Proposal: Bo Horvat to Detroit

[Rey]

I like Veleno but I would be very surprised he ever puts up the point totals Horvat has averaged. I do not see the Wings doing anything major if Larkin and Veleno our are two most offensively gifted centers

This all depends what people think Horvat is vs what he actually is. The media gives an impression that he’s a mini Toews or mini Bergeron but it’s the farthest thing from the truth.

Horvat does not have the speed to be good defensively. He has a good shot, where they have a set play on the PP to set him up in the slot. He often cheats offensively cause his foot speed isn’t there but he’s good at face offs. He’s also failed as a captain. Your young player could get rocked and hell just stand there. A Sean Monahan Fall off is about to happen. I don’t think Steve Yzerman is stupid enough to make this deal.

As for the Canucks. If they decide to go into a proper rebuild, should do this in a heart beat.

 

[kanucks25]

Value might be fair but I just don't see Yzerman doing a deal like this.

 

[Hammettf2b]

I wouldn't do it if I'm Detroit. Would rather just keep the assets.

 

[BStinson]

I’d be much more curious what would need to added for EP as opposed to Horvat. Some Vancouver fans have hinted as him being the “cancer” in the locker room if it’s not potentially Miller.

 

[The Red Line]

The value might be right, but I don't do it as Detroit, nothing against Horvat. Yzerman has shown a great ability to draft talent so I don't like the idea of giving up a first until the Wings are well into their competitive window, which they aren't yet.

Lots of Wings fans seem to want to trade Hronek for some reason, but the Wings are actually pretty thin on established NHL d-men, I think moving on from him would be a mistake until we know some of the prospects (not talking about Seider) are actually NHL ready. They could/should lose some or all of Dekeyser, Staal, Leddy, Stetcher in the off-season so they'll need some bodies back there on D, can't expect to it to be all Seider and a bunch of rookies.

Also, I happen to like Veleno a lot. I don't know if he will ever really put it together but I like the way he plays and he's still got great upside.

 

[Rey]

I’d be much more curious what would need to added for EP as opposed to Horvat. Some Vancouver fans have hinted as him being the “cancer” in the locker room if it’s not potentially Miller.

I don’t think it’s either who are the cancer. The cancer might be Horvat

 

[TCNorthstars]

Think we’d need to change that second to a first (albeit with some top 10 or so protection or just next year’s in general).

For a 2c? No way.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

I’d be much more curious what would need to added for EP as opposed to Horvat. Some Vancouver fans have hinted as him being the “cancer” in the locker room if it’s not potentially Miller.

Spill the tea, sister.

How are Horvat and/or JT Miller locker room cancers?

 

[Patagonia]

DET is not moving their 1st for a player with less than 2 years remaining.

 

[dragonballgtz]

That's way too high of a price for Horvat.

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

DET is not moving their 1st for a player with less than 2 years remaining.

I probably should've taken greater effort to specify, but in my post I mentioned that this trade would take place in the summer with an extension agreed between Horvat and Detroit.

 

[raymond23]

Not close to moving a 1st round pick yet

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

This all depends what people think Horvat is vs what he actually is. The media gives an impression that he’s a mini Toews or mini Bergeron but it’s the farthest thing from the truth.

Horvat does not have the speed to be good defensively. He has a good shot, where they have a set play on the PP to set him up in the slot. He often cheats offensively cause his foot speed isn’t there but he’s good at face offs. He’s also failed as a captain. Your young player could get rocked and hell just stand there. A Sean Monahan Fall off is about to happen. I don’t think Steve Yzerman is stupid enough to make this deal.

As for the Canucks. If they decide to go into a proper rebuild, should do this in a heart beat.

Ahhh another "expert" seems like so many of you coming out of the woodwork, conveniently as we are playing so bad.

Your assessment of Horvat is just plain wrong, failed as a captain, because he won't fight, everything else he does that shows he is a true leader can be ignored because of the couple of times, he didn't fight..... and comparing him to Monohan is hilarious, you couldn't be more clueless.

