Post-Game Talk: Avs bury the Jets 5-1

[papasan]

Maybe they need to hold a team only meeting, but that requires a player to step forward and lead.

Humm.
STILL WAITING

 

[hockeyarena]

What does it say about our supposed vaunted drafting and developing where we don't have a single viable call up that'd be upgrade in the bottom 6? It's 4 goals combined from our 3rd line the past 30 games. Beleive 32 games for our highest paid /tenured bottom 6er



This team needs an entire new third line. Our top 6 wasn't great tonight either. But they've carried the bill the last 20+ games.

Remember when we traded those 2 1st round picks? This is the result. No free agents will sign here, WE MUST keep our 1st rounders

 

[Jets 31]

I think it would be easy to catastrophize (my word) that loss.

Defending Champs destroy annd dismantle our team and fan base in our building in 10:00 minutes without their Norris D man or Captain. Two total team breakdowns lead to two fast goals then a tipped puck squeezes in. We were overwhelmed and outmatched from get go therefore what’s the use we’ll never beat the Lanch in the playoffs. Tear it all down this era is over.

I don’t look at it that way after a nights sleep. I think getting humiliated at home is what the team needed to break out of our malaise. Our top two lines have been in a bit of a funk and are due to rebound.

Playoffs are in two months. As we see every year that is a different season. We need to work our way through this stage and find a way into the playoffs.

I think we win the next game.

They better win, the Dude is going and he wants to dance.

 

[SensibleGuy]

We've got 23 games left to play. 12 wins gets us 95 points on the season. Maybe that gets us into the playoffs. 14 wins is what we need to be comfortable. But this didn't look like a 99 point team the first half of the season and it would be a pretty dissappointing number really. Does anyone think we're going to win 16 or 17 of the remainder? The idea that we might go 15 and 8 in the final 23 feels like a Covid fever dream to me right now. I'd say the safe bet is something between 11-13 wins and an extremely clenchy end to the season - probably making the post season but only just. And not for long.

But...we could go on a heater. That would be nice. Feel free to get that started at any time now Jets.

 

[tbcwpg]

Remember when we traded those 2 1st round picks? This is the result. No free agents will sign here, WE MUST keep our 1st rounders

It's not that simple. You can't draft a complete team. Plus I'd argue the Jets don't beat Nashville in 2018 without Stastny. The pick traded for Hayes came back in the Trouba trade and it was Heinola.

Generally, an individual 1st round pick, unless it's at the very top end of the draft, is not likely to move the needle significantly.

 

[Royale With Cheese]

Remember when we traded those 2 1st round picks? This is the result. No free agents will sign here, WE MUST keep our 1st rounders

Out of curiosity, who did those 1st round picks turn out to be? Are those the ones for Stastny and Hayes?

Edit - Rasmus Sandin and Ville Heinola were the actual picks with those spots. Funny that Heinola’s spot came back to us in the Trouba trade. Those guys don’t move the needle, but to be fair, neither did Kevin Hayes.

 

[tbcwpg]

Out of curiosity, who did those 1st round picks turn out to be? Are those the ones for Stastny and Hayes?

Rasmus Sandin and Ville Heinola.

 

[Jet]

The good news here is a stretch of .532 hockey has fans up in arms expecting more. That means that even though we're obviously struggling and playing below our potential, our definition of that is a much better place than previously.

I thought the team played the Avs pretty even after a catastrophic first where we gave the Avs best players several grade A chances off of bad reads and decisions, and were down 3 or just 4 shots.

I don't put that on Hellebuyck, those chances were very difficult and the Avs did not miss. Those chances against were very uncharacteristic of this Jets team, but something that had started to creep into their game lately.

I think that's happening because the team is lacking confidence and struggling to score, so they are playing outside the system and pushing too hard for offense, making low percentage, high risk plays.

If you simply look at boxscores is easy to start thinking that this team just isn't good, but there a lot more to winning and losing than that.

Yes, I'm with the majority here and believe that we need to upgrade our scoring depth, however, we did more with less earlier this year, and it was because the team was executing the systems the right way. Elite talent will help you win, but playing a team game is the most essential for success.

