Red Sox/MLB Buffalo Blue Jays - Mookie Betts agrees to sign 12-year, $365 million contract extension with LA

[Merrrlin]

Love Mookie...but I get not offering him that contract.

Just don't pull the same crap they did with Lester. Don't say you don't sign older pitchers to long term deals, let him walk, and then a year later bring in freaking Price.

Be consistent.

I disagree.

You don't get too many Mookies in a life time. I would rather tie up money in a very athletic 5 tool star with a great personality and a near-legendary status in town than "play it smart" and lose him so you can do some tax maneuvering. I don't believe for a second that there weren't ways to make it work...

Mookie should have been a Red Sox legend for life.

 

[N o o d l e s]

Homeless Blue Jays was a better thread title

 

[LSCII]

I am shocked they have not unloaded NESN as both Comcast and Sinclair have offered megabucks. I sense now that King John wants the Queen to keep the power

Liverpool winning the Premier League this year offsets any losses in Boston in 2020.

Mookie winds up with $65 million more over 12 years than Boston offered ( $5.5 million a year )

And when you break it down like that, it's insulting. For less than $6 Mill per year extra, they could have kept the guy. Tells me that they only put an offer in to save face and had no intention of signing him to a long term deal.

 

[Seidenbergy]

And when you break it down like that, it's insulting. For less than $6 Mill per year extra, they could have kept the guy. Tells me that they only put an offer in to save face and had no intention of signing him to a long term deal.

To be fair, those numbers don't take into account the luxury tax penalties. It would've been FAR more than $6 mil a year.

 

[Bruinaura]

Seriously.

 

[JRull86]

And when you break it down like that, it's insulting. For less than $6 Mill per year extra, they could have kept the guy. Tells me that they only put an offer in to save face and had no intention of signing him to a long term deal.

As others have said, the luxury tax is the culprit here.

Obviously you can blame Henry and Co. for signing off on Dombrowski's idiotic Eovaldi deal, and the entirely unnecessary Sale extension, both of which ultimately lead to them dealing Betts.

However, if they did offer him even the same contract that LA just did, they'd be raked over the coals with luxury tax penalties (IE not 6 million a year), and that's before even being able to upgrade their roster in future seasons, thus increasing their tax penalties even further. Let's not forget that they have Devers and Benintendi coming up soon as well.

It sucks they had to deal him, and it sucks that he signed that extension, because he's a phenomenal player, and they are worse in the short term because of it. I do think in the big picture view though, it's better for the full roster moving forward, especially being able to reset their threshold this year, and being able to really do whatever they want this offseason, and for the future, assuming they let Bloom do his job.

 

[LSCII]

As others have said, the luxury tax is the culprit here.

Obviously you can blame Henry and Co. for signing off on Dombrowski's idiotic Eovaldi deal, and the entirely unnecessary Sale extension, both of which ultimately lead to them dealing Betts.

However, if they did offer him even the same contract that LA just did, they'd be raked over the coals with luxury tax penalties (IE not 6 million a year), and that's before even being able to upgrade their roster in future seasons, thus increasing their tax penalties even further. Let's not forget that they have Devers and Benintendi coming up soon as well.

It sucks they had to deal him, and it sucks that he signed that extension, because he's a phenomenal player, and they are worse in the short term because of it. I do think in the big picture view though, it's better for the full roster moving forward, especially being able to reset their threshold this year, and being able to really do whatever they want this offseason, and for the future, assuming they let Bloom do his job.

Like I said last time you brought this up, you don't get to royally f*** your cap up as an organization and then invoke it as the reason you let key players walk. And let's be honest. This started well before DD was even here. Sure he gave dumb money to NE, Sale, and others that ended up not being worth it, but let's not forget about that awful contract they gave to Price, Panda, and several others as a gross overreaction to bricking the Jon Lester negotiations. All of that happened before DD came on board.

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

Love Mookie...but I get not offering him that contract.

Just don't pull the same crap they did with Lester. Don't say you don't sign older pitchers to long term deals, let him walk, and then a year later bring in freaking Price.

Be consistent.

Unfortunately we know our management better than that. They will make some poor signing to placate fans and give the illusion of giving a shit. As usual.

The contract can be debated in the back half but in sports these days it's all about the present and players need to be paid today and tomorrow to win today.

This isn't hockey where depth wins games. It's closer to the NBA where you need game changing superstars. Adjust the roster as needed to fit the superstars and Hall of Famers.

