many years.
That's the risk of the bridge deals. If the player breaks out more, you pay more. Jake took a 1 year 2.25 deal. Then a 4 year deal at 4.25. He paid his dues of lower contracts and wanted to be paid.
So Philly had the choice, overpay him by roughly $500,000-$750,000 or possibly lose him for nothing. They choose to re-sign him given that there was no in house replacement for him. Whereas a team like NYI chose to not re-sign Okposo and lost him for nothing.
I said in the other thread, the Flames should sign JG to the Tarasenko deal....7.5 million or 8 years and pay for his 23-30 year old seasons....then let someone else pay for his 31-36 year old declining years that carry more risk.
No, JG won't get 8 million. Look at the list....all those guys were upcoming UFA's. RFA are a totally different situation and get paid less....like Tarasenko. If he was a UFA, he signs in the 8+ million. Just like JG.
I have no issue overpaying your best players to keep them. Much better than overpaying the AMac's, Smid's, etc...of the hockey world.
Johnnybegood13
Registered User
- Jul 11, 2003
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Voracek had one season in eight where he played even close to elite with 81 points, in that same time span Sedin has gone over 80 points five times.
Ring me up when Jakub wins an Art Ross and a Hart trophy, until then he grossly overpaid.
whitstifier
Honor Black Excellence in Hockey
- Mar 19, 2013
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1865
Alpha Couturier
So suddenly it's not down to goals, it's down to trophies. Is that right?
Over the last 4 years, Jake is the 15th highest scorer in the league and 4th for RWs. He's the 12th highest paid player in a league where the majority haven't signed a new deal in this CBA yet.
I agree he's about $1m overpaid, but "grossly" overpaid? I think you need to check your facts.
We're perfectly willing to argue that, Gaudreau in particular is a sensation but your boy here is trying to talk Voracek down and that's built on a load of crap.
Johnny Hoxville
The Return of a Legend
Both are great players, and I'm a Gaudreau fanboy. I love Jake, especially his hair.
whitstifier
Honor Black Excellence in Hockey
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You're right; I didn't read very closely. It's pretty much just Calgary fans crapping on Voracek. I'm a Philadelphia fan btw
Johnny Hoxville
The Return of a Legend
No one should be crapping on Jake, he's an elite winger. But the Flames have no one reason to make this deal. Gaudreau has higher upside than Voracek does and is significantly younger. The premise is bad and thus the negative and unwarranted comments on Jake.
whitstifier
Honor Black Excellence in Hockey
- Mar 19, 2013
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Eh, Voracek only just turned 27. And, who knows, maybe Voracek ages like Hossa or Jagr. Voracek has good size and strength on the puck like those players. I do love Gaudreau. If I were a Calgary fan, I'd be loathe accept a trade that'd swap him for an older, more costly player.
Curufinwe
Registered User
- Feb 28, 2013
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He played hurt for last month of the season and it clearly affected him. You can't judge injury severity solely by missed games.
Bob Clarke Fan Club
Registered User
Some years of that contract Jake is going to be overpaid, some years he's not. It is the case with nearly every big contract signed, guys just don't live up to it some years. I have zero worries about long term, Jake will live up to that contract in many years,. In some he'll look grossly overpaid. You've got to pay if you want to play.
BrindamoursNose
Registered User
- Oct 14, 2008
- 20,395
- 14,544
That's all I'm looking for.
I'm looking for people to acknowledge that Voracek is just as good - if not better - than JG overall. This "AINEC" mentality is insane.
LetsGoFlames
Drop the puck!
I like Jake and think he's one of the top RW's in the game today, but I agree that his contract is too much in both money and term. That's why I wouldn't want him coming back in the hypothetical trade that sends Johnny to Philly. I'd definitely want it built around Schenn + Provorov. We could work out additional pieces from there.
ponder719
M-M-M-Matvei and the Jett
No, we really couldn't. Given our organizational needs, and the structure of our prospect pipeline, there is almost nothing in the NHL that would convince us to move Ivan Provorov at this juncture. Gaudreau does not make that incredibly small list; it's basically marketing bonanzas like McDavid (who, obviously, is not about to be traded) or players like Ekblad, who would fill the same role as Provorov, but are a bit further along in their development (again, not about to be traded.)
Outside of that, we need to sit tight and let our defensive issues resolve themselves before we talk about trading any prospects.
Johnnybegood13
Registered User
- Jul 11, 2003
- 8,736
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What was his excuse the first 20 games of the season where he had 1 goal and 8 assists?
Seriously I don't dislike the player it's just my opinion that he's overpaid for what he does, to me a top 20 paid player should drive the play plus game in game out be a factor, Giroux can be that type of player but Voracek not so much.
joez86
Registered User
- Jan 20, 2006
- 1,103
- 74
Driving the play game in and game out doesn't always translate to points game in and game out. In the beginning of the season, he was squeezing his stick and missing wide open nets regularly. And the longer a scoring slump like that goes, the harder a player tends to squeeze, especially fresh off a big extension with big expectations to fill (which only kicks in this season).
Voracek is one of the best "possession" players in the league. If you want to have somebody who "drives the play"... you want a guy like Voracek.
Vikke
ViktorAllvin twitter
CraigsList
RIP #13
I am getting tired of these Gaudreau to Philly threads. The funny part is we are not good trading partners.
Figgy44
A toast of purple gato for the memories
- Dec 15, 2014
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I really don't get the idea where someone has to crap on another player because he prefers another player.
Voracek is a great player. Someone may not prefer him in a theoretical JG swap and perhaps might want other pieces, but that doesn't mean Voracek is crap. I apologize Flyers fans you have to deal with such comments. He's an Allstar and I still giggle at the following video:
In all seriousness though, I'm tired of these stupid Johnny Gaud~Bye theoretical threads because he hasn't signed a contract yet.
Voracek is a great player. Someone may not prefer him in a theoretical JG swap and perhaps might want other pieces, but that doesn't mean Voracek is crap. I apologize Flyers fans you have to deal with such comments. He's an Allstar and I still giggle at the following video:
In all seriousness though, I'm tired of these stupid Johnny Gaud~Bye theoretical threads because he hasn't signed a contract yet.
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