Player Discussion: Brayden Point - Part 3

Byrddog

Lifer
Nov 23, 2007
7,534
845
Stamkos is no longer making 11%. Kucherov and Vasy won't be making 11% by 2022. Point will get something in that range because that's the low end for a star player. But, with the new TV deal, the cap could be up significantly be then. And if it's not, Point gets 9 - 9.5, which really isn't that much more than he's likely to sign on a bridge deal.



That's actually pretty low, considering the quality. Both Hedman and McDonagh outplayed their contracts last year.

Even so, as the cap rises, their percentage gets lower, opening up money. The year we really have to worry about losing players is next year. But it's also important to remember that every year, money comes off the books. And, every year, more NTCs loosen, and become moveable. Next year it's Killorn. Then it's Johnson and Palat. We won't always be in a position where we can't free up money.




It also leaves tens of millions on the table. That's not an easy thing to do, regardless how much money they're talking. We can fit Point under the cap, short-term now, long-term later. It's impossible to know exactly where the cap will be, but if Point keeps playing like he did last year, he'll be a 26 year-old 1C, and Stamkos by then will be 32. Keeping Point will be Priority #1, unless some other magical prospect pops up between now and then.



Part of the beauty of a 3 year deal is he'll still be an RFA. But Stamkos's contract will be in it's last couple of years by then, and he's unlikely to be the #1C, and even more unlikely to get another raise when the current contract expires. Point's main value is he gives us a #1C beyond Stamkos's prime, which extends our window.



Friday seems like an arbitrary date. They'll keep hammering away at a deal. It probably gets done.

We don't have the money to sign him long-term. It's just not realistic to ask him to sign through his prime for 2-3m less, per year, than players he might well be better than.

But, if we bridge him now, we should have some money available in 2022. At the very least, it gives us three years to plan a way toward signing Point long-term.


There are a few flaws in this first you assume that there is going to be a substantial increase in the cap for the remaining years of the CBA. Last years 4 mil increase has proven to have been a mistake. It caused the players association to refuse to approve the escrow which had more effect on the CAP than any will admit. While the cap went up 2 mil this year in reality it should have only increased 500k. Why? League wide attendance is down actual butts in seats. Now a number of teams show sellouts but continue to have large areas of empty seats in the arena see Detroit and Chicago for two examples. This does not indicate a healthy league. There are mixed reports about TV revenue increases for this reason. Forbes the biggest pumper I have seen indicated that TV revenue would increase 300 million per year. Which is a drop in the bucket compared to other professional sports. As much as we would like the NHL tobe more popular it just is not in fact it is getting close to being passed by MLS friggin soccer which will land the league as the 5th most popular sport in North Americas. Now combine all that with the CBA ending the players already have refused shown decreasing interest in escrow and one can fully expect the teams to tighten there belt waiting on the next CBA. 2 mil increase to the cap each year until 22 is very optimistic. But lets be optimistic this would increase the cap to 87.5 mil. When the last CBA was signed it was predicted that the CAP would be 101.5 mil by the end of the contract. Its not close.

Now to the 11% threshold Kuch would be at 10.8 mil and Stammer at 9.7 Vasi at 10.8% these numbers include the 2 mil per year cap increase. Then add in Hedman at another 9%. How many players can a team field with each getting 10% of the cap which is basically whats goin on here.
And still remain a threat for the championship. Look at what it did to Chicago and Detroit. While it is true that under a cap system this has become the model to win cups build a team peak then cycle down to a rebuild and go at it again it creates a 10 year cycle which holds the league back IMO. But I degress. Point most assuredly deserves to be paid. And right now if you can afford a 8 mil bridge you can afford a 10 mil 7 year deal. Its a small cap move of ridding the team of the excess defensemen on the roster now so by opening day its doable but your at the top of the cap with no room to bring in a warm body if there is an injury short of call ups.

Do not spend all that TV money too fast first one has to see what the teams part is.. If the increase is in fact the 300 mil across 31 teams you looking at 9.6 mil per team that is with the generosity of the league not taking a thin dime that will happen right. The TV contract will be for how many years???? Rodgers last one was 10 years right so to max the money lets say this one is 5 years this could put 1.9 mil to each team in cap increase if everything is perfect but just as with the last contract something will go wrong. The cap by 2022 was supposed to be 101.5 and best case now will only be 87.5 that's a 14 mil shortfall or 13% lower than was expected. so 1.9 mil minus 13% will put teams at 1.6 mil cap increase assuming that attendance remains the same as well as other revenue lanes. This is not sustainable to continue increasing individual salaries at the current pace. This is not the federal government where you can just print more money.

