Brad Treliving is doing a great job.

[Nineteen67]

Neither is worst in the league, just would like some consistency on these boards about if we judge trades based on results or how the players were before the trade.

The Tkachuk trade was great if you ignore its results, and terrible if you don't.

If not the bottom of the list they’re close to it.

Dubas was given a bunch of parts to build a car and we don’t know if he was supposed to build a Lamborghini or a Prius because he wreck the plant before it got off the assembly line.

Treliving’s record of leaving a disaster wherever he goes speaks for itself

 

[TheTotalPackage]

Neither is worst in the league, just would like some consistency on these boards about if we judge trades based on results or how the players were before the trade.

The Tkachuk trade was great if you ignore its results, and terrible if you don't.

It's okay to suggest that a trade was great at the time that in the end worked out poorly.

No different than the Kadri/Barrie-Kerfoot trade. At the time it was a reasonable deal (IMO at least). In the end it turned out very shitty.

At least Calgary still has tangible returns from the Tkachuk deal that can still make the trade reasonable. Don't think anyone predicted the huge drop off that Huberdeau has had. Was he going to put up 115 points again? Highly unlikely. Put up 50-point seasons? Yikes.

 

[arso40]

So Kadri got traded for a #1D who was a top 10 D for scoring, and a defensively responsible C who can play up and down the lineup.

That Kadri trade was a home run, we got a #1D who played 22+ minutes a night and scored at a great rate, it was robbery since we also got a defensively responsible D to replace Kadri.

Kerfoot is not a center or let me rephrase that he’s not a good one and Barrie was never a good number 1 d that’s why they traded him

 

[arso40]

It's okay to suggest that a trade was great at the time that in the end worked out poorly.

No different than the Kadri/Barrie-Kerfoot trade. At the time it was a reasonable deal (IMO at least). In the end it turned out very shitty.

At least Calgary still has tangible returns from the Tkachuk deal that can still make the trade reasonable. Don't think anyone predicted the huge drop off that Huberdeau has had. Was he going to put up 115 points again? Highly unlikely. Put up 50-point seasons? Yikes.

I disagree I hated the trade the moment we made it

 

[TheTotalPackage]

I disagree I hated the trade the moment we made it

The witch hunt to get Kadri out of here after the playoffs was on. I'd rather have kept him, but it was deemed that he had to be moved for the betterment of the organization.

Barrie was fine as a target. He was to be another offensive d-man to help Rielly out. He just never panned out. I agree though -- the Kerfoot love was completely misplaced. The fact people thought he was the equivalent of Kadri considering he may have brought a bit less, but came in cheaper, never made any sense. He was a run-of-the-mill 3rd liner who brought very little in replacement of Kadri.

 

[notbias]

If not the bottom of the list they’re close to it.

Dubas was given a bunch of parts to build a car and we don’t know if he was supposed to build a Lamborghini or a Prius because he wreck the plant before it got off the assembly line.

Treliving’s record of leaving a disaster wherever he goes speaks for itself

Are the players good again?

Can never remember if the players Dubas inherited are studs or duds.

Kerfoot is not a center or let me rephrase that he’s not a good one and Barrie was never a good number 1 d that’s why they traded him

He produced like one and Coloardo played him as one... so we are either using how he performed in the place he was before the trade as an indicator for how good the trade was or not...

You can't use it for Huberdeau and ignore it for Barrie.

It's okay to suggest that a trade was great at the time that in the end worked out poorly.

No different than the Kadri/Barrie-Kerfoot trade. At the time it was a reasonable deal (IMO at least). In the end it turned out very shitty.

At least Calgary still has tangible returns from the Tkachuk deal that can still make the trade reasonable. Don't think anyone predicted the huge drop off that Huberdeau has had. Was he going to put up 115 points again? Highly unlikely. Put up 50-point seasons? Yikes.

Signing him to a long terrible contract was the cherry on top...

 

[arso40]

Are the players good again?

Can never remember if the players Dubas inherited are studs or duds.



He produced like one and Coloardo played him as one... so we are either using how he performed in the place he was before the trade as an indicator for how good the trade was or not...

You can't use it for Huberdeau and ignore it for Barrie.



Signing him to a long terrible contract was the cherry on top...

I actually can cause hubi been a good player in the league Barrie was replaceable the moment makar made his debut in the playoffs Barrie was Rielly on Colorado great forwards make you look even better

 

[notbias]

I actually can cause hubi been a good player in the league Barrie was replaceable the moment makar made his debut in the playoffs Barrie was Rielly on Colorado great forwards make you look even better

What are you going on about?

Barrie was as replaceable as Huberdeau...

Did you just start watching this year?

What great forwards?

MacKinnon wasn't the same player he is today, Rantanen was under PPG, Landeskog was close to Barrie level production, and then after that it was Duchene, then Kerfoot for production.

