Proposal: Buffalo Sabres - Anaheim Ducks

[Nordic*]

Lindholm also got very limited PP time, and on the second unit when he got it.

#47 has focused on defence during the start of his NHL career. We did see some glimpses of what he's capable of offensively, last season. But he will probably never be a 65 point player, he's more of a Doughty than a Karlsson.

Having said that, Risto does have some insane physical gifts and could become a top-10 defenceman in a few years. Perhaps even top-5.

 

[Royal Thunder]

lol @ people trying to paint Lindholm and Risto as near equals. No way, there is no credible argument to do so.

What a convincing argument. Let me tell you, there absolutely is every reason to paint Ristolainen and Lindholm as equals. At this young age, Lindholm is better defensively, more poised, and more polished. Ristolainen is bigger, better offensively, and has a real swagger in the way he carries himself on the ice. Also important to note the polarizingly different siituations in which they have begun their respective careers. Both have absolutely sky high potential and tons of room for growth and either one could be better in 4 years. We will see.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

What a convincing argument. Let me tell you, there absolutely is every reason to paint Ristolainen and Lindholm as equals. One is better defensively and more polished, while the other is bigger, and better offensively. Also important to note the polarizingly different siituations in which they have begun their respective careers. have absolutely sky high potential and either one could be better in 4 years. We will see.

There is no reason to paint them as equals, once you look beyond the point totals it's clear who the better player is

 

[Royal Thunder]

No.

As usual you have got it wrong.

IF Risto hits his ceiling then there is a good argument to put forward here. But he is a long way from being the finished article IMO despite all the tools / potential.

Lindholm is a different player as others have alluded to.... ironically he is exactly what the Sabres need IMO. He is less than a year older than Risto yet has already proven himself to be legit. Risto has huge potential but is not quite there yet.
[mod]

Of course they are different players. If the Sabres had Lindholm, Risto would be exactly what they needed. Ristolainen was playing at a ridiculous level for half of last season before burning out with some of the very most difficult minutes in the league. Let's not pretend that he is some project that may or may turn out when he is already a legit top pairing D at 21 years old.

 

[Royal Thunder]

There is no reason to paint them as equals, once you look beyond the point totals it's clear who the better player is

Ah yes, let's look beyond the point totals like that doesn't matter at all when the higher scoring one is younger and on a far worse team. Let't just look beyond points, the single most tangible measure of comparison that there is in the game.

Are you arguing for the analytics (Lindholm clearly wins, but it's easy to see why if you understand the statistics) or the eye test (both have the edge in different areas)? Is it so clear when one is on a western conference titan and the other is on a team just getting out of one of the most bottomed out rebuilds this century?

 

[Nordic*]

Ristolainen has a real swagger in the way he carries himself on the ice.

What the hell does that even mean?

So does Bieksa and he still sucks.

 

[Royal Thunder]

What the hell does that even mean?

So does Bieksa and he still sucks.

Bieksa didn't have swagger, he was a fake tough guy who liked to run his mouth.

Some of the best defensemen in the game have a certain demeanor that helps their game. They look and play confident. Doughty, Keith, Subban, Burns. Pronger had that. Sometimes it turns to arrogance, sometimes it goes too far but when you are good and play like you know you are good it can be an asset. Obviously it's not something you need to be effective, but even the more subdued yet excellent defensemen (Niedermayer, Lidstrom, Karlsson today) had a very quiet confidence in how they carried themselves on and off the ice.

Maybe i'm not being clear. Ristolainen is a cocky SOB sometimes and it adds to his game.

 

[DraberlyakMcHallkins*]

Anaheim gives up the 2 best players and I don't think it's particularly close on either front

 

[DraberlyakMcHallkins*]

Ristolainen is a better PP quarterback, Lindholm is a better chance creator/suppressor. Lindholm's possession metrics blow Risto's out of the water, that said Risto is saddled with a pretty poor partner and I imagine Kulikov will help a bit.

 

[Tecumseh]

Anaheim gives up the 2 best players and I don't think it's particularly close on either front

I think Lindholm and Risto are pretty close but the edge goes to Lindholm. The gap between Rakell and Girgensons is quite large in Rakell's favor.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

Ah yes, let's look beyond the point totals like that doesn't matter at all when the higher scoring one is younger and on a far worse team. Let't just look beyond points, the single most tangible measure of comparison that there is in the game.

