C Adam Fantilli - (2023, 3rd, CBJ) Part 2

[hotcabbagesoup]

If he did, why would we know? Might as well as if anyone on this forum is his close blood relative.

Man, Fantilli having Habs cups and the Habs getting PLD for free this summer. Montreal is gonna turn-around their rebuild quick once Fantilli defects from Anaheim after his ELC

 

[Juxtaposer]

Thanks for this well-thought answer! Obviously it's impossible for anyone to have any deeper knowledge about this player, I mean who could have known that John Tavares grew up dreaming about playing for the Leafs.

Well, if it’s as obvious as Tavares’ pajamas, why haven’t you dug it up?

 

[bigdog16]

Please find me one pre draft opinion where Matthews is being heralded as mcdavids equal, a generational talent, or the best prospect in years.

It takes about 1 minute of Google search to find multiple scouts and quotes from anonymous executives claiming Bedard as such. Notice how it's never "best prospect since Matthews" and always the best since McDavid, that's because he's unanimously seen as the better prospect than Matthews was.

Maybe you viewed Matthews higher than most, and maybe you will be right about who will be the better NHL player because there are no guarantees bedard tops what Matthews has done, but as it stands in the scouting community bedard is regarded as far and away the better prospect at this point than Matthews was.

Matthews was getting kopitar comparisons and Bedard is being held to the Crosby/McDavid standard, whether you like it or not.

I personally thought MacKinnon was a far Superior prospect to Eichel for instance, but I'm not naive enough to think many people didn't agree with me, and despite MacKinnon clearly becoming the better player and somewhat validating my opinion, I don't necessarily believe MacKinnon would have been drafted ahead of Eichel had they been in the same draft, because I realize most people didn't agree with that take at the time

One was Canadian playing in the WHL along with a ton of media attention during his draft year.

The other was an American playing in Switzerland during his draft year with not much media attention.

There is the simple breakdown of why you are hearing way more about Bedard than Matthews during their draft years. I said it before, what Matthews did in Switzerland in his draft year was every bit, if not more impressive than what Bedard did playing in the WHL.

 

[wetcoast]

One was Canadian playing in the WHL along with a ton of media attention during his draft year.

The other was an American playing in Switzerland during his draft year with not much media attention.

There is the simple breakdown of why you are hearing way more about Bedard than Matthews during their draft years. I said it before, what Matthews did in Switzerland in his draft year was every bit, if not more impressive than what Bedard did playing in the WHL.

Was it really though as AM was later birthday and physically mature in the Swiss league which isn't exactly the best league in Europe.

Bedard's season was definitely worthy of more attention and rightly so.

All that being said the ducks are getting a good one in Fantilli.

 

[Breakfast of Champs]

One was Canadian playing in the WHL along with a ton of media attention during his draft year.

The other was an American playing in Switzerland during his draft year with not much media attention.

There is the simple breakdown of why you are hearing way more about Bedard than Matthews during their draft years. I said it before, what Matthews did in Switzerland in his draft year was every bit, if not more impressive than what Bedard did playing in the WHL.

and yet Bedard more than doubled his WJC, I think Bedard would be absolutely lighting up the swiss league atm, he's just far and away better than Matthews was and he is almost an entire year younger. Bedard has a Crosby like CHL draft year, and is easily the best prospect since McDavid. 99% of scouts and NHL executives will agree on this. I've literally never once seen anyone credible say anything otherwise.

Just for fun - can you find me ONE example of a scout or executive saying something like "this is the best prospect since Matthews" or "he would go #1 in every draft since matthews" Because all I am seeing is since McDavid, "in the class of Crosby/McDavid" when people are ranking their best prospects of the last 20 years I am seeing a clear and consistent top 3 of Crosby, McDavid, and Bedard. It might be YOUR opinion that Matthews was on this level, but I would really like to see just ONE scout or someone involved in the NHL quoted saying that Matthews was generational, in the class of Bedard etc. In fact, you can choose pre draft even and show me 1 example of where Matthews was being heralded as generational or even close to being in McDavid's category. Again, all I can find he is usually compared to Eichel and many were of the opinion Eichel was the better prospect of the 2.


