I mean could the Blues just cover it for him. "Hey we know your going back to college but we want to see you come in for camp, mesh with the boys, get to know the coaching staff ect. The Blues organization will pay for you stay." Or would that violate CBA rules? I really don't know.
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I mean could the Blues just cover it for him. "Hey we know your going back to college but we want to see you come in for camp, mesh with the boys, get to know the coaching staff ect. The Blues organization will pay for you stay." Or would that violate CBA rules? I really don't know.
Brockon
Cautiously optimistic realist when caffeinated.
It has nothing to do with the NHL CBA and everything to do with the NCAA league eligibility rules. The following, directly from the NCAA site.
" NCAA student-athletes are amateurs and cannot have played for a professional sports team prior to enrollment. In hockey, specifically, this means that anyone who signs a contract with or plays for a team in the Canadian Hockey League (OHL, QMJHL or WHL) forfeits their NCAA eligibility.
The NCAA Eligibility Center will certify each prospective student-athlete's amateur status prior to clearing them for competition at the Division I level.
What You Need to Do:
-Do not accept payment or gifts based upon your ability as a hockey player.
-Do not sign a contract or play a game (even an exhibition game) for a professional team, including those in the CHL.
-You may attend a camp with a professional team for up to 48 hours if they are covering expenses or longer if you cover all expenses.
-Junior, prep or high school teams may cover some or all of your costs to play for them, as long as they are actual and necessary expenses."
Bluesnatic27
Registered User
- Aug 5, 2011
- 4,750
- 3,322
Okay, I wrote about the defense yesterday, now onto the forwards!
Simon Robertsson:
Robertsson might have been the most frustrating player at camp for me. He had, by far, the most professional tool set out of all of the forwards in camp. He is deceptively strong in both physicality and on the puck. He seems on the shorter side but has a lot of mass in the lower half. He had great balance and utilized his edge work well. He's not a speedster but does have a strong first few strides and has average agility. His shot is a thing of beauty as the mechanics are fluid and the shot is hard. The only physical aspect of his game that was lacking was his handling of the puck as he would lose possession any time he had to make cuts or was hounded for pressure. Despite that, his one-on-one skill was in a class with Bolduc and Dvorsky. He will apply a press and move his way around a defending player efficiently. When Robertsson is in the slot, there are very few prospects that are more dangerous. However, and this is why he was frustrating, he tries to apply his one-on-one strength in ALL situations. It's the Logan Cooley problem of thinking he can move around 2+ defending players to find his scoring lanes. He needs to utilize his teammates more to find success because he is not MacKinnon no matter how hard he wants to be. In fact, his best plays in the scrimmages were from him passing instead of shooting. He has good vision and patience. He should be able to contribute in all facets of the game but tries to carry the world on his back. Like I said, he's frustrating because I see an NHL player that can contribute in the top-9 if he changes his game to use his one-on-one strengths more organically instead of forcing those plays. Classic tunnel-vision hockey that only works if the player has multiple elite skills. Besides his shot, Robertsson does not have that. Still, I saw plenty to like and have hopes he can be a 20-goal, 40 point contributor with proper guidance and a more humble game.
Prognosis: Top-9 NHL goal scorer or top line AHL scoring winger
Aleksanteri Kaskimaki:
From most frustrating, to the player I had the worst impression of from any of the Blues property. Robertsson's game was frustrating because he was trying to force his game into scenarios that didn't allow for such. But the strengths Robertsson has are at least good enough to find success. Kaskimaki doesn't have that. I said in a brief overview that watching Kaskimaki was like watching a highly skilled player in slow motion. He wishes to create these astounding plays with creativity and finesse. The issue are all his skills are far too slow to allow for those plays unless he was given A LOT of space. For example, he would attempt these beautiful spinning passes across ice to generate scoring opportunities. They did have some success and were cool to watch. The issue was how he needed to slow down tremendously to gain the necessary space to swing the puck around. This wasn't done from quick stop and starts but rather him physically slowing down, or just stopping, when approaching the slot. He can't handle the puck well enough at speed so these attempts are done more to show off than create unpredictable plays. While Robertsson wants to be MacKinnon, Kaskimaki wants to be Kovalev with none of what made Kovalev good. I might be too harsh on Kaskimaki. But trust me when I say that he needs to accept he can't play the way he wants with his average toolset. It doesn't help that he lacks the defensive motivation to make some of his antics tolerable. Kaskimaki has enough skill to be an NHL talent if he can start playing like Sobotka. He has good vision and a good hockey mind. But until he humbles his game, he's not making it.