 

[Smitty93]

They basically ended up in the MLB's version of cap hell. If I blame the ownership group for anything it's for hiring Dombrowski. You knew that his strategy was about going all-in for a few years and then leaving the organization as a barren wasteland. They got the result they wanted, so it wasn't a waste, but it was a drastic change from what they had done for the first 15 years of their ownership and you knew it wasn't going to end well. I view this as just another consequence of that.

 

[LSCII]

They basically ended up in the MLB's version of cap hell. If I blame the ownership group for anything it's for hiring Dombrowski. You knew that his strategy was about going all-in for a few years and then leaving the organization as a barren wasteland. They got the result they wanted, so it wasn't a waste, but it was a drastic change from what they had done for the first 15 years of their ownership and you knew it wasn't going to end well. I view this as just another consequence of that.

Yeah, their cap issues started way before Dombrowski was here. Sure he accelerated them and made them worse, but that was his track record for every team he's ever run. Their issue was far greater than signing Sale to a long term deal while he was clearly hurt. Something the ownership absolutely signed off on, despite them pretending it was all DD going rogue. The cap issues started when they got negative press over nickel and diming Jon Lester until he walked out the door. The overreaction after that was Price's huge deal despite him not being a mentally tough enough player for this town, and of course Panda. A guy so lazy and so fat he got paid for years to not actually play here. Those deals were way more of an impact on the cap than Sale's extension.

 

[JRull86]

Like I said last time you brought this up, you don't get to royally f*** your cap up as an organization and then invoke it as the reason you let key players walk. And let's be honest. This started well before DD was even here. Sure he gave dumb money to NE, Sale, and others that ended up not being worth it, but let's not forget about that awful contract they gave to Price, Panda, and several others as a gross overreaction to bricking the Jon Lester negotiations. All of that happened before DD came on board.

Oh trust me I'm not absolving them. Like @Fenway said, it's insane that an ownership group that's won 4 titles in 16 years after not winning for as long as they did, is so universally reviled, and a lot of it is because of dumb shit like the Betts situation, and Lester before them.

Actually Domborwski signed Price.

The issue with Dombrowski wasn't that he signed Price, or traded away most of their chips in the minors, because when they hired him, they knew they were in win now mode. They accomplished that task. The issue was that after their win, they should've reset and not re-signed guys like Eovaldi, and Sale (when they did), and instead, tried to lock up what should've been the future core in Xander (done), Devers, Benintendi, and Betts.

But they obviously chose a different direction, so they have to live with it.

I do think they have the right guy leading the team in Bloom though. And once he's able to really do what he wants to do with the roster, I think the benefits of not signing Mookie to that deal will start to show. And that's not a knock on Betts.

Yeah, their cap issues started way before Dombrowski was here. Sure he accelerated them and made them worse, but that was his track record for every team he's ever run. Their issue was far greater than signing Sale to a long term deal while he was clearly hurt. Something the ownership absolutely signed off on, despite them pretending it was all DD going rogue. The cap issues started when they got negative press over nickel and diming Jon Lester until he walked out the door. The overreaction after that was Price's huge deal despite him not being a mentally tough enough player for this town, and of course Panda. A guy so lazy and so fat he got paid for years to not actually play here. Those deals were way more of an impact on the cap than Sale's extension.

Obviously Sandoval was an absolute disaster, but he counts for 5 million this season then he's off the books. That had no impact on Betts situation.

 

[Merrrlin]

I don't really get the Blue Jays thing - what's happening there? Are they not playing in Toronto? I heard about this on NY radio this morning and it was confusing as hell to hear that Toronto wouldn't be allowed to play in Pittsburgh.

 

[LSCII]

Oh trust me I'm not absolving them. Like @Fenway said, it's insane that an ownership group that's won 4 titles in 16 years after not winning for as long as they did, is so universally reviled, and a lot of it is because of dumb shit like the Betts situation, and Lester before them.

Actually Domborwski signed Price.

The issue with Dombrowski wasn't that he signed Price, or traded away most of their chips in the minors, because when they hired him, they knew they were in win now mode. They accomplished that task. The issue was that after their win, they should've reset and not re-signed guys like Eovaldi, and Sale (when they did), and instead, tried to lock up what should've been the future core in Xander (done), Devers, Benintendi, and Betts.

But they obviously chose a different direction, so they have to live with it.

I do think they have the right guy leading the team in Bloom though. And once he's able to really do what he wants to do with the roster, I think the benefits of not signing Mookie to that deal will start to show. And that's not a knock on Betts.



Obviously Sandoval was an absolute disaster, but he counts for 5 million this season then he's off the books. That had no impact on Betts situation.