Matthews was a high-grade #1 pick, not in Bedard's class though.

Back to Fantilli, he's a great player too, not on the level of either of those guys but a prospect that could go #1 in quite a few drafts

 

[WarriorofTime]

Generational

Howe (1928)
Orr (1948)
Gretzky (1961)
Crosby (1987)
McDavid (1997)
Bedard (2005)

Lemieux was too close to Gretzky. Lindros didn’t live up to the hype. Some other guys that are close.

 

[Pepper]

Well, if it’s as obvious as Tavares’ pajamas, why haven’t you dug it up?

Because I didnt say it was obvious, I was merely asking if anyone has any info.

Why is this so hard to understand?

 

[Breakfast of Champs]

Generational

Howe (1928)
Orr (1948)
Gretzky (1961)
Crosby (1987)
McDavid (1997)
Bedard (2005)

Lemieux was too close to Gretzky. Lindros didn’t live up to the hype. Some other guys that are close.

Nah Lemieux is the exception to this, he was probably the best prospect of all time and lived up to it. Gretzky and Lemieux entered the NHL 5 years apart, that's just bare minimum for them to have been able to dominate separate eras (Gretzky 1980- 88) Lemieux (1988-1997).

Also if we are going for pre draft Lindros was seen as a guy who could define the next 10 years of NHL after Gretzky and Lemieux, he was the most hyped and talked about Prospect ever at the time, and might still be (I think Crosby gives him a run for his money in terms of pure hype.

The point is , all of these guys were getting so much attention and being heralded as players who could define an era of the NHL , Bedard is getting this too (although to a lesser extend than Lindros/Crosby or McDavid)

Fantilli belongs nowhere near this category, he's absolutely an elite prospect who many believe can become a franchise #1C , but I think the likely ceiling for him is more in the Stamkos/MacKinnon/Getzlaf range than Crosby/McDavid. Still nothing to be down on , you're looking at a guy who could be a major factor in driving a contender and at his peak could even contend for some individual hardware. That's a really, really good prospect

 

[Kalv]

This thread will soon talk about how global warming impacts the ant population in Papua New Guinea, instead of Adam Fantilli. Literally, ANYTHING just Adam Fantilli.

Amazing to see tbh.

PS
Does anyone know if he's out from today's game? I think if you get 5 in the IIHF tournament, you sit next game. Or is there exceptions?

 

[Rabid Ranger]

This thread will soon talk about how global warming impacts the ant population in Papua New Guinea, instead of Adam Fantilli. Literally, ANYTHING just Adam Fantilli.

Amazing to see tbh.

PS
Does anyone know if he's out from today's game? I think if you get 5 in the IIHF tournament, you sit next game. Or is there exceptions?

He played today.

 

[Jukurit]

Only 2 points in 7 games is bad production for a projected 2 overall pick.

 

[Masch78]

Only 2 points in 7 games is bad production for a projected 2 overall pick.

Ovi had 1+1 in 6 games. Turned out solidly.

 

[goonsaredumb]

Ovi had 1+1 in 6 games. Turned out solidly.

Ovi's actually got quite a few years of putting up mediocre to bad numbers at the World Championships (2 in 6 in 2004, 3 in 8 in 2007, 0 in 5 in 2011, and 3 in 10 in 2019) which should be pretty good proof that you can't judge a player's skill purely based off a World Championship performance.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Ovi had 1+1 in 6 games. Turned out solidly.

Eh. Russia didn’t have anyone scoring more than 4 points that tourney. Different times and different circumstances. Ovi was the top U19 scorer, Fantilli is pretty heavily outscored by Gauthier, Carlsson and Hutson and the tournament is far weaker than it was 10, 15, 20 years ago.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

I wonder if this WC has hurt his draft stock a bit. A lot of folks were talking about him like a Matthews/Eichel level prospect. Matthews had 6 goals and 9 points in 10 gp in his draft year WC.

Carlsson has pretty clearly been the better player in this tournament (and WJC).

 

[Static]

I wonder if this WC has hurt his draft stock a bit. A lot of folks were talking about him like a Matthews/Eichel level prospect. Matthews had 6 goals and 9 points in 10 gp in his draft year WC.

