Barkov shutdown style slightly overrated?

[Hockey Know it all]

You think he can't stick handle like Datsyuk?? Just say you dont watch Barkov instead of pretending man. lol. Look at the highlights then looks at Datsyuk's. I watched both of them play extensively. Barkov is the superior player and just as good of a stick handler. There is a reason Trocheck switched to number 16.....

Woah woah woah, did you seriously say Barkov is the superior player over Datsyuk?

I really really hope you are kidding. I am not saying Datsyuk was five times the player Barkov is but truthfully, and honestly, Datsyuk is a better player no doubt about it. Like you, I watched Datsyuk play. of his 950+ games I probably seen at least 800/850 of them.

Obviously, I grew up a Wings Fan and started playing hockey at the age of five in 97 due to the wings cup run.

People can say what they want about the greats the Red Wings have, but Datsyuk, at least to me, truthfully is on another level not only what he could do as far as stickhandling, but his IQ in all 3 zones.

With that being said, I do love Barkov as a player and think he is reminiscent of Datsyuk, but he is definitely not as good as Datsyuk.

You're still not convincing anyone. Those are great highlights yes, datsyuk is on a complete other level. Stop the nonsense dude, barkov is a great player, but stop comparing his stick handling skills to the literal GOat. Jesus lol

Its just amazingly funny how I ask a general question and then you have people like "icemancat" taking it a step further and confirming the "overrated" part. lol

Exactly, I don’t understand how he said Barkov is superior over Datsyuk.

Icemancat says he watched Datsyuk a lot but he clearly did not if he’s making those bold claims

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Not saying this as a put down but just that I was shocked then to not even see him be a + player these playoffs offs

That's just because of his PDO of 0.975. He's rocking a 61% xG% at 5v5, he's been an absolute beast in all 3 zones, don't let +/- fool you.

 

[Stephen]

I don’t think Barkov’s stickhandling is that much like Datsyuk just because of body type, stick length and the unexpected use of finesse when you expect power, which is loosely connected to the original size difference between the two guys.

I don’t think he’s like Matthews because Barkov seems to have a lighter touch with the puck whereas Matthews seems to over handle in transition, and the mechanics and control looks different. Not like Kopitar either. His skillset is a little more straight forward and more power. He doesn’t look like Malkin. Closest I’d say stylistically before you all get carried away might be Mario Lemieux, the way he looks so relaxed making little plays with the puck.

 

[pantherbot]

+/- is such a dumb stat, especially for a small sample size. Take Barkov's last two games, he's a -3. But they need to be taken in context. One was a SHG because Tkachuk made a dumb pass, another was right as Barkov stepped on the ice after a line change, and the other was the 6-5 last gasp goal.

McDavid is a generational offensive dynamo, but Barkov is also a generational defensive shut-down guy who arguably could've had a third Selke already. McDavid will get his looks, but to think Barkov isn't going to impact his game in some way is wishful thinking.

 

[mkatcherin00]

I remember hearing how badly Tanev and his partner dominated 2 series and barely allowed a goal. Then McDavid tuned them up.

Interested to see how much Barkov can shut him down. He can't keep up with his speed. I can see McDavid drawing a lot of hooking calls.

 

[Ratsreign]

I remember hearing how badly Tanev and his partner dominated 2 series and barely allowed a goal. Then McDavid tuned them up.

Interested to see how much Barkov can shut him down. He can't keep up with his speed. I can see McDavid drawing a lot of hooking calls.

Wasn’t he busted up by the Oiler series? Even missed a game during it? I remember the announcers talking about him playing through something, I forget what was said, though. Maybe something with his foot?

 

[BB88]

Wasn’t he busted up by the Oiler series? Even missed a game during it? I remember the announcers talking about him playing through something, I forget what was said, though. Maybe something with his foot?

Blocked a shot and had a cast on

Again it’s fun seeing the cry from the Edmonton fans while they are laughing at the suggestion
Barkov could slow McDavid some

I remember hearing how badly Tanev and his partner dominated 2 series and barely allowed a goal. Then McDavid tuned them up.

