This is not true at all. A quick browse of seatgeek and I see tickets in every Canadian market except Toronto for $40 and under. Calgary and Ottawa are practically giving away tickets.
Bettman visiting Winnipeg to meet with corporate sponsors, host a fireside chat with fans amid declining season ticket sales
- Thread starter MMC
- Start date
I may have already posted this story on the board before (time is a flat circle...esp. on HFBoards), but I once saw Tony Schiavone (of all people to cite in a hockey thread) tell the story of a slow day in his sports radio career. The host randomly mentioned that he didn't think Michael Jordan was the greatest basketball player of all time. The phone lines lit up. After his shift ends, the board op asks him "you don't REALLY think Michael Jordan isn't the greatest basketball player of all time, do you?" The host responds "of course I don't, but we filled the hour, didn't we?"
Speaking of not true, I will await your reply with specific examples of all the individual games for last season in which the Jets drew 7500 people (half-empty arena).
AtlantaWhaler
Thrash/Preds/Sabres
- Jul 3, 2009
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Overall, this is good news for Jets ownership as they do have more invested in the area. Plus, more surrounding entertainment options are always great for gameday (though, the asset types picked are a bit strange).True North deal to revitalize downtown Winnipeg deal done!
Here is the link from Global News Winnipeg:
‘We can all take pride’: Province, True North strike deal for Portage Place overhaul - Winnipeg | Globalnews.ca
Premier Wab Kinew announced Friday that the province has authorized the sale of the mall to True North, and is committed to the project long-term.globalnews.ca
The Jets are secure for the very very long term. This agreement settles it. At least it should…
More meat on this bone from CBC News
That said, this is by no means securing anything for a "very very long term". Many owners start selling off pieces of the development over time. Here in Atlanta, Liberty Media started selling off pieces of The Battery within the first year or two despite huge success at the gates. Once the real estate proves successful, the price goes up and smart investors/owners typically cash in pretty quickly.
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varsaku
Registered User
Winning typically solves all issues. But with an ever expanding league, the odds of winning or even a deep playoff run will get smaller.
Yukon Joe
Registered User
If you're looking right now you're probably seeing pre-season tickets - which I agree. I literally had a pair given to me last week.
Regular season you can probably find tickets at below face value, but generally mid-week against an opponent with no real star attraction.
jetsmooseice
Up Yours Robison
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Yeah, honestly. "Half empty arena" what even is this shit.
I swear some people here think that if they keep this thread going, they can pry the Jets away from Winnipeg.
hui43210
Registered User
Here in Ottawa, you can get $35 tickets on Ticketmaster all year long in standing room. I can see that changing when the Sens move downtown, won't be as hard to get people to games then.
nhlfan79
Registered User
I don't think anyone's trying to pry anything from anywhere, as that's not how it works. But it's fair to question how long of a leash Thompson et al. will give them if the surrounding community--both fans and corporate--doesn't step up to support a perennial playoff team. I would think that nationalistic pride eventually runs out at some undefined point.
Golden_Jet
Registered User
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It’s possible, but Thompson is the richest owner in the league by far.
jetsmooseice
Up Yours Robison
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One problem with your premise, though: who says that the Jets aren't being supported?
nhlfan79
Registered User
Chipman, and famously so. Hence, the existence of this very thread. See post #5, way back at the beginning.
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jetsmooseice
Up Yours Robison
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His comment was about attendance specifically, not the overall level of support or enthusiasm. Winnipeg doesn't have to deal with the casual indifference that you see in some NHL markets
But regardless. He made his statement, and then attendance went up. Nothing more has been said. So what's the issue?
Are all corporate tickets sold this season and revenues way up?
