Rumor: AVS Proposals/Rumors/Free Agents & Roster Moves (related topics) ‎

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

both have nasty shots.

Laine's is nastier. I'd love to have Laine on this squad, would be a miracle if we got him though.

 

[CobraAcesS]

both have nasty shots.

Which one is mean as hell and is more of a sniper though? That's my preference.

Laine's is nastier. I'd love to have Laine on this squad, would be a miracle if we got him though.

Ahh the answer

 

[agentblack]

I don't know, I'd probably draft whichever Finnish kid is the one with the nasty shot. Even over Matthews just as a preference for need. Either that or attempt to bait OEL out of Az, so I could see the benefits lol.

Maybe in a dream scenario ARZ gets one of the other lottery picks and we trade down and pick up another pick like a 3rd or 4th.

But I cant see RoyKic passing up Matthews.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Maybe in a dream scenario ARZ gets one of the other lottery picks and we trade down and pick up another pick like a 3rd or 4th.

But I cant see RoyKic passing up Matthews.

Just like we couldn't pass up Mack for Barkov or Jones right?

God I hope MacK pulls his head out of his ass and finds a way to get back to being as dynamic as we've seen him be in his first year.

What is the saying about the definition of insanity? Something like trying to do the same thing over and over again expecting a different result?

I think I'd take one of those guys with another asset added over MacK right now personally. Yeah that may sound short sighted, but watching him repeat the same dumb **** in the offensive zone over and over again for so long had really gotten to me. I can't believe the coaches have said literally nothing to him at all, but it's also not that much of a brain game to figure out either if hes watching even remotely some amount of his own tape.

At least with Duchene he was doing his spin move to maintain possession down low and create. Mack is like a damn gun with two bullets in it right now.

If they picked Matthews, I'd be trading Duchene or Mack within the hour for defense if possible, and I'd probably use MacKinnon.

I can feel some stupidity in my own statements here, but it's the current state of how I feel about him. I'm so beyond tired of watching rookies blow the doors off in their first season and then watching offensive growth halted. MacK does not have Joe Sacco to blame for limiting his creativity either.

/rant I hope MacK is just having some Seguin years without the off-ice BS

 

[agentblack]

Yeah it becomes a BPA sitch. I know the two finns are really good but to pick them over Matthews would be silly. Just like it would have been in '13. Everyone would have picked Mack first.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Yeah it becomes a BPA sitch. I know the two finns are really good but to pick them over Matthews would be silly. Just like it would have been in '13. Everyone would have picked Mack first.

I guess Edmonton has been really the only team in this position, so it's not a great comparable.

However you absolutely either need to be able to stomach trading a current player on your roster, or you need to do everything possible to trade down a pick or two and get a player that fits your needs better. at least when you're a team trying to climb out of a rebuild IMO.

 

[Boulder Avalanche]

Looking back at the 2013 Draft I would have traded the first overall and something else to get an younger established defenseman.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Looking back at the 2013 Draft I would have traded the first overall and something else to get an younger established defenseman.

It looked like they were exploring that option, but I'd believe it if they never found anything that made sense.

In hind sight, I do believe they might have asked too much to move down a spot or two though. Although they would have been dumb as hell to pick Drouin over Jones, and I personally thought Tampa made a mistake there at the time.

I bet they are kicking themselves that Jones & Hedman as a pairing is not their future at this point.

That was probably one of the dumbest choices Stevie Y has made in his tenure as a GM. Even without considering Drouin's current issues.

 

[JoemAvs]

Looking back at the 2013 Draft I would have traded the first overall and something else to get an younger established defenseman.[/QUOTE
Only if it guarantees you a ROR (or atleast Stastny) extension.

Otherwise it would not have helped much. Jones alone would not make this team that much better (atleast for now. We will see if he can ever live up to Buttons "generational" hype).
And I am not even sure what kind of player that could have fetched. Josi or OEL? I am not sure if they would have gotten that.

The sad reality is that Mac will have to live up to his potential for atleast 1 playoff run.
Otherwise it is very difficult to envision this team ever being seriously in the hunt for a cup (barring a miracle Cinderella run like the Devils had a couple of years ago).

We need him or one of the other guys (Duchene, Landy, Rantanen) to improve.
You can't win a cup without any kind of superstar level performance.

Odds are that none of our Ds will ever perform like a Doughty, Lidstrom, Keith or Pronger. So we have to hope that one of our forwards will step up.

The level that our guys are playing at right now will not be good enough for the playoffs.
Better coaching or a better defense might fix that but before that happens, the odds of this group ever being legit cup contenders are rather low. But I think our guys have plenty of potential left in them. We just have to get it out of them and get them to perform like we all expected them to do by now a couple of years ago.

