Olympics: Bettman hints NHL won't play in 2018 and 2022

[habsrule4eva3089]

Is there anything that can be done by the public?

Canuckstani
Mehar
True Hockey Fan

You get your Canadian posters and start a protest of thousands!

Do the right thing and save the Olympics.

lol

 

[Canuckistani]

I can prove it with a syllogism.

As opposed to actual evidence?

I don't know why you're treating the 2014 Olympic tournament as though it were some abstract theoretical concept that requires syllogisms to work out.

It was a tournament watched by millions of people and the gold medal game is currently on youtube for you to review. Refing bias can be proven by watching the game and pointing out poor calls against Sweden and/or Canadian fouls that went unpunished.



And for the record, your syllogism is based on false premises.

"Olympic hockey teams win gold medals when the referees are biased in their favor."

If that were true, Canada would have lost the women's final in 2002. in reality, hockey teams usually win gold medals by being the better team: ie. playing the better team game, the better defence, the better offence, or by having the getter goalie if outplayed on other fronts.

"Patriotic Canadian citizens served as referees in all Olympic medal round games in which Canada participated."

You assume the refs are "Patriotic Canadian citizens" first as opposed to prefessionals first. Their performance in both Vancouver and Sochi demonstrates that they took their roll seriously and consistently called near-perfect games.

"Therefore, Canada won the Olympic Gold Medal in Sochi because of the bias of patriotic Canadian citizens who refereed their games."

You still haven't proven the bias of which you speak. The video of the final is above. Let me know what you can find.

Frankly, I would love for the World Cup to be organized by the KHL with KHL referees on Russian ice, just so Canada's best can eliminate the last excuse Russian fans have left for their failure to win at the top level.

 

[Frank the Tank]

As opposed to actual evidence?

I don't know why you're treating the 2014 Olympic tournament as though it were some abstract theoretical concept that requires syllogisms to work out.

It was a tournament watched by millions of people and the gold medal game is currently on youtube for you to review. Refing bias can be proven by watching the game and pointing out poor calls against Sweden and/or Canadian fouls that went unpunished.



And for the record, your syllogism is based on false premises.



If that were true, Canada would have lost the women's final in 2002. in reality, hockey teams usually win gold medals by being the better team: ie. playing the better team game, the better defence, the better offence, or by having the getter goalie if outplayed on other fronts.



You assume the refs are "Patriotic Canadian citizens" first as opposed to prefessionals first. Their performance in both Vancouver and Sochi demonstrates that they took their roll seriously and consistently called near-perfect games.



You still haven't proven the bias of which you speak. The video of the final is above. Let me know what you can find.

Frankly, I would love for the World Cup to be organized by the KHL with KHL referees on Russian ice, just so Canada's best can eliminate the last excuse Russian fans have left for their failure to win at the top level.

I see the Canada haters have strategically retreated to the biased ref excuses. Can't blame them because it is all they have left after the gold medal victory in Sochi eliminated every other excuse (e.g., can't win outside NA, can't win on "true" international ice, can't go undefeated, etc...). It just shows the extremes people with irrational hatred of Canada will cling to.

 

[Gaps]

My friends of the International Tournament sector.

I present to you the World Cup 2016.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-pu...015730909.html

There are enough NHL stars to populate six national teams: Canada, the U.S., Russia, Sweden, Finland and the Czech Republic. But it’s an eight-team tournament; do you bring in Switzerland? Germany? Slovakia? Latvia? None of them have the numbers to be total NHL rosters, without any Euro league or KHL players, and that’s the goal for this tournament: Have it controlled by the NHL and the NHLPA, and populated with its players. (Good luck with Russia, by the way.)

The solution? To have the other two teams in the tournament be all-star teams.

As Chris Johnston of Sportsnet reported on Monday, the NHL is considering a Ryder Cup-style European All-Star team that would be comprised of players from nations that aren’t represented in the Big Six. Anze Kopitar, Marian Hossa, Marian Gaborik, Zdeno Chara, Jaroslav Halak, Jonas Hiller, Nino Niederreitter and others would star on this squad.

I know most of us on this side of the forum are people who enjoy true Hockey, and all of might argue once in a while, but reading this, we just all spilt our drinks laughing the hardest laugh of the day.