If Bowness can reinforce that playing the systems is how at turn this around, then we will be just fine. That will be the foundation of scoring again and winning lower scoring games when its more common and really counts - in the playoffs.

The regular season is just practice when all is said and done. You want to get your game sorted out for when the games really matter.

The 2006 Oilers backed in to the playoffs, stumbling to the finish line and barely making it. When the playoffs started, the team executed their systems, the goalie stood on his head, the best players led, and the depth players chipped in at key times. The only reason they didn't win the cup (7 game series with Carolina) is Roloson got hurt.

This team has a lot of the components that the 06 Oilers have. Some really nice top end scoring talent but unremarkable overall, a goalie who can stand on his head not as an outlier but as matter of course, a Norris worthy defenseman with a bunch of average guys in support, and a bottom 6 that didn't score much in the regular season but found some touch in the playoffs at key times.

The fact of the matter is, a lot has to go right for a team to win the cup. Hell, the Habs could have won the damned thing last year and that team was shit.

I doubt anyone has read this far but the tl;dr is: things aren't as bad as they seem. Every team has slumps, the good news is, our issue isn't talent related, is between the players ears - and they've shown they can play the system. Just start doing it again and who knows how far we can go.

Rasmus Sandin and Ville Heinola.

Can you imagine how dominant we'd be with those players?

 

[DRW204]

Remember when we traded those 2 1st round picks? This is the result. No free agents will sign here, WE MUST keep our 1st rounders

We got one of the 1sts back. And you need to be solid in the later rounds. No one's asking for all stars, although that'd be nice, but noone in the prospects better than what we're trotting out in the bottom 6?

 

[kanadalainen]

I think it would be easy to catastrophize (my word) that loss.

I think we win the next game.

I hope so.

 

[surixon]

The Jets got to where they are without free agents, they can do it again. Success in this league is cyclical and we might have already reached the peak with this core. At some point they need to consider that there's irreconcilable flaws that prevent this team from truly getting to the top. Player contracts are expiring and the need to have this discussion will approach quickly.



I'm not even sure what I would do. Are the Jets willing to part with picks and prospects for that chance to catch lightning with the contract uncertainty on the horizon? What if we don't capture lightning and fizzle out in the 1st round and Hellebuyck and Scheifele just refuse to negotiate until they're UFAs?

I'm also not at a sure what I'd do with this group either. It's why the GM makes the big bucks, to come up with a plan and execute it.

Hopefully the group gets some help next week and pulls out of this skid.

we only got the 20th pick and pionk for trouba so I wouldn't expect much more then that for each of the expiring deals, were left with zero top 2 centers and that doesn't leave me thinking it will be a quick turnaround

We could then turn around and do what St. Louis did and turn some of those futures into now assets.

 

[ps241]

The good news here is a stretch of .532 hockey has fans up in arms expecting more. That means that even though we're obviously struggling and playing below our potential, our definition of that is a much better place than previously.

I thought the team played the Avs pretty even after a catastrophic first where we gave the Avs best players several grade A chances off of bad reads and decisions, and were down 3 or just 4 shots.

I don't put that on Hellebuyck, those chances were very difficult and the Avs did not miss. Those chances against were very uncharacteristic of this Jets team, but something that had started to creep into their game lately.

I think that's happening because the team is lacking confidence and struggling to score, so they are playing outside the system and pushing too hard for offense, making low percentage, high risk plays.

If you simply look at boxscores is easy to start thinking that this team just isn't good, but there a lot more to winning and losing than that.

Yes, I'm with the majority here and believe that we need to upgrade our scoring depth, however, we did more with less earlier this year, and it was because the team was executing the systems the right way. Elite talent will help you win, but playing a team game is the most essential for success.

If Bowness can reinforce that playing the systems is how at turn this around, then we will be just fine. That will be the foundation of scoring again and winning lower scoring games when its more common and really counts - in the playoffs.

The regular season is just practice when all is said and done. You want to get your game sorted out for when the games really matter.

The 2006 Oilers backed in to the playoffs, stumbling to the finish line and barely making it. When the playoffs started, the team executed their systems, the goalie stood on his head, the best players led, and the depth players chipped in at key times. The only reason they didn't win the cup (7 game series with Carolina) is Roloson got hurt.