 

[njx9]

For the Wings, I don't hate it - I suppose it depends on what happens in the '22 draft (and I probably wouldn't make the trade before it occurred). If the team somehow picks in the stud C range, then I'm probably less inclined to do it - if we get Wright, for instance, Veleno and Hronek are more valuable to the team than Horvat would be, imo. If we, expectedly, get maximally boned by the lottery as usual, then getting another top 6 C has a ton of value to me.

Given our trajectory, the '23 first has less value to me than actually solving the C issue.

 

[MBH]

I'm pretty trash at gauging player value, but I thought I'd give this a stab.

Realistically I don't think this is a trade that would happen until the summer, in a scenario where Vancouver moves in a new direction and Horvat could agree to an extension in Detroit.

I'm open to discussing other assets from Detroit's end. You're welcome to ask for Larkin, Seider, Raymond, and Edvinsson, but if I'm honest I think that Yzerman is unlikely to move those pieces right now.

DET receives: Bo Horvat

VAN receives: DET '23 1st round pick, Filip Hronek (RHD), Joe Veleno (C)

No from Detroit.
1) Horvat's contract.
He's got 1 more year left at $5.5M.
If he returns to 55-60 point Horvat, he'll get a big raise.
If he's .6 PPG Horvat then what? Hronek provides that from defense.
Is that worth a first, Hronek and Veleno?
No.
2) Age.
He'll be 27 by the end of the season.
How many years do you think you're getting out of Horvat?

 

[Rey]

Ahhh another "expert" seems like so many of you coming out of the woodwork, conveniently as we are playing so bad.

Your assessment of Horvat is just plain wrong, failed as a captain, because he won't fight, everything else he does that shows he is a true leader can be ignored because of the couple of times, he didn't fight..... and comparing him to Monohan is hilarious, you couldn't be more clueless.

I had the same opinion when the Canucks were playing good. Put your homer glasses off.

everything else that shows that he’s a leader? LOL like what ? He’s terrible defensively . He cheats offensively. Doesn’t stick up for teammates. Very leadership like

the most telling is when they do interviews and segments . All the boys are getting along together and horvat is never there with them. Going off on alone doing his lays commercial and cashing in on being the captain

 

[BStinson]

Spill the tea, sister.

How are Horvat and/or JT Miller locker room cancers?

According to Nuck fans Miller has been caught getting into it with various staff and teammates. In the Benning thread they showed clips of Miller going after Boeser. I’m not going to claim to know their internal issues but that was speculation based on their observations from Nuck fans.

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

I had the same opinion when the Canucks were playing good. Put your homer glasses off.

everything else that shows that he’s a leader? LOL like what ? He’s terrible defensively . He cheats offensively. Doesn’t stick up for teammates. Very leadership like

the most telling is when they do interviews and segments . All the boys are getting along together and horvat is never there with them. Going off on alone doing his lays commercial and cashing in on being the captain

No homer glasses for me I just watch the player, he has actually gotten into fights sticking up for teammates in the past, if you knew anything about him you'd know that. Plenty of the HOF captains that didn't fight, because you know, fighting doesn't make you a good leader. He's not terrible defensively, one of our only decent PKers actually, he's a 2 way elite 2C, everyone knows this except you. One of the most clutch players on our team, his 11 goals in 23 playoff games kinda speaks to that, but you knew that right?

The whole interview thing is hilarious too, like holy bad perception, I mean unless you've seen a bunch of interviews from the guy, that nobody else has. Going off alone and doing a commercial WTF, like should he have brought the whole gang to do the commercial? Your really trying hard here aren't you?...... lol lots of pictures with him and other teammates in the community here in Van, but you knew that too right?........

 

[Rey]

No homer glasses for me I just watch the player, he has actually gotten into fights sticking up for teammates in the past, if you knew anything about him you'd know that. Plenty of the HOF captains that didn't fight, because you know, fighting doesn't make you a good leader. He's not terrible defensively, one of our only decent PKers actually, he's a 2 way elite 2C, everyone knows this except you. One of the most clutch players on our team, his 11 goals in 23 playoff games kinda speaks to that, but you knew that right?