It doesn't feel good to get this treatment does it? Even more fitting that an Atlanta fan is making you get defensive.
jetsmooseice
Up Yours Robison
- Feb 20, 2020
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Well, what else is a bitter Atlanta fan going to do besides be bitter and wish ill upon the city that took their team? They can keep using that coping mechanism it if it makes them feel better, I have no objection to that.
nhlfan79
Registered User
I'm not bitter at all, nor am I "coping" with anything. I don't know where you got that from in anything I said. In fact, I actually was supporting your point by disputing someone's comment that others seemingly were trying to "pry" the Jets away. Like I said originally, that's not at all happening.
I stand by my point, though, that there are legitimate questions being asked about the long-term viability of the market. That's just fact. How that shakes out is anyone's guess. Thomson very well may be personally willing to let it ride as things are now for the next 100 years, for all I know. But then, maybe he won't. That's not a slam, just a recognition of reality.
(edited for spelling)
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Yukon Joe
Registered User
OK, so I don't know Thomson (no "P") personally. He's a really private guy, pretty much never gives interviews. But here's why I think you're wrong.
1. I don't think nationalism drives him much. He spends most of his time in London, England. Hell his official title is Third Baron of Fleet (yup - he's titled nobility in the UK).
2. He's relatively "old money". He's not some tech bro who made his fortune recently - the family fortune goes back to his grandfather (unsurprisingly, the First Baron of Fleet). As such they have a much longer time view when it comes to investments.
3. The reason he became involved in the Jets in the first place is he owned the land where the CLC is now built. It was the former Eatons building in downtown Winnipeg. He became a partner in TNSE back when they owned the Moose and built the arena several years before the Jets came to town.
4. In fact a lot of Thomson's money (through his holding company, Osmington) is tied up in real estate. Through Osmington he's become a major landholder in downtown Winnipeg. The story about TNSE owning what is now Portage Place is just a part of that overall story.
5. So you can see how this goes. The Jets bring people to downtown Winnipeg - both directly for games, but also by driving more people generally to downtown encourages more businesses to set up there. More businesses and more people in downtown Winnipeg means more money for the landlord - Thomson/Osmington. And finally the multi-generational timeline, combined with the synergy or how the Jets help drive other aspects of the business of Thomson/Osmington means no short-term (or even medium term) downtown in Jets attendance is likely to drive Thomson to want to sell.
6. So fundamentally, Thomson is just a different kind of owner. This is not to say he's better - in some ways I'd love a, say, Steve Ballmer to own the Jets, who is passionate, attends tons of games, and willing to spend to win. But that's not Thomson. And heck I should stop saying Thomson - it's all owned through a family trust anyways, even though David Thomson controls it. It's just very much a longer-term time frame. And besides - his investment in the Jets has gone from $170 mil in 2011 to what - Forbes had them at $780 mil, but that's before sad-sack Arizona sold for $1.2 bil. His investment in Winnipeg has already paid off handsomely, before taking the real estate into account.
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Thomson and Chipman ain't giving you a penny or moving to Atlanta, Bettman. Shoo fly shoo!!
Ticket sales? The Jets don't need no stinkin' ticket sales. They go so much money the team could be ran as a write-off and still make the playoffs lol.
Ticket sales? The Jets don't need no stinkin' ticket sales. They go so much money the team could be ran as a write-off and still make the playoffs lol.
Takuto Maruki
Ideal and the real
Again, I feel like it should be noted the cognitive dissonance in that an NHL franchise is controlled by someone of Thomson's wealth - that could absolutely lap everyone else in the NHL barring MLSE, and lap a good chunk of the rest of the big 4 outside of corporate entities - in a city that, by others' own admission, wouldn't have seen another team if it wasn't a turn key operation when the NHL needed it.
Winnipeg, as a whole, is fine as long as Thomson owns the team. Much of the consternation comes from factors that he ultimately doesn't control in the classical sense, but is *absolutely* in the control of Chipman, and specifically his words going back to last year, and advertising as well, and in the entire fabric of Manitoba as a province and Winnipeg as a city.
