Blow this team up already!

[Larcos_Unal]

Going back to the thread title, the entire roster has been turned over already. The only constant is the core and you can't change it cause of the NMCs.

They are doomed to run it back over and over again, at least until JT is up and Mitch potentially walks. The only real bullet they have is firing Keefe and if you want to get more drastic, axing Shanny now that Pelley is in.

Wonder if Dubas would give Shanny a job out there in PIT?

 

[GoonieFace]

What improvements have we seen this year?

Let's wait for the playoffs to be over, but so far we are worse in the regular season and 90% of this fanbase has written off the playoffs, so that'd mean we are worse in the playoffs...

Give him another season because he shuffled chairs, but he didn't make any improvements, he brought in a bunch of guys to punch people when we can't score.

Did they not score the 2nd most goals on the league?

 

[badi]

They just look weak out there
What else is there to say?

Just a badly built defense core and goalies
The rest of the team is fine

 

[Larcos_Unal]

Did they not score the 2nd most goals on the league?

They don't score in the playoffs, that's what really matters. I don't think anyone cares about regular season anymore

 

[notbias]

Did they not score the 2nd most goals on the league?

In the regular season... no one cares about that.

And they needed to score more because they got scored on so much.

41 more GA, 20 more GF.

Genuinely, curious how much of those 20 goals is just Matthews being healthy.

Regardless, I think we added more scoring depth at the cost of defensive play, but if it doesn't show up in the playoffs, who cares?

 

[Da Mash]

Why blow it up? Who are we going to get rid of? Mathews? Nope....Nylander? Nope? Tavares ? Nope ..he has one more year left .....Marner is the only player of the core. Reilly is ok...and his contract is ok...

Our drafts havent been bad....Knies and McMann are NHLers....Lilly is a solid bottom 4 D.

We keep on trying to fill holes ....add grit....etc....how has that worked out for us? Bert and Domi are solid additions but at the expense of defense. We added Edmundson and the Bear and they have been horrible defensively. Our PK was once a top 10 is now the worst of the playoff teams.

Do we blow it up because of that? How about a goalie stands on their head and wins us a game or two...? How about instead of trying to fit a player to Reilly as our top unit....How about we maybe use a different tadem as our top D unit? How many years have we spend trying to find a partner for him? Is it a coincidence that the same players play with a different partner dont ever look so bad ?

Their are some additions and subtractions that need to be done....but blow it up? Nope.

This may be Keefer last year........Personally who ever forced his assistants on him ....should be looked at ....even tho our PP ranking is good....we miss opportunities at the wrong time consistantly.....and our PK has just been horrid.

I still think the NHL is messed up.....has been for a long time. No other sport changes rules In playoffs. I keep on hearing the excuse ...."well thats the way it is" Imagine having the attitude like that? MLB wouldnt have any black players with that attitude.

NHL and the refs should be more accountable .....but they never are.

JMHO

 

[hoglund]

They don't score in the playoffs, that's what really matters. I don't think anyone cares about regular season anymore

you need to score in the regular season in order to qualify for the playoffs, many teams that are golfing now know that.

 

[Larcos_Unal]

you need to score in the regular season in order to qualify for the playoffs, many teams that are golfing now know that.

Goes without saying you need to get into the playoffs, we've been doing that with regularity since Matthews came into the league. Scoring goals is not a benchmark for success anymore, it should be winning playoff rounds and going on a deep run.

 

[hoglund]

Goes without saying you need to get into the playoffs, we've been doing that with regularity since Matthews came into the league. Scoring goals is not a benchmark for success anymore, it should be winning playoff rounds and going on a deep run.

hopefully that will happen soon and maybe this year. The Leafs lost the 1st game last year and went on to the 2nd round so it's not over after 1 game. Even if they lose tonight it's not over, but the 3rd game would have to be a win.

 

[ToneDog]

Through Crosby's first 49 playoff games he had:
27 goals and 63 points

Malkin's first 49 playoff games:
24 goals and 62 points

Mackinnon in his first 50 playoff games
28 goals and 69 points

Rantanen's first 43 games:
18 goals and 52 points

McDavid's first 49 games:
29 goals and 75 points

Drai's first 49 games:
31 goals and 77 points

Patrick Kane's first 49 playoff games:
20 goals and 52 points

Jonathan Toews first 53 playoff games:
17 goals and 48 points

Kucherov's first 45 playoff games:
22 goals and 43 points

Ovechkin through his first 51 playoff games:
30 goals and 59 points

Even lets go back to Yzerman who was a supposed playoff failure before Detroit put it together, his first 50 games:
22 goals and 54 points

Matthews through his first 51 playoff games he has:
22 goals and 44 points

Says it all when you're barely outgoaling Kane/Toews in a higher scoring era. The rest of the duds on this team have followed suit with their own blend of failures, but honestly if you don't have it in your first 50 games in your prime, why should anybody expect better as you get older?

