C William Nylander (2014, 8th, TOR) V [Mod warning in OP]

[Shwaguy*]

Ehlers is on the second line atomos,

And are you suggesting detroits line up is easier to crack than torontos?

In this situation, yes. But it's not due to talent on the Roster.

 

[Shwaguy*]

Nylander and likely Brown as well should by all accounts still be on the big team full time by the end of the year. honestly probably before the Trade Deadline as well.

Dubas has said that they are fully expecting and planning on their young players who are dominating in the minors graduating to full time roles mid season.

It's not even a development thing IMO, they are just biding time so they can trade some UFAs.

 

[The Norris Division]

Babcock is a genius, he doesn't want to interfere with the possibility of Nylander actually doing good.

Let them finish last they need a player of Matthews calibre.

Nylander
Marner
Matthews

They'll finally have promise.

As Leaf fans will find out this season.... tanking aint easy.
They have already played very well in 2 of there first 3 games.


So far they have only 1 point to show but there are 9 teams with a WORSE record.

 

[Shwaguy*]

As Leaf fans will find out this season.... tanking aint easy.
They have already played very well in 2 of there first 3 games.


So far they have only 1 point to show but there are 9 teams with a WORSE record.

Getting Matthews/Chychrun isn't even mandatory either, because first of all we already have some promise. And 2nd of all if you are drafting top 10 odds are there is a player there who will become a major centrepiece of a team capable of contending. It's just a matter of choosing the right player. With Hunter leading the way I have faith we will do that.

 

[Filatov2Kovalev2Bonk]

As Leaf fans will find out this season.... tanking aint easy.
They have already played very well in 2 of there first 3 games.


So far they have only 1 point to show but there are 9 teams with a WORSE record.

Except in January the Leafs will be trading a ton of their current group for more picks, which will make them even worse, and so on. (Sadly, they'll still manage to play us close in Ottawa, infuriatingly enough. ). It's safe to think the Maple Leafs will be a bottom five team for the draft.

As for Nylander, 9 shots and what, a goal in the first Marlies game? And nice flow still...

 

[Atomos2]

As Leaf fans will find out this season.... tanking aint easy.
They have already played very well in 2 of there first 3 games.


So far they have only 1 point to show but there are 9 teams with a WORSE record.

Not really that worried about not being a bottom place team. The only competition that worries me is Edmonton cuz they know how to be bottom dwellers like no other team in sports history.

 

[YWGinYYZ]

After some lengthy clean-up of this thread, we've re-opened it.

A warning:

Any trolling, flaming, or other behavior that contravenes the site rules, and you will be thread-banned, and possibly infracted. Please stick to the original topic. Thanks

 

[4thline]

Looking forward to Nylander's progression. Clearly presently a top-6 skillset offensively, up to him as to whether to answer the challenge and become a great all around c.

I like what the leafs are doing. Not letting him make the team as x when they think he can be y.

 

[theIceWookie]

As for Nylander, 9 shots and what, a goal in the first Marlies game? And nice flow still...

9 shots is ridiculous.

 

[jimmyemery]

It's an important quote because it's actually what he said. There's no interpretation needed. He wants his players over-ready. So to be on Babcock's team you'd have to be over-ready. That's what we know because that's what he said. Again Direct Babcock quote word for word: "We want our guys over-ready."

Not NHL ready (which he could've said if he wanted to) but over-ready.

Ken Holland said the exact same thing during the last preseason game, after it was already established datsyuk and helm were going to miss time.

I respect that the leafs are trying to go the safe route with their high picks now, I'd like to see the leafs wings rivalry be competitive, and not just because Babcock is coaching there.

Babcock coaching the Wings = all the Wings fans are aware of how he deals with prospects, compared to the "rest of the league".

Babcock coaching another team = wings fans pretend that the past 10 years didnt happend "just b/c".

Babcock coaches the wings for ten years and instills a lot of his philosophy when it comes to prospect management in him. Wings fans learn his idiosyncrasies and tendencies for a decade.

Babcock coaches the leafs for 4 months, leaf fans now know Babcock better than any wings fan could possibly know.


I'm not going to say Larkin is better than nylander, or visa versa, but I will say that Larkin is the kind of player that Babcock drools over, babs put Luke Glendenning on the first line wing with pavel datsyuk last year and Larkin's Glendenning with faster feet to get back on d, better hands, with all of the blue collar work ethic.

Whether or not the leafs team situation was conducive to nylanders success is irrelevant, and it will continue to be until he learns to play without the puck and play on the walls/in the corners.
He can score 40 goals in the ahl this year, but if he doesnt right those issues(plus a hundred more things im sure babs has pointed out to him)then he will not succeed in babcocks system.

 

[jimmyemery]

I don't know if Matthews is so far above Chychrun that you just can't pass on Matthews but if so I really think the Leafs will go for the D man. Looking at our prospects a top D man is sorely needed

Chychrun would look really damn good next to Reilly, then Gardiner can hold down the second pair.