You can find ridiculous ideas on this board on a regular basis, but this one takes the cake. Sadly it's coming from people with actual power this time. A 'World Cup' arranged in this format is a bad joke. If they've decided that only 6 worthy national teams can be formed, then play the tournament with 6 teams for God's sake and don't make it a circus that demeans the value of national team play!

 

[Erikfromfin]

Oh dear god. No KHL, euro leagues and some joke teams. Had to check its not april fools day but thats some major bad news. Excitement to the tournament just fell of the floor.

Just as reference which kind of blow this is to Finland last olympics team had 11 players from Europe & KHL.

 

[ulvvf]

As opposed to actual evidence?

I don't know why you're treating the 2014 Olympic tournament as though it were some abstract theoretical concept that requires syllogisms to work out.

It was a tournament watched by millions of people and the gold medal game is currently on youtube for you to review. Refing bias can be proven by watching the game and pointing out poor calls against Sweden and/or Canadian fouls that went unpunished.



And for the record, your syllogism is based on false premises.



If that were true, Canada would have lost the women's final in 2002. in reality, hockey teams usually win gold medals by being the better team: ie. playing the better team game, the better defence, the better offence, or by having the getter goalie if outplayed on other fronts.



You assume the refs are "Patriotic Canadian citizens" first as opposed to prefessionals first. Their performance in both Vancouver and Sochi demonstrates that they took their roll seriously and consistently called near-perfect games.



You still haven't proven the bias of which you speak. The video of the final is above. Let me know what you can find.

Frankly, I would love for the World Cup to be organized by the KHL with KHL referees on Russian ice, just so Canada's best can eliminate the last excuse Russian fans have left for their failure to win at the top level.

Well if I remember correctly you would have lost against finland if it wasn't for a wrong penalty, and in that case you would have faced russia i quarter instead of latvia, so you may never even have play the finals if it wasn't for the NHL refs.

Either way, I maybe will look at that final and give your example from the final as well. But it do not matter, in no serious sport that is not completely corrupt, they have refs from one of the countries that play in the game and not only that, they are also paid by one of the team. I dont have to point out specific calls, that alone is enough

Canada and USA usually wins the U17 tournament where they have their own refs, even though they have like 5 teams there. But they dont win the U20 as often where we have neutral refs, the same goes for the world championship. You dont see a connection? neutral refs and USA and Canada winning percent goes down dramatically.

 

[ulvvf]

I see the Canada haters have strategically retreated to the biased ref excuses. Can't blame them because it is all they have left after the gold medal victory in Sochi eliminated every other excuse (e.g., can't win outside NA, can't win on "true" international ice, can't go undefeated, etc...). It just shows the extremes people with irrational hatred of Canada will cling to.

Well dont you come up with your own excuses for not even be able to get to semi-final 5 years in a row in the world championship?

Plus this was my major issue even before the tournament. This is not a little issue, it is a big issue to not have neutral refs.

If you want more love, become better losers and most of all better winners, stop acting like canada and usa is everything in the world and that you dominating the sport as soon as you win a couple of games and tournaments.

I maybe be a bad loser, but Im fairly good winner. But Canada/USA is really bad winners. like I said, you become arrogant when you act like no one is close to be as good as canada. It is hard to fell love when you act like that.

If I would make a wish list, I would also ad that canada/usa should not have so much power internationaly, for instead they should not be the one that decide if players from NHL should be in the olympics. That should be IOC and IIHF decesion.

Either way, it should always be neutral refs. That is one of the keystone in every sport.

 

[HolikHoliday16]

I think the World Cup would be successful with or without participation from international leagues. As I would prefer their participation, there are enough international hockey players within North American leagues to ice an international tournament.

They can still ice an 8-10 team tournament. After the team Canada, Russia, US, Sweden, Czech, Finnish are picked, let countries/regions enter a second team into the tournament through a play-in. While this would probably end up with a U.S. or Canada "B" (made of NHL players) or kids team (juniors, young prospects, rookies?), it would be cool to watch the "B" Russian, Finnish, Swedish prospects that play in a USA Hockey or Hockey Canada league get some games in against NHL competiton. Heck let Europe or Czechoslovakia enter a team. But as a Isaid before, would be cooler with inter-league play.

I think something like this takes away the allstar element by the inclusion of non/low-end NHL players, allowing for those Miracle moments. This also may encourage U.S./Canada to split teams for a double-shot, or stack teams and place them into the play-in strategically.