Prognosis: Career Euro talent
Juraj Pekarcik:
I think this guy has been talked about a lot and for good reason. He will become a fan favorite if he can develop the way I hope he can. His frame made him seem like a man amongst boys. But his speed and edge work made him fly around the ice. His shot was firm and he utilized his body to generate a lot of torque on his stick. His puck movement was simple but he utilized his reach to keep the puck away from defending sticks. All-in-all, he was impressive. He was also incredibly clumsy and awkward. I don't recall him being bad in any particular area besides balance. But everything about his skillset was underdeveloped. He would lose pucks easily, he would fall over with no pressure, he would get caught stuck trying to corral pucks at any speed, he would put himself out of position to hound pucks, etc. All of his skills are there. But he's fresh out the slaughterhouse raw. So raw, in fact, that I couldn't get a read on his hockey IQ. He's a relentless player that will stick to opposing players like glue in order to snag the puck. But I couldn't get a good read on vision, positioning, tempo control, and creativity when he was damn near throwing himself every where on the ice. I think he could model his game after fellow Slovak, Honzek. I see a lot of similarities in frame and skill set. Honzek is just further along in development and has a better understanding of how to use his skills/talent. At the very top-end, I see a good middle-six forward that teams drool over. But even at the low end, I see a more skilled Toropchenko for the bottom-six. Definitely not as fast, but the same aggressive big-body that can be dynamite on the forecheck.
Prognosis: Middle-six power forward
Ivan Vorobyov:
The other talk of the town for the prospects camp was Vorobyov. I've seen a lot of takes on his impressive camp from others on this board and I can't disagree with most of what I read. The only two points I like to add are how he strikes me as a player that is much greater than the sum of his parts due to his offensive intelligence and his elite hand-eye coordination. He didn't have any particular physical tool that made him stand above the others at camp. I'd say his shot and passing strength were above average. But that would be about it. However, when the game starts, he is an offensive catalyst. He was up there with Dvorsky in terms of offensive danger he brought on the ice for team MacInnis. He would generate scoring opportunities at will by drawing attention from defending players or finding passing lanes through coverage. His firm puck movement surely helped. But Vorobyov has a special mind to make Peterson look like an offensive threat. In conjunction with his intelligence, Vorobyov had one skill that stood above all of his peers. He could swat a fly out of the air with a paper clip considering how superb his hand-eye is. The number of pucks he deflected or batted down mid air was eye opening. Definitley a translatable skill at higher levels, albeit a niche one. It's also downright strange too because the weakest aspect of his game, besides defensive engagement, his is handling of the puck. His hands looked like they were made of stone any time he tried receiving a pass. And, as others have pointed out, he likes to cheat in the defensive zone for breakouts. I hope that's because of the nature of 4-on-4/3-on-3 where space is in abundance. If not, then he will need a lot of work to become a contributing NHL player. From what I saw, he might become a Patric Hornqvist like player if he can fix his defensive issues and soften his hands a tad. I saw NHL talent and I am going to be keeping a closer eye on him from here on out.
Prognosis: Top-9 winger or top-6 AHL scorer
Tanner Dickinson:
I'll start this write up by saying that my expectations for Dickinson was different for all of the other prospects. I always thought he had NHL talent because his game at speed is top notch. He surveys the ice and makes every stride seem effortless. His East-West game is the most dangerous in camp as he can circle the wagons better than anyone there. He finds passing lanes and cuts in deep to the slot for shooting opportunities. He's not going to beat many with his shot as it lacks velocity from distance. But it's quick enough to beat goalies if he gets well within the slot. All-in-all, he showed the same talent I saw in him from his draft year. I was curious is if he had to change anything in his game after his long term injury. I didn't see any lingering side-effects to his mobility and puck handling. He didn't seem to have made any improvements since the injury. But I'll take the lack of regression as a positive sign. In that regard, he has met my expectations leaning into this camp. Though, I have no insights into if he can be an NHL contributor. He's pretty much a "top-6 or bust player" as I think his injuries prevent him from taking the bottom-6 unless paired with protection for him to play his game. Unlike Robertsson, who has sneaky strength, what you see of Dickinson is what you get. Probably the best skating Blues prospect that relies on his speed to avoid serious confrontations. The only test that matters will be if he can play at the professional level next year. Stay healthy for the year and I think he can be looking toward a potential top-9 spot. If not, then he joins the Perunovich bus. Talented can't handle the cutthroat game at the highest level.