 

[obey86]

Ken Holland said the exact same thing during the last preseason game, after it was already established datsyuk and helm were going to miss time.

I respect that the leafs are trying to go the safe route with their high picks now, I'd like to see the leafs wings rivalry be competitive, and not just because Babcock is coaching there.



Babcock coaches the wings for ten years and instills a lot of his philosophy when it comes to prospect management in him. Wings fans learn his idiosyncrasies and tendencies for a decade.

Babcock coaches the leafs for 4 months, leaf fans now know Babcock better than any wings fan could possibly know.


I'm not going to say Larkin is better than nylander, or visa versa, but I will say that Larkin is the kind of player that Babcock drools over, babs put Luke Glendenning on the first line wing with pavel datsyuk last year and Larkin's Glendenning with faster feet to get back on d, better hands, with all of the blue collar work ethic.

Whether or not the leafs team situation was conducive to nylanders success is irrelevant, and it will continue to be until he learns to play without the puck and play on the walls/in the corners.
He can score 40 goals in the ahl this year, but if he doesnt right those issues(plus a hundred more things im sure babs has pointed out to him)then he will not succeed in babcocks system.

Great post.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Ken Holland said the exact same thing during the last preseason game, after it was already established datsyuk and helm were going to miss time.

I respect that the leafs are trying to go the safe route with their high picks now, I'd like to see the leafs wings rivalry be competitive, and not just because Babcock is coaching there.



Babcock coaches the wings for ten years and instills a lot of his philosophy when it comes to prospect management in him. Wings fans learn his idiosyncrasies and tendencies for a decade.

Babcock coaches the leafs for 4 months, leaf fans now know Babcock better than any wings fan could possibly know.


I'm not going to say Larkin is better than nylander, or visa versa, but I will say that Larkin is the kind of player that Babcock drools over, babs put Luke Glendenning on the first line wing with pavel datsyuk last year and Larkin's Glendenning with faster feet to get back on d, better hands, with all of the blue collar work ethic.

Whether or not the leafs team situation was conducive to nylanders success is irrelevant, and it will continue to be until he learns to play without the puck and play on the walls/in the corners.
He can score 40 goals in the ahl this year, but if he doesnt right those issues(plus a hundred more things im sure babs has pointed out to him)then he will not succeed in babcocks system.

Well said! In the long run I also think this philosophy will make Nylander a better player. Watching the Leafs the last few years, the team never had a problem putting the puck in the net, the problem was that many of the forwards didn't have a commitment to two way play. This needs to be instilled in all of the players, regardless of where they were drafted. Babcock will insist on this for all of the players. No exceptions.

 

[Shwaguy*]

Great post.

Nylander is underrated away from the puck. By Underrated I mean he's not useless there. He's a great forechecker and a bit below average in his own zone (For an NHLer, not for a 19 year old). People act like he's a sieve who doesn't know what the word means. He's not Phil Kessel. He's not at risk of failing to succeed in Babcock's system because of his 2-way ability that's for sure. He's not there yet, but he's close and better than other similar calibre prospects. He will more than likely finish the year with the Big team anyways, probably as soon as there is a trade (The real reason for him getting sent down).

It needs work, but so does pretty much every 19 year old's. Larkin's is definitely very good, but you will see him falter on defence as well at times. I see them as equal prospects. Where Larkin's two-way advantage is matched by Nylander's offensive advantage. In my opinion both become #1 Centres.

 

[jimmyemery]

Well said! In the long run I also think this philosophy will make Nylander a better player. Watching the Leafs the last few years, the team never had a problem putting the puck in the net, the problem was that many of the forwards didn't have a commitment to two way play. This needs to be instilled in all of the players, regardless of where they were drafted. Babcock will insist on this for all of the players. No exceptions.

It will for sure make him a better player, and it'll benefit the leafs in the long run as long as they stick with it.

 

[docbenton]

Nylander is underrated away from the puck. By Underrated I mean he's not useless there. He's a great forechecker and a bit below average in his own zone (For an NHLer, not for a 19 year old). People act like he's a sieve who doesn't know what the word means. He's not Phil Kessel. He's not at risk of failing to succeed in Babcock's system because of his 2-way ability that's for sure. He's not there yet, but he's close and better than other similar calibre prospects. He will more than likely finish the year with the Big team anyways, probably as soon as there is a trade (The real reason for him getting sent down).

It needs work, but so does pretty much every 19 year old's. Larkin's is definitely very good, but you will see him falter on defence as well at times. I see them as equal prospects. Where Larkin's two-way advantage is matched by Nylander's offensive advantage. In my opinion both become #1 Centres.

I disagree, I think Larkin is a superior offensive player. Last year in the AHL playoffs he was almost unstoppable. Nylander is not on that level even now.