Many are resting their hopes on the fact that it took OV/ Backstrom and Yzerman over a decade to win a Cup. I don't see it because our core are a bunch of p***yes.

 

[ToneDog]

hopefully that will happen soon and maybe this year. The Leafs lost the 1st game last year and went on to the 2nd round so it's not over after 1 game. Even if they lose tonight it's not over, but the 3rd game would have to be a win.

Fourth would be close to a must win. I can't see them coming back from 3-1 with our goaltending vs theirs.

 

[Larcos_Unal]

Many are resting their hopes on the fact that it took OV/ Backstrom and Yzerman over a decade to win a Cup. I don't see it because our core are a bunch of p***yes.

There are still many, many lessons to be learned

 

[GoonieFace]

They don't score in the playoffs, that's what really matters. I don't think anyone cares about regular season anymore

I get that, and I think Tre tried to address that. Guess we will find out if the likes of Domi/Bert can contribute

 

[horner]

Every credible person in hockey said you couldn't have that much money tired to 4 players Shanahan thought he was smarter.all of these are the same type skill but nothing else.
The proper way
Stud center we have Mathew's
Big gritty skilled wing example Tkachuk
2 top dman example Hanifin Josi
Top goaltender Markstrom

Signing JT was such a bad signing not as we can build a prope quality leader . It should have been a top dman or 2

This can't be fixed next yr
Team
They can start to fix the defense

The following year
Marner or Nylander have to go
JT contract will be finished .

In 2 year we can build a proper team

Fire Shanny and get a new coach

 

[Da Mash]

Goes without saying you need to get into the playoffs, we've been doing that with regularity since Matthews came into the league. Scoring goals is not a benchmark for success anymore, it should be winning playoff rounds and going on a deep run.

The benchmark is the Lord Stanley......nothing else

Winning a playoff round or two is just for us fans to have something to cheer about. Its not a accomplishment for the players. Lose in the first rd or the 3rd rd makes no difference...doesnt put players in the HOF....doesnt make the players any happier.

The standard for success is winning the cup. Everything else is hogwash and no one remembers how many playoff games you won....but they do remember how many cups you have won.

Only in Leaf land do we make idols out of players like Tucker....etc...because they won a playoff rd or two and they looked like a circus amimal out there that fits fans agenda of what a playoff player should look like.

 

[GoonieFace]

In the regular season... no one cares about that.

And they needed to score more because they got scored on so much.

41 more GA, 20 more GF.

Genuinely, curious how much of those 20 goals is just Matthews being healthy.

Regardless, I think we added more scoring depth at the cost of defensive play, but if it doesn't show up in the playoffs, who cares?

Usually in order to fix one problem, you end up creating another. If they bow out against Boston, the one constant has always been the core

 

[Larcos_Unal]

I get that, and I think Tre tried to address that. Guess we will find out if the likes of Domi/Bert can contribute

Therein lies the problem, we always have to rely on secondary guys to do the scoring when the onus should be the guys making 50% of the cap.

It'd be nice to get the rest of the roster to chip in here and there (Kampf did gm 1) but we're not going far if the core is out there for a shinny skate

 

[GoonieFace]

Therein lies the problem, we always have to rely on secondary guys to do the scoring when the onus should be the guys making 50% of the cap.

It'd be nice to get the rest of the roster to chip in here and there (Kampf did gm 1) but we're not going far if the core is out there for a shinny skate

Agreed, I was just responding to the other poster who said they can’t score goals. Ultimately it’s nice for other guys to chip in, but if the big money guys lay eggs, it won’t matter much

 

[57 Years No Cup]

No there wasn't lmfao. We traded unprotected firsts which became #1 C's and D's for division rivals for a chance to even sniff a playoff spot. The management refused any rebuild. You were there, you don't remember what was so significant about Shanny was he said the "rebuild' word for the first time?

Done with this convo. Have fun being a doomer

You're lying to yourself. If I would have said seven years ago that the Leafs would have zero Cups and had won 1 playoff round in the next 7 years you would have called me a "doomer".

Yet here we are, with reality smacking us square in the face...

 

[mjd1001]

The thread is just a bunch of venting(whining) after one game. Has anyone actually shown how to 'blow this team up' ?

I'm amazed at how many thought they would win game 1. Seemed like the expected result to me.

I agree its mostly venting.

As far as 'blowing it up', not only would it probably be uprecidented to do so, but it would be hard to do and maybe not that smart even if you think this 'core' is not going to win.

So what is 'blowing it up' really mean?

-Front office cleanout. No more Shanny. Head coach change. No assistants promoted, they are probably gone too. Maybe some/major scouting and development staff changes.