Prognosis: Top-9, 40 point playmaking winger
Unfortunately, this weekend looks too busy to give all of my write-ups for the forwards. I'll try and add more throughout the weekend when I can. I have a bout 7 more to do. I'm leaving the 1st rounders for last (minus Dean as I don't have any notes on him).
Please ask any questions!
Simon Robertsson:
Robertsson might have been the most frustrating player at camp for me. He had, by far, the most professional tool set out of all of the forwards in camp. He is deceptively strong in both physicality and on the puck. He seems on the shorter side but has a lot of mass in the lower half. He had great balance and utilized his edge work well. He's not a speedster but does have a strong first few strides and has average agility. His shot is a thing of beauty as the mechanics are fluid and the shot is hard. The only physical aspect of his game that was lacking was his handling of the puck as he would lose possession any time he had to make cuts or was hounded for pressure. Despite that, his one-on-one skill was in a class with Bolduc and Dvorsky. He will apply a press and move his way around a defending player efficiently. When Robertsson is in the slot, there are very few prospects that are more dangerous. However, and this is why he was frustrating, he tries to apply his one-on-one strength in ALL situations. It's the Logan Cooley problem of thinking he can move around 2+ defending players to find his scoring lanes. He needs to utilize his teammates more to find success because he is not MacKinnon no matter how hard he wants to be. In fact, his best plays in the scrimmages were from him passing instead of shooting. He has good vision and patience. He should be able to contribute in all facets of the game but tries to carry the world on his back. Like I said, he's frustrating because I see an NHL player that can contribute in the top-9 if he changes his game to use his one-on-one strengths more organically instead of forcing those plays. Classic tunnel-vision hockey that only works if the player has multiple elite skills. Besides his shot, Robertsson does not have that. Still, I saw plenty to like and have hopes he can be a 20-goal, 40 point contributor with proper guidance and a more humble game.
Prognosis: Top-9 NHL goal scorer or top line AHL scoring winger
Aleksanteri Kaskimaki:
From most frustrating, to the player I had the worst impression of from any of the Blues property. Robertsson's game was frustrating because he was trying to force his game into scenarios that didn't allow for such. But the strengths Robertsson has are at least good enough to find success. Kaskimaki doesn't have that. I said in a brief overview that watching Kaskimaki was like watching a highly skilled player in slow motion. He wishes to create these astounding plays with creativity and finesse. The issue are all his skills are far too slow to allow for those plays unless he was given A LOT of space. For example, he would attempt these beautiful spinning passes across ice to generate scoring opportunities. They did have some success and were cool to watch. The issue was how he needed to slow down tremendously to gain the necessary space to swing the puck around. This wasn't done from quick stop and starts but rather him physically slowing down, or just stopping, when approaching the slot. He can't handle the puck well enough at speed so these attempts are done more to show off than create unpredictable plays. While Robertsson wants to be MacKinnon, Kaskimaki wants to be Kovalev with none of what made Kovalev good. I might be too harsh on Kaskimaki. But trust me when I say that he needs to accept he can't play the way he wants with his average toolset. It doesn't help that he lacks the defensive motivation to make some of his antics tolerable. Kaskimaki has enough skill to be an NHL talent if he can start playing like Sobotka. He has good vision and a good hockey mind. But until he humbles his game, he's not making it.