Interested to see how much Barkov can shut him down. He can't keep up with his speed. I can see McDavid drawing a lot of hooking calls.

I’d say Barkov is not going to focus on scoring all too much

He’ll make sure he’ll be 1 step ahead of the play towards the Dzone and let his wingers be more aggressive offensively

 

[bombers15]

Blocked a shot and had a cast on

Again it’s fun seeing the cry from the Edmonton fans while they are laughing at the suggestion
Barkov could slow McDavid some

He wasn't hurt in Game 1 where he was a dash 2 and Connor had 3 points.

All we were told going into the Dallas series was that Tanev would neutralize McDavid and then it didn't happen. So I don't know, maybe McDavid is good enough to play through these elite defensive players? It's not that crazy a suggestion.

 

[Ratsreign]

 

[WayTooCold]

Barkov Russian blood. Full Russian!

 

[SavoieSeason]

Barkov isn't shutting down McDavid lol. He's your average Selke winner, but McDavid is a generational top 5 of all time.

 

[BB88]

He wasn't hurt in Game 1 where he was a dash 2 and Connor had 3 points.

All we were told going into the Dallas series was that Tanev would neutralize McDavid and then it didn't happen. So I don't know, maybe McDavid is good enough to play through these elite defensive players? It's not that crazy a suggestion.

Did I say he’d go scoreless?
& McDavid had 2 points on that game

Of course he’s going to score but it’s also ridiculous how Edmonton fans think the best match up C in the league is going to be totally clueless against McDavid

Nobody thinks Tanev is on the same planet as Barkov, they play different positions, completely different styles and skill levels

 

[bombers15]

Did I say he’d go scoreless?
& McDavid had 2 points on that game

Of course he’s going to score but it’s also ridiculous how Edmonton fans think the best match up C in the league is going to be totally clueless against McDavid

Nobody thinks Tanev is on the same planet as Barkov, they play different positions, completely different styles and skill levels

It's just funny that we hear the same thing every series. "Oh, but Danault!" "Oh, but Tanev!" And here we are again - but this time it'll definitely be different.

I don't know. Maybe McDavid is better at figuring out defenses than defenses are at figuring out him. It's a wild thought but it's possible.

 

[llwyd]

He simply does tons of right things on the ice that will never get into highlights and which might be missed even by experienced fans. I think NHL players votes are pretty meaningful here - he is hugely respected by his peers. But then again, McDavid is McDavid, even Barkov might not be able to stop him.

 

[Ratsreign]

He simply does tons of right things on the ice that will never get into highlights and which might be missed even by experienced fans. I think NHL players votes are pretty meaningful here - he is hugely respected by his peers. But then again, McDavid is McDavid, even Barkov might not be able to stop him.

He’s definitely a player you appreciate more if you are actually in the stands watching him play. He’s always (almost always, he’s not perfect) in the right place.

 

[CornKicker]

barkov is an incredibly smart player and is extremely effective at neutralizing other players, the only other player in the league that can do what he does in ryan oreilly...but barkov is better at it.

that being said containing mcdavid is a different animal. no one has yet and hes in his prime prime

 

[Marioesque]

Barkov Russian blood. Full Russian!

Clearly full Finn because he knows how to defend

 

[IceManCat]

Woah woah woah, did you seriously say Barkov is the superior player over Datsyuk?

I really really hope you are kidding. I am not saying Datsyuk was five times the player Barkov is but truthfully, and honestly, Datsyuk is a better player no doubt about it. Like you, I watched Datsyuk play. of his 950+ games I probably seen at least 800/850 of them.

Obviously, I grew up a Wings Fan and started playing hockey at the age of five in 97 due to the wings cup run.

People can say what they want about the greats the Red Wings have, but Datsyuk, at least to me, truthfully is on another level not only what he could do as far as stickhandling, but his IQ in all 3 zones.