The whole interview thing is hilarious too, like holy bad perception, I mean unless you've seen a bunch of interviews from the guy, that nobody else has. Going off alone and doing a commercial WTF, like should he have brought the whole gang to do the commercial? Your really trying hard here aren't you?...... lol lots of pictures with him and other teammates in the community here in Van, but you knew that too right?........

he’s only gotten in fights to protect himself. Decent on the pk? Worst pk in the league. How many of those goals were important ? How many of them were empty nets?

go look at the interviews. Those ask a player questions and lays commercials he’s in. Everyone is with a teammate except him.

The team gave up after the team trades gaudette. Who’s responsible for that ? The pearson signing ?

with a boat load of young players on team, I’m
Sure they were thrilled when Horvat said no fun on the road. Ever think why Schmidt left ?

no point of arguing with Canucks homer .

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

Ok fine, the '23 1st is conditional on Horvat including his teammates in any future Lays commercials.

 

[Cogburn]

he’s only gotten in fights to protect himself. Decent on the pk? Worst pk in the league. How many of those goals were important ? How many of them were empty nets?

go look at the interviews. Those ask a player questions and lays commercials he’s in. Everyone is with a teammate except him.

The team gave up after the team trades gaudette. Who’s responsible for that ? The pearson signing ?

with a boat load of young players on team, I’m
Sure they were thrilled when Horvat said no fun on the road. Ever think why Schmidt left ?

no point of arguing with Canucks homer .

Chemtrails are turning the frogs gay and vaccines are full of mind controlling chips and both Biden and Trump are lizard people and, and, and.

 

[HisNoodliness]

I'm pretty trash at gauging player value, but I thought I'd give this a stab.

Realistically I don't think this is a trade that would happen until the summer, in a scenario where Vancouver moves in a new direction and Horvat could agree to an extension in Detroit.

I'm open to discussing other assets from Detroit's end. You're welcome to ask for Larkin, Seider, Raymond, and Edvinsson, but if I'm honest I think that Yzerman is unlikely to move those pieces right now.

DET receives: Bo Horvat

VAN receives: DET '23 1st round pick, Filip Hronek (RHD), Joe Veleno (C)

Horvat is honestly just what we need, and while those are three very good pieces we're giving up, I think it's worth it to get another young top 6 center that we could really rely on. Thus if at the time of the trade we could talk to him and negotiate an extension, then I'd be down. However with him being a UFA at the end of next year and us in a late-stage rebuild (optimistically), we're just giving up too much without that kind of assurance.

 

[appiepi]

Good thing Stevie Y is GM and not HF. Hronek is top 4 defensemen putting up 0.5 ppg. Red Wings fans have given up way too early on this guy and are too desperate for a top 6 line center. Horvat is a 60 pt player. Chill out, let players develop, trust in yzerman.

 

[Henkka]

DET receives: Bo Horvat

VAN receives: DET '23 1st round pick, Filip Hronek (RHD), Joe Veleno (C)

Same deal but Rasmussen goes to VAN instead of Veleno.

Horvat is "prime Rasmussen".

 

[AlwaysSunnyInDetroit]

I'd do this deal on 1 condition (actually, 6 conditions)

1. We're able to trade some combination of Leddy/Fabbri/Suter/Namestnikov/Stecher/Greiss, for an additional 22 1st round pick

2. We're able to use our 2 1sts to pick one of Kemell/Slafkovsky/Yurov/Miroshnichenko and one of Nemec/Jiricek

3. We're able to sign Leddy or Lindholm in FA (or both)

4. Vancouver accepts Rasmussen instead of Veleno

5. Horvat agrees to an extension before the trade

6. The 23 1st is top 5 protected

In 2 years, this could be our team:

Bertuzzi - Larkin - Raymond
Vrana - Horvat - Kemell/Slaf/Yurov/Miro
Zadina - Veleno - Berggren
Smith - Stephens - Erne

Leddy/Lindholm - Seider
Edvinsson - Nemec/Jiricek
Johansson - Lindstrom

Nedeljkovic
Cossa