Barkov shutdown style slightly overrated?

[Mr Positive]

we're about to see just how good he is, toughest matchups coming up against McDavid and Draisaitl, speed and power

Yup. And that's it. We have too much time to kill, and the only way to know how this matchup will go will be for them to play each other

 

[Chaos2k7]

He's incredibly over rated. He's the perfect hipster pick, people pick him to make them look smart more than anything else. In reality, he is in the same tier as a few other elite shutdown centers like Matthews and Kopitar.

My issue is not in saying he is elite defensively, it's in how people exaggerate his abilities. "Shutting down" stars has a lot more to do with Bobrovsky being the better goalie in all of the series they have played

Bob has been very good, but his numbers were only better than Vasy, both Swayman and Shesterkin had better numbers than him.

Only a Leafs fan would believe its just a goaltender, that was the excuse two years ago in the second round, and you continue with it today.

 

[MessierII]

Barkov is properly rated. He’s unreal.

 

[Ratsreign]

Bob has been very good, but his numbers were only better than Vasy, both Swayman and Shesterkin had better numbers than him.

Only a Leafs fan would believe its just a goaltender, that was the excuse two years ago in the second round, and you continue with it today.

He still has a picture of Benny tacked to his dartboard.

 

[Satire]

Barkov is probably the best 2 way center in the game right now. Not sure what there is to overrate.

 

[TheNumber4]

It's not that Barkov is overrated. He's not, he's a great player. It's the whole notion that a great 2-way center or shutdown d-man can shutdown generational talent. Don't know how many players I've been told would do this to McDrai only to see them fail miserably. Go down the list of guys who were supposed to "shut down" McDrai and see how they all failed spectacularly.

Kopitar, Danault, Tanev, Heiskanen, Zadorov etc etc.

 

[Chaos2k7]

It's not that Barkov is overrated. He's not, he's a great player. It's the whole notion that a great 2-way center or shutdown d-man can shutdown generational talent. Don't know how many players I've been told would do this to McDrai only to see them fail miserably. Go down the list of guys who were supposed to "shut down" McDrai and see how they all failed spectacularly.

Kopitar, Danault, Tanev, Heiskanen, Zadorov etc etc.

Who is saying shut down though? Contain him a bit is not shutting him out, lol

McDavid will get points, we just cannot let him take over a game completely. The NZ will be the point of attack, need him going East West, instead of North South, still dangerous no doubt, but we have to limit the rush game.

 

[TheNumber4]

Who is saying shut down though? Contain him a bit is not shutting him out, lol

McDavid will get points, we just cannot let him take over a game completely. The NZ will be the point of attack, need him going East West, instead of North South, still dangerous no doubt, but we have to limit the rush game.

Okay sure, contain him a bit like every team tries. It really only takes a couple shifts or a PK gone wrong, for that plan to go in the shitter and then boom he's got himself a 2 pt game, enough to swing a game. Then if McD doesn't feel up to it that night, look out, here comes Drai.

Rush game hasn't really been his bread and butter this year. Especially not in the playoffs. McDavid is alot more than just rush offence these days.

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

Maybe you should be paying closer attention.

Skill wise they are very comparable.

I am in this thread arguing that Barkov is very good, saying OP is out to lunch.

But dude- you’re saying Barkov is equal to Datsyuk in stickhandling. That’s a really high bar, and Datsyuk 100% has a nostalgic glow about him. He stood out for his era in a way Barkov doesn’t, sorry, don’t really care to debate if they’re technically equal. You also put Barkov above Bergeron, which is just gonna lead to Boston hate and is another tall claim.

Just an awful approach, you’re gonna push more people into calling him overrated than you are gonna convince ‘em. You don’t have any objective metrics, just “trust me, watch better” which is not a strong argument.

 

[Dread Clawz]

He’s an incredible player. As an Oilers fan I’ll be very curious to see if he can handle the big guns.
Panthers fans, if he’s on McDavid who gets Draisaitls line?

Probably Lundell. Luostarinen -Lundell-Tarasenko has kinda become the checking line.

 

[Chaos2k7]

I am in this thread arguing that Barkov is very good, saying OP is out to lunch.

But dude- you’re saying Barkov is equal to Datsyuk in stickhandling. That’s a really high bar, and Datsyuk 100% has a nostalgic glow about him. He stood out for his era in a way Barkov doesn’t, sorry, don’t really care to debate if they’re technically equal. You also put Barkov above Bergeron, which is just gonna lead to Boston hate and is another tall claim.

Just an awful approach, you’re gonna push more people into calling him overrated than you are gonna convince ‘em. You don’t have any objective metrics, just “trust me, watch better” which is not a strong argument.

He has not accomplished as much as Bergeron, but he sure does have the chance, if he stays healthy.

He had absolutely terrific hands and puck skills, and not just for a big man, if you say Dats is better, that doesn't trouble me at all, he was a fantastic player too.

Barkov is still currently the best two way forward in the game currently. And overrated which is the OP's idea, is humorous.

 

[Tebowz]

McDrai will not get a single goal with Barkov on the ice this series. he's that good

 

[BurnabyJoe7]

I get he's a phenom of a player, but when I look at his stats this playoff as being this "shut down guy", I'm not seeing it. It's no shot at the guy, but I'm genuinely interested in hearing what makes him this phenom of a shutdown guy. His +- isn't that good and at 17 points you would hope it to be better? Once again, not a shot at the guy, just looking for input.

I'll take it that you've never actually watched him play.