Prognosis: Career Euro talent
Juraj Pekarcik:
I think this guy has been talked about a lot and for good reason. He will become a fan favorite if he can develop the way I hope he can. His frame made him seem like a man amongst boys. But his speed and edge work made him fly around the ice. His shot was firm and he utilized his body to generate a lot of torque on his stick. His puck movement was simple but he utilized his reach to keep the puck away from defending sticks. All-in-all, he was impressive. He was also incredibly clumsy and awkward. I don't recall him being bad in any particular area besides balance. But everything about his skillset was underdeveloped. He would lose pucks easily, he would fall over with no pressure, he would get caught stuck trying to corral pucks at any speed, he would put himself out of position to hound pucks, etc. All of his skills are there. But he's fresh out the slaughterhouse raw. So raw, in fact, that I couldn't get a read on his hockey IQ. He's a relentless player that will stick to opposing players like glue in order to snag the puck. But I couldn't get a good read on vision, positioning, tempo control, and creativity when he was damn near throwing himself every where on the ice. I think he could model his game after fellow Slovak, Honzek. I see a lot of similarities in frame and skill set. Honzek is just further along in development and has a better understanding of how to use his skills/talent. At the very top-end, I see a good middle-six forward that teams drool over. But even at the low end, I see a more skilled Toropchenko for the bottom-six. Definitely not as fast, but the same aggressive big-body that can be dynamite on the forecheck.
Prognosis: Middle-six power forward
Ivan Vorobyov:
The other talk of the town for the prospects camp was Vorobyov. I've seen a lot of takes on his impressive camp from others on this board and I can't disagree with most of what I read. The only two points I like to add are how he strikes me as a player that is much greater than the sum of his parts due to his offensive intelligence and his elite hand-eye coordination. He didn't have any particular physical tool that made him stand above the others at camp. I'd say his shot and passing strength were above average. But that would be about it. However, when the game starts, he is an offensive catalyst. He was up there with Dvorsky in terms of offensive danger he brought on the ice for team MacInnis. He would generate scoring opportunities at will by drawing attention from defending players or finding passing lanes through coverage. His firm puck movement surely helped. But Vorobyov has a special mind to make Peterson look like an offensive threat. In conjunction with his intelligence, Vorobyov had one skill that stood above all of his peers. He could swat a fly out of the air with a paper clip considering how superb his hand-eye is. The number of pucks he deflected or batted down mid air was eye opening. Definitley a translatable skill at higher levels, albeit a niche one. It's also downright strange too because the weakest aspect of his game, besides defensive engagement, his is handling of the puck. His hands looked like they were made of stone any time he tried receiving a pass. And, as others have pointed out, he likes to cheat in the defensive zone for breakouts. I hope that's because of the nature of 4-on-4/3-on-3 where space is in abundance. If not, then he will need a lot of work to become a contributing NHL player. From what I saw, he might become a Patric Hornqvist like player if he can fix his defensive issues and soften his hands a tad. I saw NHL talent and I am going to be keeping a closer eye on him from here on out.
Prognosis: Top-9 winger or top-6 AHL scorer
Tanner Dickinson:
I'll start this write up by saying that my expectations for Dickinson was different for all of the other prospects. I always thought he had NHL talent because his game at speed is top notch. He surveys the ice and makes every stride seem effortless. His East-West game is the most dangerous in camp as he can circle the wagons better than anyone there. He finds passing lanes and cuts in deep to the slot for shooting opportunities. He's not going to beat many with his shot as it lacks velocity from distance. But it's quick enough to beat goalies if he gets well within the slot. All-in-all, he showed the same talent I saw in him from his draft year. I was curious is if he had to change anything in his game after his long term injury. I didn't see any lingering side-effects to his mobility and puck handling. He didn't seem to have made any improvements since the injury. But I'll take the lack of regression as a positive sign. In that regard, he has met my expectations leaning into this camp. Though, I have no insights into if he can be an NHL contributor. He's pretty much a "top-6 or bust player" as I think his injuries prevent him from taking the bottom-6 unless paired with protection for him to play his game. Unlike Robertsson, who has sneaky strength, what you see of Dickinson is what you get. Probably the best skating Blues prospect that relies on his speed to avoid serious confrontations. The only test that matters will be if he can play at the professional level next year. Stay healthy for the year and I think he can be looking toward a potential top-9 spot. If not, then he joins the Perunovich bus. Talented can't handle the cutthroat game at the highest level.
Prognosis: Top-9, 40 point playmaking winger
Unfortunately, this weekend looks too busy to give all of my write-ups for the forwards. I'll try and add more throughout the weekend when I can. I have a bout 7 more to do. I'm leaving the 1st rounders for last (minus Dean as I don't have any notes on him).
Please ask any questions!
Gotta say, it’s going to be fascinating to see where this draft ranks up with our best for this century. 05, 07, 08, 10, 14, and 16 could use some company.