 

[McMetal]

Matthews has a pretty heavy shot himself, let's not forget. And more versatile. I wouldn't bat an eye before selecting him if he were available, even if only to deny him to some other team. He's the best guy in the draft, hands down.

 

[dahrougem2]

I have no idea how Alex Barkov would look if he was in Colorado for three years, and no doubt in my mind Jaromir Jagr has had a great influence on both him and Jonathan Huberdeau, but man I just love how that guy plays. Such a smart player, a complete player and at his age, that's insane.

There's still so much time to evaluate and hindsight is 20/20 but as of this moment, if I was to go back to 2013, I'd select Barkov 1st overall.

 

[InjuredChoker]

I have no idea how Alex Barkov would look if he was in Colorado for three years, and no doubt in my mind Jaromir Jagr has had a great influence on both him and Jonathan Huberdeau, but man I just love how that guy plays. Such a smart player, a complete player and at his age, that's insane.

There's still so much time to evaluate and hindsight is 20/20 but as of this moment, if I was to go back to 2013, I'd select Barkov 1st overall.

he's probably my favorite young player (favorite, not the best). love the way he plays.

no finnish homerism either.

 

[dahrougem2]

he's probably my favorite young player (favorite, not the best). love the way he plays.

no finnish homerism either.

He's 2nd for me behind Connor McDavid in terms of favourites, but man it's just astonishing to watch him play and see how well he thinks the game and how responsible he is while also being their primary offensive centre.

 

[CobraAcesS]

I have no idea how Alex Barkov would look if he was in Colorado for three years, and no doubt in my mind Jaromir Jagr has had a great influence on both him and Jonathan Huberdeau, but man I just love how that guy plays. Such a smart player, a complete player and at his age, that's insane.

There's still so much time to evaluate and hindsight is 20/20 but as of this moment, if I was to go back to 2013, I'd select Barkov 1st overall.

Yeah I'd take him over MacKinnon, Florida was pissed we won the lottery but I think the league expected us to draft the local kid Jones when they rigged that ****.

Winning that lottery may actually end up being not such a good thing IMO

 

[Sea Eagles]

Yeah I'd take him over MacKinnon, Florida was pissed we won the lottery but I think the league expected us to draft the local kid Jones when they rigged that ****.

Winning that lottery may actually end up being not such a good thing IMO

Oh I agree. As number 1 overall forwards drafted, Mackinnon is nowhere near Tavares status, but much better than Yakupov status imo. Still, he's not the greatest if we are being honest.

Good for 50-60 points. Same as guys like Josi, Okposo & Simmonds, and should be afforded a contract appropriately.

 

[Iceberg]

I wonder how much different this year would have gone had we kept the Landy-ROR-MacKinnon line. They were dominant last year, and i'm still baffled that Roy didn't even try the Landy-Soda-MacKinnon line that Sakic projected in the offseason. Not even a single shift during the entire year.

I think MacKinnon is getting too much crap, never mind that he has 4 less points than Duchene while playing tougher minutes and a more important position. Defensively he made great strides when you compare it to last season when he was playing center at the start of the season and looked completely lost.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Oh I agree. As number 1 overall forwards drafted, Mackinnon is nowhere near Tavares status, but much better than Yakupov status imo. Still, he's not the greatest if we are being honest.

Good for 50-60 points. Same as guys like Josi, Okposo & Simmonds, and should be afforded a contract appropriately.

The kid is 20 years old and we're already writing him off as being "Not the greatest" after a 65 point rookie season, and another season where he was on pace for 60 points before injury.



**** man. Sometimes I really wonder.

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

I wonder how much different this year would have gone had we kept the Landy-ROR-MacKinnon line. They were dominant last year, and i'm still baffled that Roy didn't even try the Landy-Soda-MacKinnon line that Sakic projected in the offseason. Not even a single shift during the entire year.

I think MacKinnon is getting too much crap, never mind that he has 4 less points than Duchene while playing tougher minutes and a more important position. Defensively he made great strides when you compare it to last season when he was playing center at the start of the season and looked completely lost.

You've said this before, I'd really like to see some statistical proof to back up your claims. I haven't seen anything to indicate MacKinnon is getting anymore difficult minutes than Duchene over the course of the season.

He's improved defensively mostly (imo) because he had nowhere to go but up, he was terrible the last couple seasons and is now acceptable. But he's still mostly back checking via speed rather than positioning. His stick work is ok, but he fails to get the puck out too often.

 

[Iceberg]

You've said this before, I'd really like to see some statistical proof to back up your claims. I haven't seen anything to indicate MacKinnon is getting anymore difficult minutes than Duchene over the course of the season.