I only get to see him in the two regular season games the oilers play florida + playoffs and he's a menace. Watched him in the first round and he is just a magical player to watch. Always in the right position and rarely makes mistakes. Big body that appears to be everywhere on the ice and is one of the smartest players I've seen play.

He's in a low key market so he'll never get the respect he deserves, but there's McDavid, Mack, Kuch, Makar and then another tier of players which he's apart of. Drai is a playoff monster and a very different player but think I would have to pull the trigger on a 1 for 1 trade regardless of contract situation.

Really looking forward to how he fares against McDavid. A lot of mediocre hockey fans are going to be surprised with how good Barkov is this series.

 

[TheNumber4]

McDrai will not get a single goal with Barkov on the ice this series. he's that good

Rags, Bs, and Bolts must all have players better than McDavid then, cause Super Shutdown Barkov definitely took some minuses against all those teams. Multiple games each series too.

 

[Mr Positive]

McDrai will not get a single goal with Barkov on the ice this series. he's that good

Well that's just silly. First off, there's the PP

If you just mean 5 on 5, that would be a first

 

[Cats2TheCup]

Watch this, will answer your question. It’s 18* minutes long, I’ll spare ya the minutes…he’s not.

Everybody knows what McDavid brings to the table. Id say this is required viewing for any Oiler fans that want to know what to expect from Barkov.

 

[Laus723]

Everybody knows what McDavid brings to the table. Id say this is required viewing for any Oiler fans that want to know what to expect from Barkov.

Agreed.

 

[syz]

Bob has been very good, but his numbers were only better than Vasy, both Swayman and Shesterkin had better numbers than him.

Only a Leafs fan would believe its just a goaltender, that was the excuse two years ago in the second round, and you continue with it today.

Disagree on Swayman. Bobrovsky's high danger save percentage was considerably higher than Swayman's in that series. Swayman didn't make the big saves, Bobrovsky did. If you swap goalies there the Panthers don't win.

 

[Macheteops]

I admit I am unfairly focusing on that guy who said Barkov > McDavid and Oilers fans are going to understand the legend of Barkov

That's magical thinking lol

I'm certain he is from Finland. My bad grouping them together but over the years they seem to have the biggest homers I've come across on these boards regarding nationality

Barkov is great and he could end up having a better series but he is couple levels below McDavid on any given day

 

[Scema12]

I'm certain he is from Finland. My bad grouping them together but over the years they seem to have the biggest homers I've come across on these boards regarding nationality

Barkov is great and he could end up having a better series but he is couple levels below McDavid on any given day

I mean barkov is obviously a great player, i'm just not buying into this phenom that people label him as. I'll be paying attention more obviously this playoffs and we will see how it is.

 

[Chaos2k7]

Disagree on Swayman. Bobrovsky's high danger save percentage was considerably higher than Swayman's in that series. Swayman didn't make the big saves, Bobrovsky did. If you swap goalies there the Panthers don't win.

Shooter quality was a big factor in those numbers. Once Marchand went out the focus was on Pasta, Coyle and a bag of chips were left over to take those shots.

Swayman was outstanding

 

[Gentle Man]

This is going to be like how elite defender and DPOY Gary Payton “slowed down” MJ to 28 points per game in the NBA finals that year and acted like it was an accomplishment for decades after lmao.

Congratulations on being totally wrong with this one

Gary Payton didn't become to primary defender on Jordan until game 4 when they were down 3-0.

George Karl didn't want GP to start the series against MJ as he wanted him to conserve energy for offense

MJ averaged 34 the first 3 games shooting 46%

He averaged 23 after the defensive change shooting 36%

Seems to me GP did a fantastic job slowing down the greatest player in the game. And anyone who watched that game saw he played him better than anyone on the Sonics.

MJ would never admit that GP could guard him, no surprise there as he wouldn't admit Jesus himself could slow him down.

But the stats and film are out there


Nice try though

 

[NotCommitted]

The beauty of Barkov is he can do it all, he's not a "shutdown specialist", he's an elite offensive talent who happens to also have the work ethic, attitude and mind for the game which has made it possible for him to utilize his skill set to become a great defensive center as well.

There have been games/series where he has been used almost exclusively as a shutdown guy, it all depends what the coach wants with matchups. He's just a great guy to build a team around because you can play him 20 minutes a night in whatever role you think helps the line-up the most.

But there's 5 skaters on ice for both teams, Barkov could have a flawless series against McDavid (if that is the matchup) and get completely lit up anyway. Or he could have a rather average series by his standards, while his linemates do a great job and Bob bails them out a few times and be hailed as the guy who shut down McDavid.

 

[Henkka]

I mean all i'm saying is when someones narrative is being a "shut down guy", which i'm not saying barkov isn't. Outside of the playoffs he is top 5, however inside the playoffs he is -2 carreer average and at a 0+- rn. Like I said I only watched the NYR series, so can't say anything else on the other series.

It's easier to have positive plusminus as 2nd line Center, playing against secondary guys, than being the MAIN shut-down guy who plays against the Top opposite Star Center all the time.

Or being a 3rd line guy who will face only Bottom6 material. Those guys will shine on deep teams (on plus-minus). If Barkov would be put to play against Bottom6, he would kill them all. But team would lose, because there's then somebody else losing the matchups even worse against all McDavids etc.

Watch the games. Not the stats.

 

[Shark Finn]

Yeah. Guy's a bum. 0+0=0 and -20 incoming in the Finals.