Biggest problem with Gallant-led team: we struggle way too much to score 5v5

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Zibanejad has drawn 8 penalties and leads the team in penalties drawn.

There's that eye test again.

https://media.tenor.com/53mO4htkMIYAAAAM/i-dont-believe-you-lies.gif

 

[Machinehead]

The 2013-14 Rangers in the first 41 games of that season shot at 5.72%, 29th in the NHL. The last 41 games, they shot 7.52%, 12th in the NHL.

Even last year, the Rangers shot 8.58% which was 12th in the league. I don't think this team forgot how to finish at an above average rate overnight.

I've been pretty down on the team at times but there's reason to believe the goals will come eventually.

The only reason to be down on the team, and I think you'll agree with this, is particular players.

The struggles of certain players is becoming systemic which is super alarming, and they are a good team, but they would be a great team if certain guys stepped into bigger roles.

 

[Machinehead]

https://media.tenor.com/53mO4htkMIYAAAAM/i-dont-believe-you-lies.gif

Gauthier and Kakko absolutely pass the eye test here BTW

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

View attachment 610773

Gauthier and Kakko absolutely pass the eye test here BTW

2 out of 3 ain’t bad.

Wonder if Zibs penalties drawn were recent or earlier in the season when he was actually good, because I can’t think of any recently

 

[DanielBrassard]

The only reason to be down on the team, and I think you'll agree with this, is particular players.

The struggles of certain players is becoming systemic which is super alarming, and they are a good team, but they would be a great team if certain guys stepped into bigger roles.

Yeah I would agree 100 percent.

 

[Raspewtin]

2 out of 3 ain’t bad.

Wonder if Zibs penalties drawn were recent or earlier in the season when he was actually good, because I can’t think of any recently

Congrats you just walked head first into why the eye test is useless

 

[Machinehead]

2 out of 3 ain’t bad.

Wonder if Zibs penalties drawn were recent or earlier in the season when he was actually good, because I can’t think of any recently

Idk you're probably just not remembering them.

Don't take it personally. Our coaches watch all 82 games from the bench and I'm convinced half of them couldn't tell you what number everyone is wearing. Our memories lie to us.

 

[DanielBrassard]

Congrats you just walked head first into why the eye test is useless

Some people's eye tests are better than others though, that's another issue. Not everyone sees the same things and at the same level. Whose analysis do you trust?

Idk you're probably just not remembering them.

Don't take it personally. Our coaches watch all 82 games from the bench and I'm convinced half of them couldn't tell you what number everyone is wearing. Our memories lie to us.

The guy literally said the SJ game was the best they played since opening night which basically confirms this lol.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Congrats you just walked head first into why the eye test is useless

Maybe but you're also conflating two different things

The number of times someone infracted Zibanejad is concrete and is literally a fact.
The stats that purport the Rangers to be some great 5v5 who are just 'unlucky' are abstract and don't exist in reality.

Two totally different things

 

[Machinehead]

Maybe but you're also conflating two different things

The number of times someone infracted Zibanejad is concrete and is literally a fact.
The stats that purport the Rangers to be some great 5v5 who are just 'unlucky' are abstract and don't exist in reality.

Two totally different things

I mean, the number of shots the Rangers are attempting versus their opponents is concrete and literally a fact.

Their shooting percentage and that it's abnormally low is concrete and literally a fact.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

I mean, the number of shots the Rangers are attempting versus their opponents is concrete and literally a fact.

Their shooting percentage and that it's abnormally low is concrete and literally a fact.

They are, i was talking more about Expected Goals and the implications/conclusions that you are supposed to draw from the stats (Rangers are great, they are unlucky).

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

Our elite goal scoring 1C has scored even strength goals in 1 game this season.

He does not look like himself right now. He's received a lot of glorious chances or would be chances but he flubs it way too much

When it comes to Mika, he's a lot like Kreider in that they're two very introspective guys who I feel like start overthinking things big time when the puck isn't going in for them. Mika in particular, when he's confident and in a groove he looks like a top 5 player in the league. It's why they can be so streaky. With Mika it's even more frustrating because when he's on he's absolutely one of the best forwards in the entire league ang that's not even an exaggeration.

What we really need is for Mika to go on a streak where he scores a couple vintage goals at 5v5 so he starts feeling it. There's been so many plays lately where a "on" Mika would've scored but a snakebit Mika instead hesitates or flubs his shot or passes instead of shooting and so on. I feel like it's all mental with him. The good news is he's still generating plenty of chances and the underlying numbers are good, he really just needs to start "feeling" better about himself and his game by having a few go his way in a streak of games.

Another factor I feel like has the team feeling a little disjointed and not firing on all cylinders is the scheduling. It feels like we're either playing 6 games in 8 nights OR we're playing 2 games in 12 nights. The team is either exhausted from travel and B2B games or they're out of sync because they didn't play for 5 nights.

Very weird scheduling so far for the Rangers which while not an excuse is definitely a contributing factor in my mind for a team that has mostly looked pretty good every night but is frustrating in that it always seems like they're just a little off overall. You want to get in a groove and the best way to do that is to have a pretty consistent schedule instead of oscillating from dead tired to "why are we off so long between games" every other week.

 

[CLW]

I'd say 1 and 2 are the main reasons.

I argue 1. is down to coaching, which others have pointed at too. Hence talk of other teams having superior o-zone schemes/movement/positioning/puck movement.

2. shooting is a skill that can be honed. We look awful in general shooting the puck, again an observation made many times by various posters.

 

[CLW]

The only reason to be down on the team, and I think you'll agree with this, is particular players.

The struggles of certain players is becoming systemic which is super alarming, and they are a good team, but they would be a great team if certain guys stepped into bigger roles.