Barrie was 4th in PPG on Colorado the 3 years prior to leaving Colorado, 0.06 off of Landeskog...

Barrie was a big piece of their offensive firepower.

 

[Nineteen67]

Are the players good again?

Can never remember if the players Dubas inherited are studs or duds.



He produced like one and Coloardo played him as one... so we are either using how he performed in the place he was before the trade as an indicator for how good the trade was or not...

You can't use it for Huberdeau and ignore it for Barrie.



Signing him to a long terrible contract was the cherry on top...

We didn’t know what they were, neither did he, yet he decided to abandon the rebuild.

Turns out, they are not good enough and have no assets to help them.

Terrible blunder.

 

[hamzarocks]

What are you going on about?

Barrie was as replaceable as Huberdeau...

Did you just start watching this year?

What great forwards?

MacKinnon wasn't the same player he is today, Rantanen was under PPG, Landeskog was close to Barrie level production, and then after that it was Duchene, then Kerfoot for production.

Barrie was 4th in PPG on Colorado the 3 years prior to leaving Colorado, 0.06 off of Landeskog...

View attachment 922882

Barrie was a big piece of their offensive firepower.

It is crazy that the Avs got rid of Barrie, Duchene, Kerfoot and went to win a cup

3 of the lowest +/- and worst defensive players on that list.

Mackinnon was mackinnon back then. 2018 he was 2nd in hart, 2019 he was 5th or 6th I think

Rantanen was elite but not at the level he is now.

Barrie was a 1-D.offensive player who relied on being given prime offensive time to generate offense while giving up significantly more in return.

Him being a 1-year rental who wanted a big pay day while we had our own internal deals we had to work through on -(Andersen who after 2019 was considered part of core and needed a big pay day + hyman who was also only 2 years from UFA)

Barrie made no sense from a team building perspective. He was a 1 year gamble who was going to try and pile 70 pts on the leafs while being a big time defensive black hole and then get paid elsewhere.

We learned quickly our offensive stars arent Avs trio or Oilers core guys as they got the most out of a flawed player in Barrie

 

[notbias]

We didn’t know what they were, neither did he, yet he decided to abandon the rebuild.

Turns out, they are not good enough and have no assets to help them.

Terrible blunder.

But they produced like top rookies... there is a track record... this is the argument as to why the Huberdeau deal was good..

 

[Nineteen67]

But they produced like top rookies... there is a track record... this is the argument as to why the Huberdeau deal was good..

That’s a part of their work. But there were also many flaws evident that a competent GM wouldn’t have abandoned the rebuild.
Not to mention he had no D or goaltending.

 

[notbias]

It is crazy that the Avs got rid of Barrie, Duchene, Kerfoot and went to win a cup

3 of the lowest +/- and worst defensive players on that list.

Mackinnon was mackinnon back then. 2018 he was 2nd in hart, 2019 he was 5th or 6th I think

Rantanen was elite but not at the level he is now.

Barrie was a 1-D.offensive player who relied on being given prime offensive time to generate offense while giving up significantly more in return.

Him being a 1-year rental who wanted a big pay day while we had our own internal deals we had to work through on -(Andersen who after 2019 was considered part of core and needed a big pay day + hyman who was also only 2 years from UFA)

Barrie made no sense from a team building perspective. He was a 1 year gamble who was going to try and pile 70 pts on the leafs while being a big time defensive black hole and then get paid elsewhere.

We learned quickly our offensive stars arent Avs trio or Oilers core guys as they got the most out of a flawed player in Barrie

Kerfoot was as bad as Rantanen if you want to use +/- as the metric.

Barrie produced the same as he did in Colorado when Babcock was fired.

Mac was not the same then as he is now, he was coming into his game but now it is a different level.

The other stuff can be argued about fit... but that is the same argument I am arguing as to why the Huberdeau trade sucked, so thanks for helping.

 

[arso40]

What are you going on about?

Barrie was as replaceable as Huberdeau...

Did you just start watching this year?

What great forwards?

MacKinnon wasn't the same player he is today, Rantanen was under PPG, Landeskog was close to Barrie level production, and then after that it was Duchene, then Kerfoot for production.

Barrie was 4th in PPG on Colorado the 3 years prior to leaving Colorado, 0.06 off of Landeskog...

View attachment 922882

Barrie was a big piece of their offensive firepower.

Joker I’ve been watching my whole life you see the big red dash beside his name I’m going to assume that’s his plus minus how are they comparable exactly ?

 

[notbias]

Joker I’ve been watching my whole life you see the big red dash beside his name I’m going to assume that’s his plus minus how are they comparable exactly ?

-12 and -16 over 3 seasons is not that big of a difference...

Counting hard?

 

[arso40]

-12 and -16 over 3 seasons is not that big of a difference...

Counting hard?