Pablo may not have directly impacted the Betts extension, but it did indirectly. They have always used bad deals that they signed as justification for not keeping guys. Them paying Pablo for years to not be here was surely a reason they used internally as for why you don't do long term deals because by the end of it, you could be on the hook for a useless player. Think of Andrew McCutchen as an example. Guy went from MVP to barely making the roster and he's only in his mid 30s. You think the Sox want to be left holding the bag with Betts playing into his 40s for that $$$? No shot. So again, directly no, but definitely indirectly.

 

[Seidenbergy]

Like I said last time you brought this up, you don't get to royally f*** your cap up as an organization and then invoke it as the reason you let key players walk.

Sure you can, if you admit to what happened.

It's no worse than claiming

For less than $6 Mill per year extra, they could have kept the guy.

You can't really say that with a straight face.

 

[N o o d l e s]

I don't really get the Blue Jays thing - what's happening there? Are they not playing in Toronto? I heard about this on NY radio this morning and it was confusing as hell to hear that Toronto wouldn't be allowed to play in Pittsburgh.

Canada won’t allow them to play there because of the continuous travel in and out of states by them and their opponents

 

[LSCII]

Sure you can, if you admit to what happened.

It's no worse than claiming



You can't really say that with a straight face.

Sure you can. When you break down the AAV of a deal and see that the difference really is peanuts for the team, it's completely fair to do. It also makes you wonder why they shook down ERod over a few hundred K in arbitration. It screams that they're cheaping out hardcore. They waste money on garbage players to make a headline, and then f*** up retaining the homegrown guys they should because they overpaid for stiffs in free agency before. It's a vicious cycle that this ownership group has played for years now. And just watch. If Betts goes out and kills it early in that contract and they get bad press over it, they'll sign the biggest named guy available to a long term anchor of a deal that they will years later use as a reason to not retain the homegrown talent. I can't make this up, it's that obvious.

It's called Red Sox.

 

[GabeTravels]

I would've signed Mookie to that deal, even more...but I can understand ownership not wanting to.

It's their own fault for mismanaging this whole thing. Going all the way back to letter Lester go. Domino effect.

 

[McGarnagle]

6 hours until meaningful baseball, everyone

 

[LSCII]

6 hours until meaningful baseball, everyone

Is it really meaningful though? I get it's new, and I get it's "real", but meaningful, not so much. Baseball has always been about the grind and playing through the attrition of injuries. It's not a grind now at all. It's a sprint. And that's simply not baseball. That's why whomever wins deserves an asterisk, whether it's physical or just in public opinion. It's just not the same.

 

[McGarnagle]

Is it really meaningful though? I get it's new, and I get it's "real", but meaningful, not so much. Baseball has always been about the grind and playing through the attrition of injuries. It's not a grind now at all. It's a sprint. And that's simply not baseball. That's why whomever wins deserves an asterisk, whether it's physical or just in public opinion. It's just not the same.

It counts in the standings, so it's meaningful.

Unless the Yankees win, then it deserves an asterisk for fake season.

 

[LSCII]

It counts in the standings, so it's meaningful.

Unless the Yankees win, then it deserves an asterisk for fake season.

I get that it will officially count, but it's not the same and never will be. It's an outlier. I mean crap, if the Sox win, I'll still be happy for them and for the area, but it won't be like the rest because it's a glorified spring training then right into the playoffs.

 

[Merrrlin]

Is it really meaningful though? I get it's new, and I get it's "real", but meaningful, not so much. Baseball has always been about the grind and playing through the attrition of injuries. It's not a grind now at all. It's a sprint. And that's simply not baseball. That's why whomever wins deserves an asterisk, whether it's physical or just in public opinion. It's just not the same.

I'm just happy to watch some sports to be honest. As much as I've enjoyed watching my fiancee's plant collection grow...good to have something passionate to cheer for again.

Go Mets :'(

 

[Therick67]

I'm just glad we are staring to see live sports return, however meaningful/meaningless it is..

 

[LSCII]

I'm just happy to watch some sports to be honest. As much as I've enjoyed watching my fiancee's plant collection grow...good to have something passionate to cheer for again.

Go Mets :'(

Sure, but sports have already been back. UFC has had a ton of events, MLS soccer, and NASCAR as well, if any are your cup of tea. I'm not a fan of soccer or watching people in cars take 400 left turns for hours, but I definitely enjoyed the MMA.

 

[LSCII]

I'm just glad we are staring to see live sports return, however meaningful/meaningless it is..

Live sports have already been back for a while now. UFC, MLS, and NASCAR have all had multiple games or events.