This team has a lot of the components that the 06 Oilers have. Some really nice top end scoring talent but unremarkable overall, a goalie who can stand on his head not as an outlier but as matter of course, a Norris worthy defenseman with a bunch of average guys in support, and a bottom 6 that didn't score much in the regular season but found some touch in the playoffs at key times.

The fact of the matter is, a lot has to go right for a team to win the cup. Hell, the Habs could have won the damned thing last year and that team was shit.

I doubt anyone has read this far but the tl;dr is: things aren't as bad as they seem. Every team has slumps, the good news is, our issue isn't talent related, is between the players ears - and they've shown they can play the system. Just start doing it again and who knows how far we can go.


Can you imagine how dominant we'd be with those players?

Yea I agree we are going through a patch when the goals are not coming for the top 6 or the bottom 6. Just have to try the system and the process and it will even back out. Like I have mentioned this morning sometimes a humiliating loss can be a good thing.

 

[SensibleGuy]

Yea I agree we are going through a patch when the goals are not coming for the top 6 or the bottom 6. Just have to try the system and the process and it will even back out. Like I have mentioned this morning sometimes a humiliating loss can be a good thing.

kinda feels like this is the third or fourth humiliating loss we've suffered in the past 15 games or so. Hopefully the humiliation has the desired effect soon.

hmmm...instead of a bag skate maybe Bones needs to initiate the Butt Nekkid skate. lol...

 

[SSCBLUEJET]

My Mom told me "if you don't have anything good to say..."
So I'm going to hang out in the newly created food thread for a couple days.
Food never disappoints.

 

[Channelcat]

It's not that simple. You can't draft a complete team. Plus I'd argue the Jets don't beat Nashville in 2018 without Stastny. The pick traded for Hayes came back in the Trouba trade and it was Heinola.

Generally, an individual 1st round pick, unless it's at the very top end of the draft, is not likely to move the needle significantly.

It does for some teams. Our drafting has been generally good except for where it matters most, the 1st round.

 

[tbcwpg]

It does for some teams. Our drafting has been generally good except for where it matters most, the 1st round.

I'm not sure I agree. The team drafted Scheifele, Morrissey, Ehlers, Connor, Trouba, Laine, all in the 1st round, not to mention Perfetti recently. Meanwhile a 2nd rounder hasn't stuck with the team in 12 years and they've had average success in the later rounds.

 

[surixon]

I'm not sure I agree. The team drafted Scheifele, Morrissey, Ehlers, Connor, Trouba, Laine, all in the 1st round, not to mention Perfetti recently. Meanwhile a 2nd rounder hasn't stuck with the team in 12 years and they've had average success in the later rounds.

Well it looks like Snerg is going to break that second round trend. But point taken.

 

[DRW204]

I'm not sure I agree. The team drafted Scheifele, Morrissey, Ehlers, Connor, Trouba, Laine, all in the 1st round, not to mention Perfetti recently. Meanwhile a 2nd rounder hasn't stuck with the team in 12 years and they've had average success in the later rounds.

Must be a typo.

Being good in the later rounds or late 1st while your team is a contender is essential imo.

 

[Zhamnov5GoalGame]

.. believing that the team that has won the most games in the Western Conference isn't a massive favorite to make the playoffs?

The team that won those games has been absent since early January. This isn't a 5 game slide.
We're losing a lot more than we are winning and can barely score 1 goal a game.
I didn't say we are going to miss the playoffs, I said we are no longer in a position to assume that we will make it.
Yes we are still in reach of the top spots but we are also pretty damn close to 9th place.
Making up ground in the NHL is damn hard, but as we can see losing ground is actually pretty easy.

There was a point where it looked impossible to miss but we've done so poorly that we have actually opened the door to be in the WC chase and that is unfortunate. I'm praying for a 7-3 type run to right the ship but until it happens we appear on the fast track down.

It was actually comical in the 3rd period last night watching the Jets get some chances that I knew weren't going to go in. We could have had a 100 shots and nothing to show for it. That wouldn't be because of some hot goalie either. The bottom 6 is devoid of any scoring talent what so ever and the top 6 is devoid of any confidence.