Your a goof kid where are you

 

[hamzarocks]

Kerfoot was as bad as Rantanen if you want to use +/- as the metric.

Barrie produced the same as he did in Colorado when Babcock was fired.

Mac was not the same then as he is now, he was coming into his game but now it is a different level.

The other stuff can be argued about fit... but that is the same argument I am arguing as to why the Huberdeau trade sucked, so thanks for helping.

Kerfoot provided little offense while being worse defensively than Rantanen and getting PP1 time to prop up his stats. Of course you would ignore that.

Barrie didn't produce here, he had I believe 37 pts in 70 games. I get you love to cherry pick and try to weasel your way around to pretend your arguments are consistent but the truth is Barrie sucked hard over the course of 2020 with a barely 0.5ppg and our core guys not being able to be good enough to prop him up.

Mackinnon was a top 5 player back then and was the top 3 in 2018. Similar to now where he is 2nd or 3rd behind Mcdavid and competing with Kucherov

League scoring is higher now and the Avs are better team with no Barrie or Kerfoots there so his offense stands out more, but his absurd talent and prime was already 2 years in by 2019 summer when we acquired Barrie.

The huberdeau trade sucked post trade based on results that came. There was little risk at the time of trade and major flexability for treliving who could have signed 1 or both Huberdeau/Weeger, let them 1 or both walk to UFA or traded 1 or both

The barrie trade sucked as we got a guy we had little ability to extend had he even performed. If he performed and put up strong personal stats and we lost in R1 as is the case for the leafs, he walks to UFA and you have no RHD from the Kadri deal long-term.

We also locked in kerfoot who was ~30-35 pt guy for 4 years at 3.5M AAV. A guy who was poor defensively, had very little grit and intangibles, and could not priduce outside of 2nd Line LW spot for a few stretches a year.

Dubas kept around as a personal project to try and look better for a horrific trade that left the leafs with nothing of value and the Avs with a cup.

The Kadri trade was Dubas being desperate and making a rushed trade. It had very little upside for us.

You mentioned you want your GMs to be able to build for the LT and not only for 1 year at a time, but Dubas did exactly that He dealt one of our best trade assets who had 3 years term for a 1-year win now move in an hail mary attempt after 2019 embarassing loss to Boston.

Like always, you are never consistent and pretend to be unbiased when you are nothing but.

 

[notbias]

Your a goof kid where are you

you're*

grammar doesn't seem to be your forte either.

You haven't been attacking anything other than me in your posts.

Your posts contradict each other constantly.

 

[notbias]

Kerfoot provided little offense while being worse defensively than Rantanen and getting PP1 time to prop up his stats. Of course you would ignore that.

Barrie didn't produce here, he had I believe 37 pts in 70 games. I get you love to cherry pick and try to weasel your way around to pretend your arguments are consistent but the truth is Barrie sucked hard over the course of 2020 with a barely 0.5ppg and our core guys not being able to be good enough to prop him up.

Barrie produced at 0.68 when Keefe took over and was deployed correctly.

Mackinnon was a top 5 player back then and was the top 3 in 2018. Similar to now where he is 2nd or 3rd behind Mcdavid and competing with Kucherov

And production-wise?

League scoring is higher now and the Avs are better team with no Barrie or Kerfoots there so his offense stands out more, but his absurd talent and prime was already 2 years in by 2019 summer when we acquired Barrie.

2 of the 3 years we are discussing... and well below his current scoring levels.

The huberdeau trade sucked post trade based on results that came. There was little risk at the time of trade and major flexability for treliving who could have signed 1 or both Huberdeau/Weeger, let them 1 or both walk to UFA or traded 1 or both

Okay, we agree it sucked.

The barrie trade sucked as we got a guy we had little ability to extend had he even performed. If he performed and put up strong personal stats and we lost in R1 as is the case for the leafs, he walks to UFA and you have no RHD from the Kadri deal long-term.

Not arguing the trade was good, the results also were not good.

We also locked in kerfoot who was ~30-35 pt guy for 4 years at 3.5M AAV. A guy who was poor defensively, had very little grit and intangibles, nd could not priduce outside of 2nd Line LW spot for a few stretches a year.

He isn't poor defensively, you are losing credibility the more you are talking.

Dubas kept around as a personal project to tru and look better for a horrific trade that left the leafs with nothing of value and the Avs with a cup.

The Kadri trade was Dubas being desperate and making a rushed trade. It had very little upside for us.

Our fanbase wanted him out.

You mentioned you want your GMs to be able to build for the LT and not only for 1 year at a time, but Dubas did exactly that He dealt one of our best trade assets who had 3 years term for a 1-year win now move in an hail mary attempt after 2019 embarassing loss to Boston.

Like always, you are never consistent and pretend to be unbiased when you are nothing but.

You are talking about nothing this entire post... can't stay on topic.