Carlsson has pretty clearly been the better player in this tournament (and WJC).

It doesn't seem entirely fair to compare the two without context. Fantilli has been set up for failure at this tournament, playing fourth line minutes with fringe NHL players that stylistically don't make sense on his line.

I'd really liked to have seen him with good NHL talent like carlsson has been able to play with. Either way, as a ducks fan I'm excited for whichever one we decide on.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

It doesn't seem entirely fair to compare the two without context. Fantilli has been set up for failure at this tournament, playing fourth line minutes with fringe NHL players that stylistically don't make sense on his line.

I'd really liked to have seen him with good NHL talent like carlsson has been able to play with. Either way, as a ducks fan I'm excited for whichever one we decide on.

And Fantilli doesn't even look like the best player among those scrubs.

Meanwhile Carlsson has been one of Sweden's best players.

 

[Static]

And Fantilli doesn't even look like the best player among those scrubs.

Meanwhile Carlsson has been one of Sweden's best players.

I completely disagree with that.

 

[Jukurit]

I wonder if this WC has hurt his draft stock a bit. A lot of folks were talking about him like a Matthews/Eichel level prospect. Matthews had 6 goals and 9 points in 10 gp in his draft year WC.

Carlsson has pretty clearly been the better player in this tournament (and WJC).

And Eichel had 7 points in 10 games, Laine 12 points in 10 games, Kakko 7 points in 10 games, Slaf 9 points in 8 games.

But Hughes only had 3 point in 7 games.

 

[Junohockeyfan]

I think this tournament hurts his him at the draft. He has not looked good at all. Falls to the ice alot and has trouble generating scoring chances. Very disappointing.

 

[CBJx614]

Eh I don't think this tournament hurts guys like Carlsson and Fantilli. They really only matter to 2-3 teams, at most 4. Nobody else has a realistic shot, and while the tournament is the last chance for teams to get a look, barring some drastic performance, for better or worse, these tournaments aren't changing a whole lot imo. Outside of a guy losing his shit and tomahawking another player, or throws a tantrum at a ref or coach or something along those lines, these teams have all but made their decision. All that Anaheim is doing until draft night is comparing Fantilli and Carlsson.

Not only which player best suits their on ice team system, but which one is going to best fit into and be the leader of their cores for the foreseeable future...

 

[Leonardo87]

I think this tournament hurts his him at the draft. He has not looked good at all. Falls to the ice alot and has trouble generating scoring chances. Very disappointing.

I thought he has looked more then fine with the limited ice time he has gotten. Had 6 SOG today. Can see his speed and physicality, and drive. Not worried about the points, especially when Milan Lucic is one of your line-mates.

He is the player the Ducks really need. But regardless would be more than fine if they draft Carlsson. Both kids are going to be potential elite talent with franchise potential as well, imo.

 

[Junohockeyfan]

I thought he has looked more then fine with the limited ice time he has gotten. Had 6 SOG today. Can see his speed and physicality, and drive. Not worried about the points, especially when Milan Lucic is one of your line-mates.

He is the player the Ducks really need. But regardless would be more than fine if they draft Carlsson. Both kids are going to be potential elite talent with franchise potential as well, imo.

This tournament vaulted Slafovsky to 1OA last year. I think Carlsson has a shot at 2OA this year. He's been really noticeable.

 

[MardyBum]

I wonder if this WC has hurt his draft stock a bit. A lot of folks were talking about him like a Matthews/Eichel level prospect. Matthews had 6 goals and 9 points in 10 gp in his draft year WC.

Carlsson has pretty clearly been the better player in this tournament (and WJC).

I don't think it's hurting him too badly, he's looked solid. Definitely think Leo is getting a nice bump though.

 

[Leonardo87]

This tournament vaulted Slafovsky to 1OA last year. I think Carlsson has a shot at 2OA this year. He's been really noticeable.

I think Carlsson has more offensive side than Fantilli. But Anaheim really needs a more physical two way player and with speed. I‘m sorta torn between the two, but I think Fantilli checks all the boxes for Anaheim, so am leaning towards him.