Let's hope we can beat the Islanders on Sunday.

Why are you referring to Perfetti as our 2nd line C?
I don't get it.

 

[Zhamnov5GoalGame]

Maybe they need to hold a team only meeting, but that requires a player to step forward and lead.

Humm.
STILL WAITING

They said they had a players only meeting before that game.
I guess it didn't work.

 

[Slimy Sculpin]

The team that won those games has been absent since early January. This isn't a 5 game slide.
We're losing a lot more than we are winning and can barely score 1 goal a game.
I didn't say we are going to miss the playoffs, I said we are no longer in a position to assume that we will make it.
Yes we are still in reach of the top spots but we are also pretty damn close to 9th place.
Making up ground in the NHL is damn hard, but as we can see losing ground is actually pretty easy.

There was a point where it looked impossible to miss but we've done so poorly that we have actually opened the door to be in the WC chase and that is unfortunate. I'm praying for a 7-3 type run to right the ship but until it happens we appear on the fast track down.

It was actually comical in the 3rd period last night watching the Jets get some chances that I knew weren't going to go in. We could have had a 100 shots and nothing to show for it. That wouldn't be because of some hot goalie either. The bottom 6 is devoid of any scoring talent what so ever and the top 6 is devoid of any confidence.

Let's hope we can beat the Islanders on Sunday.

Why are you referring to Perfetti as our 2nd line C?
I don't get it.

Like the Bombers, who I have followed and cheered for, almost religiously since 1957, I have followed the Jets since the WHA days. I don't "live or die" by both teams' fortunes but I do have corresponding "ups and downs" on game days. Typical (hardcore?) fan stuff, I think.

I think what you say (what I've bolded) is true, especially this year in the west. The oddsmakers (e.g., Money Puck) had us at >97% at making the playoffs very recently but after last night's game have us at 86.5%, still great odds but trending in the wrong direction. The next handful of games (lots of home games) and TDL activity by Chevy will be very interesting. I know that I'll be at the edge of my seat.

Go Jets Go!

 

[SensibleGuy]

The team that won those games has been absent since early January. This isn't a 5 game slide.
We're losing a lot more than we are winning and can barely score 1 goal a game.
I didn't say we are going to miss the playoffs, I said we are no longer in a position to assume that we will make it.
Yes we are still in reach of the top spots but we are also pretty damn close to 9th place.
Making up ground in the NHL is damn hard, but as we can see losing ground is actually pretty easy.

There was a point where it looked impossible to miss but we've done so poorly that we have actually opened the door to be in the WC chase and that is unfortunate. I'm praying for a 7-3 type run to right the ship but until it happens we appear on the fast track down.

It was actually comical in the 3rd period last night watching the Jets get some chances that I knew weren't going to go in. We could have had a 100 shots and nothing to show for it. That wouldn't be because of some hot goalie either. The bottom 6 is devoid of any scoring talent what so ever and the top 6 is devoid of any confidence.

Let's hope we can beat the Islanders on Sunday.

Why are you referring to Perfetti as our 2nd line C?
I don't get it.

Yeah. I remember about four weeks back I commented in a post-game thread how nice it was to be in a position where post-season action was "guaranteed." At that time, playing out the string at one game over .500 would have given us a 100pt season iirc and it seemed like we'd have no problem doing that. Remember when the All Star week was supposed to be the break the team needed to "get back on track?" Now here we are talking about what we need to do just to stay in the WC race - and it's not a given we'll do it! Yeesh...

 

[Hobble]

I don’t think there is a single offensive player right now who is playing confidently. When they skate in on a 2 on 1, it’s hard to even get excited lately.

 

[gojetsgo]

so I went over and looked at our depth scoring from the beginning of the season to now,
first 30 games we went 20-9-1 and got 27 goals from the bottom six so close to a goal per game
next 15 games we went 9-6 with 13 goals so again close to a goal per game
then final 14 games we had a record of 6-8 with 3 goals scored and all 3 came in the same game

 

[Howard Chuck]

Where do we get ourselves a Mackinnon..

You mean a guy who works his ass off night in and night out without coasting? Some of our guys used to be that guy, but something had happened to make them think they don’t need to work hard.