 

[hamzarocks]

you're*

grammar doesn't seem to be your forte either.

You haven't been attacking anything other than me in your posts.

Your posts contract each other constantly.

again you ignore the post b/c it is clear to anyone who frequents these boards that you don't post anything of value and are always either trying to defend Dubas who is long gone or blaming any one but the core.

I am not the only one who recognizes you are posting nothing but false narratives and trying to change history for how the 2019-2023 leafs were mismanged. Majority of the posters on these boards can see through your act by now.

The only thing you are consistent at is defending the core/dubas/keefe

I get being a fanboy for a player but for a GM or coach is hard to imagine. Only you and dekes for days constantly scoop to that level.

 

[notbias]

again you ignore the post b/c it is clear to anyone who frequents these boards that you don't post anything of value and are always either trying to defend Dubas who is long gone or blaming any one but the core.

I am not the only one who recognizes you are posting nothing but false narratives and trying to change history for how the 2019-2023 leafs were mismanged. Majority of the posters on these boards can see through your act by now.

The only thing you are consistent at is defending the core/dubas/keefe

I get being a fanboy for a player but for a GM or coach is hard to imagine. Only you and dekes for days constantly scoop to that level.

You said the same thing in 4 different paragraphs... work on condensing this into a single point... I know your time is not valuable, but others would appreciate it.

I also was never defending Dubas, I was saying if the Huberdeau trade was good on paper, so was the Kadri trade, both ended up as bad trades.

Anyway, enjoy arguing a point that was never made.

 

[hamzarocks]

Barrie produced at 0.68 when Keefe took over and was deployed correctly.



And production-wise?



2 of the 3 years we are discussing... and well below his current scoring levels.



Okay, we agree it sucked.



Not arguing the trade was good, the results also were not good.



He isn't poor defensively, you are losing credibility the more you are talking.



Our fanbase wanted him out.



You are talking about nothing this entire post... can't stay on topic.

Man do you watch hockey? Watch the leafs?

You post like an average idiot on reddit.

Your takes are horrible and they are repeated with such confidence its hard to believe that your account cam be anything but a troll/parody account.

You were the poster pretending kerfoot is great defensively, and that he was a physical/gritty player compared to domi in game. Such an absurd take for anyone who watches the leafs

You posted about the GM needing to.build a team for beyond 1 year in the McCabe signing thread I think, and then backtrack on that opinion

You are nothing but a hypocrite.

 

[arso40]

again you ignore the post b/c it is clear to anyone who frequents these boards that you don't post anything of value and are always either trying to defend Dubas who is long gone or blaming any one but the core.

I am not the only one who recognizes you are posting nothing but false narratives and trying to change history for how the 2019-2023 leafs were mismanged. Majority of the posters on these boards can see through your act by now.

The only thing you are consistent at is defending the core/dubas/keefe

I get being a fanboy for a player but for a GM or coach is hard to imagine. Only you and dekes for days constantly scoop to that level.

He’s on my ignore list I don’t have time for trolls healthy debates are always welcomed but he gets down right disrespectful and I know if I saw him face to face he’d haul ass

 

[notbias]

Man do you watch hockey? Watch the leafs?

You post like an average idiot on reddit.

Your takes are horrible and they are repeated with such confidence its hard to believe that your account cam be anything but a troll/parody account.

You were the poster pretending kerfoot is great defensively, and that he was a physical/gritty player compared to domi in game. Such an absurd take for anyone who watches the leafs

You posted about the GM needing to.build a team for beyond 1 year in the McCabe signing thread I think, and then backtrack on that opinion

You are nothing but a hypocrite.

All very valid points (there were no points here).

Try attacking an argument instead of making some up or referencing other posts out of context, it will help.

He’s on my ignore list I don’t have time for trolls healthy debates are always welcomed but he gets down right disrespectful and I know if I saw him face to face he’d haul ass

"I need a safe space"

1. Weird that you'd want to attack someone for words.
2. You don't know me, so that is a very weird assumption you'd make that I'd be the slightest bit afraid of you.

Anything I say here, I'd say to someone's face.

 

[hamzarocks]

You said the same thing in 4 different paragraphs... work on condensing this into a single point... I know your time is not valuable, but others would appreciate it.

I also was never defending Dubas, I was saying if the Huberdeau trade was good on paper, so was the Kadri trade, both ended up as bad trades.

Anyway, enjoy arguing a point that was never made.

I can't imagine your time being valuable, when you are trolling the boards constantly lool.

The point was made lol, you were called out on your biased take and view towards Treliving extension on the D not being good for future GM/long-term building of the team.

You ignored that Dubas did this as well with the Barrie deal. You are frequently ignoring and picking and choosing what you care to respond to.

No point bothering with you again, will save us both the trouble of having to respond to each others post and ignore you. That way I am not wasting your time and you are not mine