Majorityof1
Registered User
Doubtful if he didn't make it last year. We have added more talent than we graduated. Perunovich, Tucker and Toropchenko are probably the only ones that graduated. I 'm not sure of the rules for who graduates though. Even if a few more graduate, we added Dean, Dvorsky, Lindstein, Stenburg, Pekarcik. Vorobyov had a great prospect camp and will join the list. That's 6 new names.
It has nothing to do with the NHL CBA and everything to do with the NCAA league eligibility rules. The following, directly from the NCAA site.
" NCAA student-athletes are amateurs and cannot have played for a professional sports team prior to enrollment. In hockey, specifically, this means that anyone who signs a contract with or plays for a team in the Canadian Hockey League (OHL, QMJHL or WHL) forfeits their NCAA eligibility.
The NCAA Eligibility Center will certify each prospective student-athlete's amateur status prior to clearing them for competition at the Division I level.
What You Need to Do:
-Do not accept payment or gifts based upon your ability as a hockey player.
-Do not sign a contract or play a game (even an exhibition game) for a professional team, including those in the CHL.
-You may attend a camp with a professional team for up to 48 hours if they are covering expenses or longer if you cover all expenses.
-Junior, prep or high school teams may cover some or all of your costs to play for them, as long as they are actual and necessary expenses."
How well do Hockey players do with NIL endorsements? I know the very best paid are pretty female athletes that are good on social media, and relatives of super famous pro/former-pro athletes. But will Snuggerud pull down any cash as one of the best players on one of the best teams in NCAA hockey?
I did find this funny article about how his linemate Cooley gets free Chipolte from his NIL deal. He originally got unlimited burritos, but now they limited it to 1 a day because he ate too many
NIL Reaches College Hockey ... With Burritos
TAMPA, Fla. When Bob Motzko said his team’s NIL benefit is free burritos as opposed to the millions of dollars football players earn, everyone thought he was joking...
Linkens Mastery
Conductor of the TankTown Express
Let that boy eat!Doubtful if he didn't make it last year. We have added more talent than we graduated. Perunovich, Tucker and Toropchenko are probably the only ones that graduated. I 'm not sure of the rules for who graduates though. Even if a few more graduate, we added Dean, Dvorsky, Lindstein, Stenburg, Pekarcik. Vorobyov had a great prospect camp and will join the list. That's 6 new names.
How well do Hockey players do with NIL endorsements? I know the very best paid are pretty female athletes that are good on social media, and relatives of super famous pro/former-pro athletes. But will Snuggerud pull down any cash as one of the best players on one of the best teams in NCAA hockey?
I did find this funny article about how his linemate Cooley gets free Chipolte from his NIL deal. He originally got unlimited burritos, but now they limited it to 1 a day because he ate too many
NIL Reaches College Hockey ... With Burritos
TAMPA, Fla. When Bob Motzko said his team’s NIL benefit is free burritos as opposed to the millions of dollars football players earn, everyone thought he was joking...www.collegehockeynews.com
bleedblue1223
Registered User
- Jan 21, 2011
- 52,822
- 16,240
My position is that assuming a similar format, we should keep ranking prospects until everyone who is likely to ever suit up for an NHL game has been ranked. Having said that, we are in the usual ranking polls window right now, so maybe there isn’t anyone willing to take on the job.Doubtful if he didn't make it last year. We have added more talent than we graduated. Perunovich, Tucker and Toropchenko are probably the only ones that graduated. I 'm not sure of the rules for who graduates though. Even if a few more graduate, we added Dean, Dvorsky, Lindstein, Stenburg, Pekarcik. Vorobyov had a great prospect camp and will join the list. That's 6 new names.
How well do Hockey players do with NIL endorsements? I know the very best paid are pretty female athletes that are good on social media, and relatives of super famous pro/former-pro athletes. But will Snuggerud pull down any cash as one of the best players on one of the best teams in NCAA hockey?
I did find this funny article about how his linemate Cooley gets free Chipolte from his NIL deal. He originally got unlimited burritos, but now they limited it to 1 a day because he ate too many
NIL Reaches College Hockey ... With Burritos
TAMPA, Fla. When Bob Motzko said his team’s NIL benefit is free burritos as opposed to the millions of dollars football players earn, everyone thought he was joking...