I love the makeup of the forwards on the team and with the exception of Palat I do not think any are overpaid and that is the problem even I want to pay the guys more than what is feasible. The teams defense budget is far too low right now as well we got the two superstars paid the rest are bargain basement contracts which can not be sustained there will have to be at least two contracts in the 4 to 5 mil range for two top 4 guys then the third pair guys making 1.5 to 3.5 unless you can have a pipeline of Sergi's and Footes to ride there ELC's something this team has had problems doing over the years for blueliners.

As to the Friday deadline its pretty much still my thoughts while still early in preseason we are three weeks until the games count each day Point is not on the ice is a day into the regular season for team chemistry. The Ahlers will be going back to there team next week so this Friday is important.

Now I agree with you about Point being the 1C past Stammers prime but Stammer has not really played that 1C for two years now Point has been in that slot the center depth on this team right now is really sick. The top 9 are the best in the league from top to bottom talent wise and scoring wise in the regular season there is not a team close. Teams can argue there top line against us if we continue to put Kuch on that 2nd line but you put Point Stammer and Kuch together there is not a better line out there for scoring. I can see a day that we move Stammer back to center the 2nd line with Point as the 1C and Johnson the 3C but all of this hinges on Cap.
 

Byrddog

Lifer
Nov 23, 2007
7,534
845
I have no problem paying star players.

If anything, it should force some common sense on JBB from giving middle 6 players 5 million dollar contracts. Pay your stars, save on depth.
The question is what are 20 goal guys worth we had basically 7 of those last year and they were 40 point guys as well. Most teams will pay those guys 4.5 to 5.5. Should we pay less because we have three 40 goal 90 point players????? We are forced to pay those guys what other teams pay them due to the fact that those teams do not have the 90 point guy. Does it make it right well no but that's what this team is facing.
 

Byrddog

Lifer
Nov 23, 2007
7,534
845
They have had a half a year of this like 5-6 months lol ya patience is getting thin because camp started a week ago.
Im with you they could have got Point resigned before the end of the season last year as well. It time for the team to be set.
 

Sky04

Registered User
Jan 8, 2009
29,666
18,992
Imagine if they took Todd's advice and traded Kucherov when he held out as a 60 point player.

Would've been a great return.
 

Sky04

Registered User
Jan 8, 2009
29,666
18,992
The question is what are 20 goal guys worth we had basically 7 of those last year and they were 40 point guys as well. Most teams will pay those guys 4.5 to 5.5. Should we pay less because we have three 40 goal 90 point players????? We are forced to pay those guys what other teams pay them due to the fact that those teams do not have the 90 point guy. Does it make it right well no but that's what this team is facing.

You can still pay those guys their value, you just can't have as much of them because you have said 90 point players..
 
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Sky04

Registered User
Jan 8, 2009
29,666
18,992
An agent would be dumb to NOT say that during a negotiation. He's trying to get as much as he can for his client so it would be stupid to say "We're really close". All leverage goes out the window there, doesn't it?

Yeah... and with these contracts they can literally be done after 1 good conversation.
 
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Felonious Python

Minor League Degenerate
Aug 20, 2004
32,075
9,613
I'm sure there is not much concern while there are 56 players in camp... once the roster gets trimmed substantially (this weekend) is when I think we start entering crunch time..
Starting from the top of the organization, Mr. Vinik is a hedge fund guy. As a group, they don't have weak hands. Yzerman didn't. The only people we need to worry about is JBB & Associates (and I'm not concerned).
 

T REX

Registered User
Feb 28, 2013
12,218
9,791
An agent would be dumb to NOT say that during a negotiation. He's trying to get as much as he can for his client so it would be stupid to say "We're really close". All leverage goes out the window there, doesn't it?

Tbh, that's opposite when negotiating in good faith. Far apart is far apart. You don't lose any leverage by saying we're real close. Point's agent seems like he is doing his job and getting as much as he can for his client. I hate paying players based off a single season. Take the bridge and cash in for more $$$ later on.
 

DMB06

Registered User
Jun 3, 2015
1,662
1,480
Possibly an unpopular opinion but if Point is more interested in breaking the bank, even to the detriment of the team going forward, then adios bud. Not everyone can get what they're worth on a loaded team, if Point doesn't understand this then playing for another franchise is probably what's best.
 

HoseEmDown

Registered User
Mar 25, 2012
17,539
3,754
You can still pay those guys their value, you just can't have as much of them because you have said 90 point players..

Prior to this past season do you know how many 90 point players we had since Stamkos had 60g and 97p in 11-12? One, that was Kucherov hitting 100 two seasons ago. Those guys who got their 4-5+ deals were top 5 scorers for us at the time. We didn't know Point would be this kind of player and besides Drouin we really didnt have anyone who looked like they might be a 90 point player.
 

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