 

[IAM]

I think the World Cup would be successful with or without participation from international leagues.

Maybe it could be possible but I don't know about successful. And can you give me a good reason for this to happen? Last Olympics we had 10 players from European leagues and we made to bronze. Funny, huh?

 

[HolikHoliday16]

That's better then the U.S. did (my home country).

But just like I watch the Devils even though they may not be the Blackhawks, I will watch USA/Finnish/OHL/U20/European players compete with Canada/Sweden because I think that would be good hockey. They could also allow NHL to enter a team or team world, made up of excess players looking to compete. Anything can happen, especially in tournament play.

 

[1Gold Standard]

My friends of the International Tournament sector.

I present to you the World Cup 2016.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-pu...015730909.html

There are enough NHL stars to populate six national teams: Canada, the U.S., Russia, Sweden, Finland and the Czech Republic. But it’s an eight-team tournament; do you bring in Switzerland? Germany? Slovakia? Latvia? None of them have the numbers to be total NHL rosters, without any Euro league or KHL players, and that’s the goal for this tournament: Have it controlled by the NHL and the NHLPA, and populated with its players. (Good luck with Russia, by the way.)

The solution? To have the other two teams in the tournament be all-star teams.

As Chris Johnston of Sportsnet reported on Monday, the NHL is considering a Ryder Cup-style European All-Star team that would be comprised of players from nations that aren’t represented in the Big Six. Anze Kopitar, Marian Hossa, Marian Gaborik, Zdeno Chara, Jaroslav Halak, Jonas Hiller, Nino Niederreitter and others would star on this squad.

I know most of us on this side of the forum are people who enjoy true Hockey, and all of might argue once in a while, but reading this, we just all spilt our drinks laughing the hardest laugh of the day.

Okay, so now we know that NHL executives like to sit around the boardroom table and smoke the ganja all day long, mon. too bad I missed that party. would have been a blast.

Seriously, the NHL by floating this asinine idea have done the anti-legalization crowd a solid.

 

[VMBM]

In answer to your questions: (1) Yes, the Russians probably would have won the 1984 and 1987 Canada Cups without biased homeboy officials, and (2) Yes, Russians know all about biased officiating and judging, which is why it shouldn't be permitted.

Even as a fan of USSR hockey I have to ask: what 1984 CC semi-final game have you been watching?

If you're not playing better than your opponent, you don't probably win.

 

[JJTT]

That World Cup idea of 2 extra teams is worst ever. Why would Europeans like Kopitar, Vanek and Josi would want to play for that kinda team? I doubt this happens.

 

[Snowsii]

what's the point having any National teams there, if there's two of these extra teams.. Just pick 8 captains and let them choose players.
Same ****** idea.

Not bringing Euro or KHL players, also makes this not "Best vs best" tournament as some European (Finland & Russia atleast) wouldnt get best possible roster for it.

Maybe this is good for NA viewers point, and that's excatly what NHL goes for. But how does this really grow hockey or even NHL's reputation in Europe? Many dissapointed fans in Europe for sure.. Slovakia and Switzerland should have included in this tournament.

 

[Jakk123]

****ing great idea. I would rather watch our national team, although getting kicked in the ass. This is going to be an exhibition. And I doubt we´ll see NHL at the Olympics. Thanks big time.

Anyway, this is also the result of our great hockey development here in Slovakia. Guess I will have to forget our hockey sooner or later. Well, I am going to root for the Euro teams and mainly Czechs.

 

[Gaps]

what's the point having any National teams there, if there's two of these extra teams.. Just pick 8 captains and let them choose players.
Same ****** idea.

Great idea Crosby, Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Koivu, Chara, Parise, Plekanec and Kopitar get to pick all their sauna buddies. It might actually hold more entertainment value than icing a stranger legion and North America's B team, which is what the NHL is planning on.

 

[jekoh]

Okay, so now we know that NHL executives like to sit around the boardroom table and smoke the ganja all day long, mon. too bad I missed that party. would have been a blast.

Seriously, the NHL by floating this asinine idea have done the anti-legalization crowd a solid.

To think there are people who firmly believe it makes no difference who the organizers are...

 

[86Habs]

Okay, so now we know that NHL executives like to sit around the boardroom table and smoke the ganja all day long, mon. too bad I missed that party. would have been a blast.

Seriously, the NHL by floating this asinine idea have done the anti-legalization crowd a solid.