-Marner not resigned, shopped, and probably dealt for the best you can get.
-Tavares not even considered to be re-signed/extended, even at a lower rate

That's really about all you can do. I mean, you can say good-bye to Brodie, move Liljegren, bring in one or two more goalies, move on and not consider bringing back Bertuzzi and Domi...but those are fringe moves. This team IS Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Reilly, and Tavares. You have locked yourself into them on the roster for the most part, so 'blowing it up' is, as you said, mostly venting.

 

[NVious]

I agree its mostly venting.

As far as 'blowing it up', not only would it probably be uprecidented to do so, but it would be hard to do and maybe not that smart even if you think this 'core' is not going to win.

So what is 'blowing it up' really mean?

-Front office cleanout. No more Shanny. Head coach change. No assistants promoted, they are probably gone too. Maybe some/major scouting and development staff changes.

-Marner not resigned, shopped, and probably dealt for the best you can get.
-Tavares not even considered to be re-signed/extended, even at a lower rate

That's really about all you can do. I mean, you can say good-bye to Brodie, move Liljegren, bring in one or two more goalies, move on and not consider bringing back Bertuzzi and Domi...but those are fringe moves. This team IS Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Reilly, and Tavares. You have locked yourself into them on the roster for the most part, so 'blowing it up' is, as you said, mostly venting.

You could blow it up if you had balls.

Vegas literally traded their most beloved player who just won an award as the best at his position and won a cup after, the Bruins won a cup giving away Thornton for nothing.

It comes down to will, all 3 of them should've been on the market after all of their debacles the last few years, if they fail again this year there is no reason not to put them on the market and if you get a good offer go to the player and ask them to waive their no trade clause and simply tell them if they don't do it, you're gonna go public with it.

 

[sxvnert]

Adding 11m to the cap (JT removal) in the next few years will completely change the roster for the better. If JT were an overpaid Ryan O'Reilly clone then it wouldn't be an issue but hes just as soft as the other three 10+ mil stars. I hope Tre gets a few more years to fix the roster.

 

[Al14]

That team will suck pretty bad

Knies and Robertson are good 3rd liners probably next year. Not likely top 6 guys just yet.

Tavares had 65 pts this year despite playing mostly with Nylander (at his hottest) and Marner.

He is a 55-60 pt playee dependent on his wingers for offense.

A #1G costs 5-6M and I dont think there are any good ones as UFAs so ha e to trade for an older one whose proven who could be available maybe.

1RD ~5-7M (Roy or Pesce)
2RD ~3-5M (Tyler Myers, Tyson Barrie, Tanev)
3rd ~ 1-2M (lilijgren or similar)

One the low end if you add non difference makers (rotate brodie for another similar guy, same with lilijgren) you used ~14M of your 18.5M capspace and the team is worse and older.

That remaining 4.5M maybe look to get another 1 year LW but the team hasnt improved and it is older

Please don't mention Tyson Barrie ever again. Been there, done that, burnt the t-shirt !!!

 

[seventieslord]

You could blow it up if you had balls.

Vegas literally traded their most beloved player who just won an award as the best at his position and won a cup after, the Bruins won a cup giving away Thornton for nothing.

It comes down to will, all 3 of them should've been on the market after all of their debacles the last few years, if they fail again this year there is no reason not to put them on the market and if you get a good offer go to the player and ask them to waive their no trade clause and simply tell them if they don't do it, you're gonna go public with it.

Correct.

NMCs are nothing more than a "complete control over where you get traded to" clause in practice. Can anyone show me one example of a player whose team wanted to move him and he just said "nuh uh, not going anywhere" and they remained at an impasse for months? I can't.

There's always a way to move a player. Tavares with a year left might be the easiest. Rielly makes too much but he isn't old. Nylander is now heavily overpaid but he's a superstar. Marner's on an expiring deal. Matthews has committed to us long-term and should stay. But let's not pretend we can't blow the team up. Of course we can.

It's this defeatist "oh well, we're stuck with all these players" mentality in the fanbase that drives me crazy the most. How have these people not looked around the league and seen the players and the contracts that have been traded? We don't have to be stuck waiting for Tavares' contract to expire. We didn't last year either, as I've been trying to tell everyone. Finally I see more people are with me on that.

Get rid of the guy in any way possible. He's the #1 reason we cannot build a competitive playoff team.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

Adding 11m to the cap (JT removal) in the next few years will completely change the roster for the better. If JT were an overpaid Ryan O'Reilly clone then it wouldn't be an issue but hes just as soft as the other three 10+ mil stars. I hope Tre gets a few more years to fix the roster.

There will be no 11 million dollar savings. Tavares will be re-signed for 3 years @ around $5-6 million AAV. You can bet the condo on it.