Having given it some thought, I volunteer to run the polls this year. I’ll get it going before the weekend is over.
LGB
Registered User
- Feb 4, 2019
- 2,207
- 2,273
LGB
Registered User
- Feb 4, 2019
- 2,207
- 2,273
Personally I'd like something that's more lenient on NHL games played and more restrictive on age. Neighbours specifically is a guy that I think ought to be considered a prospect. I think him playing so many NHL games last season was really a mistake by the Blues and he certainly has a whole lot more developmental runway than a lot of guys who will be considered prospects. I'd vote something like 50 GP in a season or less and U24, but the age thing I'm not overly concerned with.
kimzey59
Registered User
- Aug 16, 2003
- 5,900
- 2,230
In the past, we've always used the HF definitions.
For skaters it's 25 years old or 65 NHL games played.
IIRC it's 26 years old or 25 NHL games for goalies(can one of my fellow old guys please confirm, I can't find an active link anymore).
I have to say you hit the nail on the head on this grouping of guys. Your top 6 maybe 9 or bust guys are basically going to have to create scoring chances or they will be pretty pointless on your roster. I agree on kaskimaki and Robertsson as well. Their game will have to grow or morph to have a role and contribute, but the toolbox is pretty full. Lot to like in what they could do beyond do currently. Pekarcik I see a guy that will produce more or be more valuable in the playoffs or crunch time than the regular season. Like a shayne Corson once the rawness is refined. Great find.
ezcreepin
Registered User
- Dec 5, 2016
- 2,695
- 2,448
A comp for Pekarcik may be someone like Joel Ward? Fine regular season performance, clutch playoff performer?
bleedblue1223
Registered User
- Jan 21, 2011
- 52,822
- 16,240
Tim Taylor with quotes on prospects. Didn't include everyone, some like Snuggerud were pretty standard stuff that we already know, and some I didn't feel like including. Some had additional quotes, but I included what I thought was notable.
Bolduc:
Bolduc:
Pekarcik:
Buchinger:
Zherenko:
Vorobyov:
Dickinson:
Gaudet:
Peterson:
Robertson:
Stancl:
Bobby Orrtuzzo
Ya know
Man, I know there’s a good chance a majority of these guys either don’t really make it or succeed elsewhere, but reading stuff like this is always good to read.
bleedblue1223
Registered User
- Jan 21, 2011
- 52,822
- 16,240
Yeah, I still have low hopes for Peterson, but knowing that he's dealt with injuries for 18 months helps explain his numbers. Seeing confirmation that Pekaric does look like a steal is nice to read.
STL fan in MN
Registered User
- Aug 16, 2007
- 7,645
- 5,152
Who would this exclude?
Heim’s 25. Perunovich is 24.9 (turns 25 in mid August) so I guess is still technically a prospect today. McGing turns 25 in 4 days. Neighbours has played 52 games. Any other bubble guys I’m missing?
I’d say Neighbours is a prospect but the other 3 aren’t. 2 are technically under 25 as of today but will be 25 by the time we finish the polls and 25 when the season starts.
STL fan in MN
Registered User
- Aug 16, 2007
- 7,645
- 5,152
I’ll always remember the 65 games because of Toews but I don’t recall the goalie cutoffs. But that sounds right.
Toews played 64 games as a rookie for the Hawks. Missed a handful of games due to injury. Was named captain of the team. Finished 3rd in Calder voting (Kane won). HF still counted him as a prospect the next season.
CaliforniaBlues310
Registered User
I would include Neighbours, Perunovich, and McGing. Even though the last two are about to be 25, they were overaged when we drafted them, and have been in our organization just as long as Hofer, who turns 23 in 3 weeks.
execwrite1
Registered User
- Mar 30, 2018
- 1,502
- 1,451
Another undersized scoring D-man (signed by Springfield)
Joseph Duszak, 5-foot-9, 176-pound right-shot defenseman
Add him to the list (at least he's RHD)
Joseph Duszak, 5-foot-9, 176-pound right-shot defenseman
Add him to the list (at least he's RHD)
bleedblue1223
Registered User
- Jan 21, 2011
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kimzey59
Registered User
- Aug 16, 2003
- 5,900
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I wouldn't.
He signed with Springfield, not the Blues. He's not Blues property(if we run into injury issues, he's not an option to get called up).
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