I'm not down on the team, even if some seem to think so. I think there is so more to get out of this bunch than we are getting, partly because players are not employed efficiently enough. And with "efficient" I don't mean what so called advanced stats talk about only.

 

[duhmetreE]

2 out of 3 ain’t bad.

Wonder if Zibs penalties drawn were recent or earlier in the season when he was actually good, because I can’t think of any recently

I think there were a lot of high sticks

 

[leetch99]

Shooting more is one way to score more goals......pounding the crease for rebounds is another.....but that also means paying a price and out working a defender or back checking forward and possibly a face wash or an ugly glove palm to the lips .


I don't see Panarin-Chytil-Lafrenier-Kakko-Krapsoft having much of that in their arsenal . Trocheck 100 % and Kreider a wee bit show the most gumption and Gauthier as well . Hopefully Othmann and Cuylee and eventually Lafrenier/Kravs/Kakko will change that shoot from the perimeter and skate fast back to the bench culture and eventually play the German Shepherd chasing down a new Bridgestone tire /rebounds style . One can hope.

It for sure would make us a completely different club to defend against then the one we currently ice .

 

[Shesterkybomb]

sounds like you're speaking from experience tbh

Well duh, i just told you how it reminded me of the guy that does that.

 

[Deleted member 23124]

I argue 1. is down to coaching, which others have pointed at too. Hence talk of other teams having superior o-zone schemes/movement/positioning/puck movement.

2. shooting is a skill that can be honed. We look awful in general shooting the puck, again an observation made many times by various posters.

Then we can agree to disagree about 1. I've said it before (as have others): all the coaching in the world won't help if you don't have the players willing to and/or able to execute in the dirty areas. Rangers are notoriously lacking in that department.

 

[egelband]

I'm not down on the team, even if some seem to think so. I think there is so more to get out of this bunch than we are getting, partly because players are not employed efficiently enough. And with "efficient" I don't mean what so called advanced stats talk about only.

Me too. I keep banging on about over passing and not creating enough havoc in front of the net. But I also think they’re just one step away - figuratively - from turning it around. They can break out any time. And I think they will.

 

[AlaBlueShirt]

Me too. I keep banging on about over passing and not creating enough havoc in front of the net. But I also think they’re just one step away - figuratively - from turning it around. They can break out any time. And I think they will.

They have done solid job compared to last season and I still think they are having hard time to get mentally prepared for games. After the incredible run last season, two game 7's another one of them being in OT on home ice, it is no surprise.

 

[CLW]

Then we can agree to disagree about 1. I've said it before (as have others): all the coaching in the world won't help if you don't have the players willing to and/or able to execute in the dirty areas. Rangers are notoriously lacking in that department.

Look at Dallas (Robertson line), Colorado, Devils etc. They attack the "dirty areas" too, but they do so with pace, they move the puck much faster as a unit and attack with speed. The Rangers play so slow and passive, Kakko and other forwards constantly go to the net but they end up standing still wrestling with D-men watching the puck, and the puck hardly ever gets there because all the bodies are in the way or the Ranger D don't get pucks on net or the goalie smothers the puck once it bounces through. Trochek has banged in a rebound or two but that's about it. Carpenter scored on a redirect too. The point is the Rangers are out of date. If they don't get the first goal their lack of creativity makes it a chore to score.

 

[SA16]

Look at Dallas (Robertson line), Colorado, Devils etc. They attack the "dirty areas" too, but they do so with pace, they move the puck much faster as a unit and attack with speed. The Rangers play so slow and passive, Kakko and other forwards constantly go to the net but they end up standing still wrestling with D-men watching the puck, and the puck hardly ever gets there because all the bodies are in the way or the Ranger D don't get pucks on net or the goalie smothers the puck once it bounces through. Trochek has banged in a rebound or two but that's about it. Carpenter scored on a redirect too. The point is the Rangers are out of date. If they don't get the first goal their lack of creativity makes it a chore to score.

Well Colorado is scoring even less than the rangers at 5v5 so their playing with pace and attacking the net doesn’t seem to be working

 

[Machinehead]

Well Colorado is scoring even less than the rangers at 5v5 so they’re playing with pace and attacking the net doesn’t seem to be working

Yeah but they've already won the Cup which invalidates this comparison somehow

 

[MrAlmost]

Don't throw the "eye-test" under the bus. Some of us actually watch the game, not just turn it on, get mad, yell and post on this forum.

Also, I never liked calling it the "eye-test". Sounds stupid. It is just watching the game, and sometimes, active watching.

If you don't know what active watching is, get your laptop and/or a notepad and make notes while watching the game. (Posting while upset on this forum is NOT making notes) If the game is recorded, bring up the advanced stats for the game as well. I don't do this often anymore, but it might benefit some to not just throw away watching the game or, on the other end of the bench, to just laugh at advanced stats as useless.

 

[Kravtsov420]

if we’re talking about variables…so these models take into consideration timing and speed? How fast do we execute? I think that negatively impacts shooting percentage. It’s not a static statistic. If you give the goalie time to react or square up he’s going to have a higher chance to save it. But the stat itself shows the shot and if it was saved correct? That’s a missing variable straight up.

Also do we have a passing percentage stat ? I never see that brought up because it seems like we would be awful at that and also the quantity of passes. Do they make multiple successful passes in a row?

Lastly, if we’re looking at this from the eye test, all they do is swing the puck on the board in a U shape in the offensive zone until it’s lost. There is no penetration of the house.

I don’t think the statisticians in this thread have anywhere close to enough variables for the numbers to tell an accurate story.

Based on the way we play, slow and also executing slowly, I don’t think the average will do some sort of Jesus correct because I don’t think it takes some variables into account.

Statistics are good. But they have flaws just like the eye test.

How can you trust the numbers when you don’t have all the variables. And to think you do and to not search for more is bias.