You're right, everyone is right....this is a completely stupid idea. Invite the best 8 teams, including Slovakia and Switzerland, or 10 teams (Germany and Slovenia) and go from there. The 6 countries + 2 all-star teams would make it a joke.

My hope at this point is that this is a trial balloon being floated, and the overwhelmingly negative reaction to this announcement takes hold and the proceed with a more conventional format.

 

[Urbanskog]

You're right, everyone is right....this is a completely stupid idea. Invite the best 8 teams, including Slovakia and Switzerland, or 10 teams (Germany and Slovenia) and go from there. The 6 countries + 2 all-star teams would make it a joke.

My hope at this point is that this is a trial balloon being floated, and the overwhelmingly negative reaction to this announcement takes hold and the proceed with a more conventional format.

Slovenia is a top 10 country?

 

[1Gold Standard]

You're right, everyone is right....this is a completely stupid idea. Invite the best 8 teams, including Slovakia and Switzerland, or 10 teams (Germany and Slovenia) and go from there. The 6 countries + 2 all-star teams would make it a joke.

My hope at this point is that this is a trial balloon being floated, and the overwhelmingly negative reaction to this announcement takes hold and the proceed with a more conventional format.

It has been overwhelming negative but I did hear one talking head, sports writer, express his positive take on the idea. I was shocked that even one guy would have a positive reaction to that nonsense.

As much as I laugh at what the NHL is floating here, one has to take a serious look at the IIHF and other European federations and wonder, what the hell are they doing? Why are they even indulging the NHL on this. It's quite simple, Gary, either you commit to the next 2 Olympics or we are done here, we are not even discussing the World Cup until you agree to the Olympics. If you don't want the Olympics then take your World Cup, roll that up and smoke it.

 

[86Habs]

Slovenia is a top 10 country?

According to the IIHF rankings, no, they're not. Nor is Germany. Which is why the tournament field should be limited to the clear top 8 teams.

 

[Urbanskog]

As much as I laugh at what the NHL is floating here, one has to take a serious look at the IIHF and other European federations and wonder, what the hell are they doing? Why are they even indulging the NHL on this. It's quite simple, Gary, either you commit to the next 2 Olympics or we are done here, we are not even discussing the World Cup until you agree to the Olympics. If you don't want the Olympics then take your World Cup, roll that up and smoke it.

True, I doubt the IIHF would be stupid enough to be on board with the World Cup while receiving nothing in return.

Or at least I hope they aren't that stupid.

 

[Urbanskog]

According to the IIHF rankings, no, they're not. Nor is Germany. Which is why the tournament field should be limited to the clear top 8 teams.

Or you could have more teams with a proper qualification system.

 

[93LEAFS]

Some of the arguments here are crazy or taken to absolute extremes while ignoring other peoples arguments. The World Championship or whatever they call it will be entertaining, watched and will be the most prestigious international hockey tournament if the NHL players don't play in the Olympics again, but will probably never be as prestigious as an Olympics with NHL participation.

People saying the World/Canada cup mean nothing because it was just some exhibition in august, and players will take it easy. Pretty sure the Canada cup was born out of the Summit series (which was classified as an EXHIBITION) but it had more passion and hatred than arguably the greatest of rivalries in sports.

Finally while big names skipped out on some of these tournaments (such as Lemieux and Roenick in 96) not all of the best players go to the big international soccer tournaments. Pretty sure George Best and Ryan Giggs never played in a major tournament due to qualification. Arguably Englands best midfielder during the mid 2000's in Paul Scholes retired from the national team in 2004 and didn't play in 2006 WC, qualifiers for 2008 EC and the 2010 WC when he most likely would of been Englands starting CM. In the last WC John Terry (who i hate) but prolly on talent should of started for England didn't play due to him previously retiring from international duty.

 

[Canuckistani]

My hope at this point is that this is a trial balloon being floated, and the overwhelmingly negative reaction to this announcement takes hold and the proceed with a more conventional format.

I'm assuming that's what this is.

It was apparently discussed at a meeting of the NHL and IIHF and I can't see the latter being OK with some "all-star" team polluting what is supposed to be a national team event.

Negotiations have obviously hit a snag and the NHL is testing the waters to see if they can plausibly hold this thing without IIHF participation. Needless to say, they can't.

Only Canada, USA and Sweden could put together a "best" team without using talent from other leagues.