With that being said, I do love Barkov as a player and think he is reminiscent of Datsyuk, but he is definitely not as good as Datsyuk.


Exactly, I don’t understand how he said Barkov is superior over Datsyuk.

Icemancat says he watched Datsyuk a lot but he clearly did not if he’s making those bold claims

When you say Datysuk is a better player what are you basing this off of? The kindness of your heart? Because there are ZERO metrics that indicate this. Let's begin with the facts.



Career Points/ Games played:

Barkov:

GP: 737
Points: 711


Datysuk:

GP: 953
Points: 918

(Nearly identical GP / Points ratio)


Career Takeaways:

Barkov:

614

Datysuk:

1,134


(Again trending at nearly the exact same clip based on games played Barkov is still just 28)


Individual Hardware:

Barkov:

2 Selke Awards

Datysuk:

3 Selke awards

(Yet again Barkov is trending at the same pace, in fact it's probable that he wins several more Selkes eclipsing Datysuk)



Career High Points / Individual Season:

Barkov:
2018-2019

98 Points in 82 games played.


Datysuk:
2007-2008

97 Points in 82 games played.



*****
It's also important to note that Daysuk played on FAR FAR FAR superior teams. In fact he was surrounded by several hall of famers the moment he took the ice as a rookie. A luxury Barkov did not have until his 6th season in the NHL. Had Barkov played with the talent Datysuk played with it is conceivable that his numbers would have been even higher. There is literally nothing other than homerism to suggest Datysuk was better.


*******
I didn't compare advanced metrics because they were not as elaborate during Datysuk's time as they are now. But in regards to Barkov he leads the way in most two-way advanced metrics. And is far and away better than his peers in that regard.

 

[Ratsreign]

Fwiw

 

[IceManCat]

What facts? Datsyuk has nearly Double the takeaways that barkov has, in 200 less games. Are we to expect barkov to just magically triple his takeaway average per season to then be on par with him. "Trending at the same pace" is no where near what I would say in that regard. Now just going back to stick handling, kane constantly got voting from the players as the best stick handler, and when daystuk was around the players voted him. I don't here the players talking about barkov right now. We get it barkov is a great player, no one is denying that, the point is I made this thread on the account that he is being OVERRATED, and it's clearly showing that when you make crazy comparisons.

Barkov:

614 / 737 = 0.83 takeaways per game


Datsyuk:

1134 / 953 = 1.18 takeaways per game



Datysuk with a slightly higher pace despite playing on far superior teams and coming in at an older age (21 vs 18). Barkov only being 18 and at one point the youngest player in the NHL. Don't you think Barkov coming into the NHL as a teenager lowers his overall averages? I guess variables don't matter to you?

 

[Cup or Bust]

Barkov isn't shutting down McDavid lol. He's your average Selke winner, but McDavid is a generational top 5 of all time.

No one player can shut him down, a 5 man unit will have to try and minimize McDavid and his lines offense in the series. They will also likely have to sacrifice offense to do that as well. If they take penalties against the Oilers they will be in big trouble. Both teams have areas of strength and it will be whichever team's game plan works the best that is going to win the Cup. The Oilers are going to need their defense to continue to be strong and get solid goaltending. The Panthers are going to have to try and minimize the Oilers top players and be able to create offense at the same time.

 

[IceManCat]

Moving Goalposts Goalposts GIF - Moving Goalposts Goalposts Changing Requirements - Discover & Share GIFs

Yeah.... it's clear you have zero ammo for this fight LOL

 

[Cats2TheCup]

Yeah.... it's clear you have zero ammo for this fight LOL

People are going to have to confront a lot of emotions while Barkov transitions from underrated to accurately rated.

 

[Scema12]

Yeah.... it's clear you have zero ammo for this fight LOL

Link me a single time that the NHLPA has voted barkov as best stick handler in the league. I'll be waiting

 

[IceManCat]

Link me a single time that the NHLPA has voted barkov as best stick handler in the league. I'll be waiting

Still trying to figure out what that has to do with factual information and on ice performance?