 

[Shwaguy*]

I disagree, I think Larkin is a superior offensive player. Last year in the AHL playoffs he was almost unstoppable. Nylander is not on that level even now.

Small sample size. Nylander by all means should be the better offensive player. He should be the best offensive player from his draft, him being held up from the NHL because of the Leafs having a different philosophy (He was gonna be sent down no matter what he did, do not mistake that, although as soon as a trade occurs he should be the first one up).

People act like Larkin is the runaway second best player from that draft already. It's laughable. Nobody will know that until all the prevalent players have been given their fair shot in the NHL. You can try and say Larkin would have made the team. But he wouldn't, you'd be wrong to say that. Even if you did have Babs as your coach for all those years it doesn't mean you know our team and how they are operating anywhere close to as well as we do.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Small sample size. Nylander by all means should be the better offensive player. He should be the best offensive player from his draft, him being held up from the NHL because of the Leafs having a different philosophy (He was gonna be sent down no matter what he did, do not mistake that, although as soon as a trade occurs he should be the first one up).

People act like Larkin is the runaway second best player from that draft already. It's laughable. Nobody will know that until all the prevalent players have been given their fair shot in the NHL. You can try and say Larkin would have made the team. But he wouldn't, you'd be wrong to say that. Even if you did have Babs as your coach for all those years it doesn't mean you know our team and how they are operating anywhere close to as well as we do.

I doubt very much that Nylander ends up the best offensive player from his draft. I know that one scout may have said this but it's mainly Leaf fans saying that he's the top offensive player. This is why some people complain about him being over hyped. I'd take a few players over him including Bennett and Reinhart in terms of pure offence and quite possibly Larkin as well.

 

[MardyBum]

I doubt very much that Nylander ends up the best offensive player from his draft. I know that one scout may have said this but it's mainly Leaf fans saying that he's the top offensive player. This is why some people complain about him being over hyped. I'd take a few players over him including Bennett and Reinhart in terms of pure offence and quite possibly Larkin as well.

Huh?

I'm a Jets fan and he's up there in consideration for the most offensively talented forward.

Some people have completely lost their **** on Nylander due to him being on the Leafs.

He had one of the best draft +1 seasons from his draft year, and in the course of playing with cans and being sent down because the Leafs are a dumpster fire he's suddenly not talented?

*sigh*

 

[Atomos2]

I disagree, I think Larkin is a superior offensive player. Last year in the AHL playoffs he was almost unstoppable. Nylander is not on that level even now.

You do realize that their PPG in the AHL were identical right? The only difference was that Larkin had that PPG for six games and Nylander maintained it for 42.

 

[Shwaguy*]

I doubt very much that Nylander ends up the best offensive player from his draft. I know that one scout may have said this but it's mainly Leaf fans saying that he's the top offensive player. This is why some people complain about him being over hyped. I'd take a few players over him including Bennett and Reinhart in terms of pure offence and quite possibly Larkin as well.

Well I doubt very much that those 3 have more offensive talent then Nylander. This is why Leaf fans feel like they are always persecuted.

Do you see what I did there?

 

[Pyromaniac]

I doubt very much that Nylander ends up the best offensive player from his draft. I know that one scout may have said this but it's mainly Leaf fans saying that he's the top offensive player. This is why some people complain about him being over hyped. I'd take a few players over him including Bennett and Reinhart in terms of pure offence and quite possibly Larkin as well.

Uh what?

Nylander is absolutely talented enough to end up being the top producing forward from good draft class. You don't have to be a Leafs fan to see that.

No offense but it seems as if you are insecure about your own team's pick so you feel the need to prove that the other players picked in that vicinity are not as good as everybody believes.

 

[Anchor Town*]

You do realize that their PPG in the AHL were identical right? The only difference was that Larkin had that PPG for six games and Nylander maintained it for 42.

And Larkin did it in the playoffs and Nylander did it against worse competition...

 

[Reinhart]

I think Nylander did (and still does) have the potential to not only be the most offensive player from that draft, but the best player period from that draft. It was such an interesting draft that way with a bunch of guys ranked so differently without a consensus #1.

With that being said, I hate the Leafs. Nylander is talked about to DEATH and permeates his way into so many other threads it becomes almost as intolerable as all the McDavid talk. LoL However, kid is legitimate high-end talent and I will bet he has a very good career in front of himself.

 

[Anchor Town*]

I think Nylander did (and still does) have the potential to not only be the most offensive player from that draft, but the best player period from that draft. It was such an interesting draft that way with a bunch of guys ranked so differently without a consensus #1.

With that being said, I hate the Leafs. Nylander is talked about to DEATH and permeates his way into so many other threads it becomes almost as intolerable as all the McDavid talk. LoL However, kid is legitimate high-end talent and I will bet he has a very good career in front of himself.

There was a consensus number one in 2014