Are you arguing for the analytics (Lindholm clearly wins, but it's easy to see why if you understand the statistics) or the eye test (both have the edge in different areas)? Is it so clear when one is on a western conference titan and the other is on a team just getting out of one of the most bottomed out rebuilds this century?

let's ignore the absurdly low shooting % the ducks had when Lindholm was on the ice, when his TOI leads to quite a few more shot attempts more than the opposition, a league average team shooting % boosts Lindholm's point totals and this becomes less of an argument, I understand the fact Risto was on a terrible team, but that also means less competition for ice time, and if he screws up you can let him play thru it. For instance if you did put Risto on the ducks his ice time would be cut probably by atleast 3 minutes per game, if not more, and his PP time would almost assuredly be somewhere closer to Lindholm's, the trade off is playing with better teammates, but he'd also without a doubt have a smaller role

You know why the ducks were the best defensive team in the league last year? in large part due to the play of Lindholm as well as the Kesler line.

 

[Wandering Cynic]

Risto has insane physical gifts, and has already proven himself offensively at the NHL level, with little support on the Sabres. As good as Lindholm is, the Sabres should keep Ristolainen. He has the potential to be an elite top 10 defenseman in this league.

 

[mytduxfan*]

Risto has insane physical gifts, and has already proven himself offensively at the NHL level, with little support on the Sabres. As good as Lindholm is, the Sabres should keep Ristolainen. He has the potential to be an elite top 10 defenseman in this league.

1 season = proven... you heard it here first folks.

 

[Sabresruletheschool]

let's ignore the absurdly low shooting % the ducks had when Lindholm was on the ice, when his TOI leads to quite a few more shot attempts more than the opposition, a league average team shooting % boosts Lindholm's point totals and this becomes less of an argument, I understand the fact Risto was on a terrible team, but that also means less competition for ice time, and if he screws up you can let him play thru it. For instance if you did put Risto on the ducks his ice time would be cut probably by atleast 3 minutes per game, if not more, and his PP time would almost assuredly be somewhere closer to Lindholm's, the trade off is playing with better teammates, but he'd also without a doubt have a smaller role

You know why the ducks were the best defensive team in the league last year? in large part due to the play of Lindholm as well as the Kesler line.

You talk about low 5V5 goals for for Anaheim, do you realize Buffalo was second to last in that category? And Ristolainen got to be the premiere defenceman on the team. He didn't have the luxury of being on a team with a good top 4 that could help take some of the load. He was put in every situation, for up towards 30 minutes a night many times being double shifted. Many times Georges would leave the ice and Risto would stay out with a different D partner, or stay out for a face off in there zone.

If Risto didn't have to play half the game, every game, I'm sure he would have looked just as good as any young D man in the game

 

[mytduxfan*]

You talk about low 5V5 goals for for Anaheim, do you realize Buffalo was second to last in that category? And Ristolainen got to be the premiere defenceman on the team. He didn't have the luxury of being on a team with a good top 4 that could help take some of the load. He was put in every situation, for up towards 30 minutes a night many times being double shifted. Many times Georges would leave the ice and Risto would stay out with a different D partner, or stay out for a face off in there zone.

If Risto didn't have to play half the game, every game, I'm sure he would have looked just as good as any young D man in the game

Cool your jets. In terms of 5v5 goals, ANA was 26th in the league too and the difference between ANA and BUF was just 6 goals.

 

[Ducks in a row]

Risto has insane physical gifts, and has already proven himself offensively at the NHL level, with little support on the Sabres. As good as Lindholm is, the Sabres should keep Ristolainen. He has the potential to be an elite top 10 defenseman in this league.

Rasmus Ristolainen
2013-14 34 games 2 goals 2 assists 4 points
2014-15 78 games 8 goals 12 assists 20 points
2015-16 82 games 9 goals 32 assists 41 points

Rasmus Ristolainen has 1 year with good offensive numbers not what I would call proven yet.

Hampus Lindholm
2013-14 78 games 6 goals 24 assists 30 points
2014-15 78 games 7 goals 27 assists 34 points
2015-16 80 games 10 goals 18 assists 28 points

Each season Hampus Lindholm goal totals has improved. This season his assist totals dropped because the team had trouble scoring with him on the ice through no fault of his. Ducks score at a closer to normal rate with him on the ice he would of reached the 30 point mark and probably had a new career high in points.

Hampus Lindholm is better defensively then Rasmus Ristolainen. Hampus Lindholm is good for 30 points on average in a season. Hampus Lindholm has the potential to be a elite top 10 defenseman as well.