He's improved defensively mostly (imo) because he had nowhere to go but up, he was terrible the last couple seasons and is now acceptable. But he's still mostly back checking via speed rather than positioning. His stick work is ok, but he fails to get the puck out too often.

I'm sure some of the stats guy can find those, and you have to keep in mind that for a good chunk of the season Duchene was on MacKinnon's wing, so they spent a o lot of time on the same line while MacKinnon had a bigger responsibility as a center.

And after Duchene moved back to center MacKinnon continued to get more difficult match ups, especially at home when Roy had the last change.

Of our top three centers, Soderberg is the one who normally faces the other teams top line.

Anybody suggesting MacKinnon should be traded before Duchene is completely out of his mind, and has very bad memory.

 

[cgf]

If ****ing Edmonton wins again...

I will laugh for days. If we don't win the lottery, I'm rooting for the Oilers to do so.

 

[cgf]

I have no idea how Alex Barkov would look if he was in Colorado for three years, and no doubt in my mind Jaromir Jagr has had a great influence on both him and Jonathan Huberdeau, but man I just love how that guy plays. Such a smart player, a complete player and at his age, that's insane.

There's still so much time to evaluate and hindsight is 20/20 but as of this moment, if I was to go back to 2013, I'd select Barkov 1st overall.

It's nice to see people warming up to him this year. Too many folks were all too ready to yell at anyone who wasn't *****ing about how disappointing the kid was. Which didn't bode well for me suggesting over the summer that his potential is still a Kopitar-Thornton hybrid; explaining that I wasn't too concerned with his point totals because his development was following the exact same trajectory as ROR's, only with a higher talent-level & potential payoff. Year 1, get used to the NHL & become good defensive forward; Year 2, continue getting used to being an NHLer & become an exceptional defensive forward; Year 3, look into that whole "offense" thing & start to become an exceptional two-way forward.

Oh I agree. As number 1 overall forwards drafted, Mackinnon is nowhere near Tavares status, but much better than Yakupov status imo. Still, he's not the greatest if we are being honest.

Good for 50-60 points. Same as guys like Josi, Okposo & Simmonds, and should be afforded a contract appropriately.

Mack was on pace for ~60pts when he got hurt...Tavares is sitting at 61 points with 4 games to play...just sayin.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I'm sure some of the stats guy can find those, and you have to keep in mind that for a good chunk of the season Duchene was on MacKinnon's wing, so they spent a o lot of time on the same line while MacKinnon had a bigger responsibility as a center.

And after Duchene moved back to center MacKinnon continued to get more difficult match ups, especially at home when Roy had the last change.

Of our top three centers, Soderberg is the one who normally faces the other teams top line.

Anybody suggesting MacKinnon should be traded before Duchene is completely out of his mind, and has very bad memory.

The bolded isn't true at all.


Yes, Duchene lined up on the draws at Wing. But went it came to the Defensive responsibilities, Duchene was the Center on that line. They switched roles in the Offensive and Defensive zones.


Dutchy was the forward doing the heavy lifting on that line in his own zone. And Mack was the center in the offensive zone while Dutchy was the scoring winger.



Duchene has been tasked with the tougher defensive responsibilities all season long compared to Mack.

 

[AvalancheFan19]

I wonder how much different this year would have gone had we kept the Landy-ROR-MacKinnon line. They were dominant last year, and i'm still baffled that Roy didn't even try the Landy-Soda-MacKinnon line that Sakic projected in the offseason. Not even a single shift during the entire year.

I think MacKinnon is getting too much crap, never mind that he has 4 less points than Duchene while playing tougher minutes and a more important position. Defensively he made great strides when you compare it to last season when he was playing center at the start of the season and looked completely lost.

Mackinnon definitely gets too much crap but he looks awful quite often when the other team has the puck. Offensively I'm not worried at all but I'd like to see him hustle harder defensively. His positioning in his own end has improved.

 

[Avs44]

The difference in QoC between MacKinnon and Duchene appears to be so minimal I am not sure why iceberg insists on bringing it up.

 

[ABasin]

The kid is 20 years old and we're already writing him off as being "Not the greatest" after a 65 point rookie season, and another season where he was on pace for 60 points before injury.

**** man. Sometimes I really wonder.

Yes, some of the rhetoric is being taken a bit too far.

However, I also feel that MacKinnon has not developed as expected. During his rookie season, I would have bet a lot that by his 3rd season, he'd be up there with the best offensive players in the league. He's certainly not bad (and trading him at this point is lunacy), but he's not an elite offensive player either. I believe a lot of Avs fans (including this one) felt that he had that kind of upside. He simply hasn't developed very much since his rookie season (yes, he's somewhat better defensively), and that's a real problem in the making if it doesn't change, IMO.

Yes, he's young. But that excuse (or reason, if you prefer) only has so much runway left.