Winnipeg, as a whole, is fine as long as Thomson owns the team. Much of the consternation comes from factors that he ultimately doesn't control in the classical sense, but is *absolutely* in the control of Chipman, and specifically his words going back to last year, and advertising as well, and in the entire fabric of Manitoba as a province and Winnipeg as a city.
Yukon Joe
Registered User
So on the one hand - if you look at the richest sports owners - there's Steve Ballmer, owner of the LA Clippers, there's Rob Walton (Wal-Mart) owner of the Denver Broncos, and then there's David Thomson - owner of the Winnipeg Jets. Third place. And that counts the EPL, La Liga, you name it.
Like - here's a list of the richest owners in pro sports - but apparently they don't even count the NHL, because Thomson doesn't even show up.
Richest sports team owners worldwide 2024 | Statista
Who is the richest sports team owner in the world? Top is Steve Ballmer, owner of the Los Angeles Clippers, with a net worth of over 120 billion U.S. dollars.
www.statista.com
So Thomson doesn't just "lap" everyone other than MLSE - he totally laps Ed Rogers (estimated net worth 11.5 billion) who is soon to be the owner of MLSE.
But like I said before - that doesn't make the Winnipeg Jets immune. If the Jets have nobody showing up for games, that means nobody shows up to downtown Winnipeg which means Thomson/Osmington isn't making money as a downtown landlord...
BOH posters just don't understand how rich David Thomson is. I mean hell - I don't understand how rich he is. I don't understand what having a British Title is like.
Maybe it makes sense for the world's 23rd richest person to sell the Winnipeg Jets. Who am I to judge people with that kind of wealth. But I remember Winnipeg Jets 1.0 owner Barry Shenkarow - who was a lawyer. He was no kind of multi-billionaire. He was just some guy in the right place to wind up owning the team.
AtlantaWhaler
Thrash/Preds/Sabres
- Jul 3, 2009
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I'll start by saying, as I've noted before, Winnipeg is going nowhere anytime soon. They're fine and their fans are great.
And yes, Thomson has more $$ than almost anyone.
Having said that, no matter how rich any investor/owner is, in most cases, they're not going to own any asset that consistently loses them money. Chipman wouldn't have pleaded with the business community in the first place if that wasn't the case.
Boonk
Registered User
- Oct 10, 2017
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The Jets havent lost money since returning from Atlanta. The team and its operations net worth increased from $170mil in 2011 to $780mil now. Pretty hard to increase any organizations value $600+ mil in under 15 years if youre losing money hand over fist. Doesnt seem like theyve been losing money in that case then
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AtlantaWhaler
Thrash/Preds/Sabres
- Jul 3, 2009
- 20,218
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Well, sure...the net worth of every team in sports has increased over the last 15 years. That doesn't mean anything. It's the revenue/profit that matters. The advertising and suites sold that matters. Again, based on Chipman pleading with the corporate community a little over a year ago says that they were likely losing money (at least on the corporate side). I'm sure it's temporary.The Jets havent lost money since returning from Atlanta. The team and its operations net worth increased from $170mil in 2011 to $780mil now. Pretty hard to increase any organizations value $600+ mil in under 15 years if youre losing money hand over fist. Doesnt seem like theyve been losing money in that case then huh
Boonk
Registered User
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The networth of the org correlates with those numbers directly. The idea that it doesnt is just delulu. Hard to keep increasing net worth and income of a sports team if theres no positive and profitable revenues from either corporate or domestic support bases coming in to increase it. Its why TNSE and their parent property company have invested hundreds of millions into downtown Winnipeg since relocation, and almost $2bil since 2004.
Neither revenue nor net worth have seen the Jets decline into the red since theyve been here in 2011. Even with the decline in gate revenue from ticket sales and corporate support, theres no evidence to support the Jets were and are losing money (outside of events such as a pandemic and lockout) to an extent that concerns relocation or folding in a decade or so like many detractors of ours on these boards want so badly lol. Neither Chipman, or Bettman have acknowledged or sounded the alarm on such issues.
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