Post-Game Talk: Avs bury the Jets 5-1

[Royale With Cheese]

It would be a major rebuild at that point.

In hindsight, Mark was the perfect first Jets pick - a solid 1C. Those are real hard to find and it might be years before we get another like that. But he’s also not likely worth what he’s going to want dollar and term wise.

 

[blueandgoldguy]

Hellebuyck is great. Probably a jersey going into the rafters. But this mentality of "what will he think" about any move the team makes is a losers mentality. If the team isn't good enough now there needs to be changes. The core has been together for a long time and a guy like Schiefele is leaving his prime.

If Hellebuyck wants to leave you turn him into assets like the rest of the guys who want to leave or are losing their value in terms of contributing to wins/their price tag.

OK, be prepared for a very long rebuild if all 3 leave/traded. Likely 5 years minimum of .500 or worse teams.

 

[gojetsgo]

OK, be prepared for a very long rebuild if all 3 leave/traded. Likely 5 years minimum of .500 or worse teams.

way longer then that when you can't even attract free agents while you are winning

 

[blueandgoldguy]

yeah, those great 10 year rebuilds in buffalo edmonton and arizona should give fans hope!

Well it comes down to management and those teams all had terrible management in spades hence the long rebuilds.

 

[DRW204]

For those saying rebuild.... Be prepared of icing a roster worse than the Atlanta Jets. With Scheifele, Wheeler, possibly Ehlers, pld and Helle gone.

 

[gojetsgo]

Well it comes down to management and those teams all had terrible management in spades hence the long rebuilds.

that's some of it, but it's harder rebuilding in a small market then it is in other places, even those 3 are more likely to attract more free agents then we would ever be

 

[surixon]

How do you move on from Scheifele while simultaneously telling Hellebuyck that the team is a contender and convincing him to stay? Retooling seems like a crapshoot at the best of times with more teams becoming consistently mediocre after moving on from key players rather than actually finding improvement as a result.

This is kind of where I struggle to see a future with this core if they don't go out and get a big fish rental. And that's all kinds of troubling because mortgaging the future for a core that could be dismantled in very short order is kind of terrifying.



Sometimes it feels like Lowry is content to just break even, that he's not even trying to score even when the puck is in the offensive zone.

They are in the proverbial "your damned if you do", "damned if you don't " situation.

You are essentially hoping the team catches lightning in a bottle in the playoffs at this point. Do you go out and mortgage the future for that or do you transition most of the core ala what the Blues do.

I'm not sure trading Dubois and bringing back Mark and Helle will lead to much more then a bubble team the next few years unless we get some prospects really step up in a big way. So does it make sense sticking with a group that's been here a decade now.

Chevy has some real tough questions to answer.

 

[None]

yeah, those great 10 year rebuilds in buffalo edmonton and arizona should give fans hope!

I mean there's also teams like Leafs, Hurricanes, Devils, Rangers, and Avalanche who've bottomed out in the same timeframe as the three you mentioned and are currently some of the top teams in the league. I think Arizona is a special case too, I don't think anyone would say they've even tried to build a competitive team.

 

[BigZ65]

OK, be prepared for a very long rebuild if all 3 leave/traded. Likely 5 years minimum of .500 or worse teams.

What do we do if he tears his ACL or turns 40? Fold the franchise?

There are a lot of good hockey players around. We were only below .500 once before Hellebucyk became our starter. And we weren't exactly known for our depth of scorers.

 

[snowkiddin]

Bowness was short and to the point in his post game presser.

We'll see if the Jets respond on Sunday.

Well, at least there’s no excuses this season …

 

[gojetsgo]

I mean there's also teams like Leafs, Hurricanes, Devils, Rangers, and Avalanche who've bottomed out in the same timeframe as the three you mentioned and are currently some of the top teams in the league. I think Arizona is a special case too, I don't think anyone would say they've even tried to build a competitive team.

all of those teams can attract free agents and don't have to deal with being the #1 team on no trade lists, I also hate when everyone talks about the rangers rebuilding, they got a free noris level defencemen and 100 point winger

For those saying rebuild.... Be prepared of icing a roster worse than the Atlanta Jets. With Scheifele, Wheeler, possibly Ehlers, pld and Helle gone.

by the time were ready to compete the player we decided to build around will be in his final year of his contract

 

[blueandgoldguy]

They are in the proverbial "your damned if you do", "damned if you don't " situation.

You are essentially hoping the team catches lightning in a bottle in the playoffs at this point. Do you go out and mortgage the future for that or do you transition most of the core ala what the Blues do.

I'm not sure trading Dubois and bringing back Mark and Helle will lead to much more then a bubble team the next few years unless we get some prospects really step up in a big way. So does it make sense sticking with a group that's been here a decade now.

Chevy has some real tough questions to answer.

that pretty much seems to be the only hope for the Jets to improve from a bubble team/solid playoff team to a great playoff team/Stanley Cup contender. At least 3 of the following prospects - Perfetti, McGroaty, Lucius, Heinola, Samberg, Lambert, Chibrikov, Rachevsky, Solomonsson would have to emerge as front line players with a few of the others taking on respectable secondary roles as second liners, middle - 6ers, third liners in the next 2 -3 years. You also have to hope Helly remains a top-10 goalie in the league and Scheif can at least be a good to great 2nd liner.

 

[AlphaLackey]

Dude, being barely above .500 does not make the playoffs. This team is positively putrid right now. Either they're not getting the bounces, or they're getting decimated.

Being barely above .500 *in games won*, when on a downturn of variance, when you cashed out much better when luck was going your way, says a lot. Being .531 with zero loser points, in an era where loser points have made ".550 the new .500" is so far removed from 'absolutely putrid' as to defy credulity.

Again, somehow, this 'absolutely putrid team' has won more games than any other team in the conference. Want to call them a touch overrated? Fine. Sell me on why Dallas's 11-more-loser points doesn't make them lucky but doesn't make us unlucky.

But to suggest that this is not a playoff team? Again, as I've told others, if you truly believe what you believe, it's time for you to go out and make your easy fortune.

 

[WolfHouse]

They are in the proverbial "your damned if you do", "damned if you don't " situation.

You are essentially hoping the team catches lightning in a bottle in the playoffs at this point. Do you go out and mortgage the future for that or do you transition most of the core ala what the Blues do.

I'm not sure trading Dubois and bringing back Mark and Helle will lead to much more then a bubble team the next few years unless we get some prospects really step up in a big way. So does it make sense sticking with a group that's been here a decade now.

Chevy has some real tough questions to answer.

There's three scenarios that come to mind... aside from this team just still carrying the Atlanta country club syndrome...

1. Chevy had a presser on Jan 11 basically saying big moves were coming - the team fell apart about a week after that... did Chevy have a trade in place and it was 'vetoed' by a player not wanting to come here?

2. The record since Montreal is garbage - that was a whole weekend of PLD/Montreal media... did something crazy happen there - like PLD partied with guys from the Canadiens instead of the Jets? Or something bizarre

3. Jets ego came back after we thumped Avalanche 5-0... Scheif changed in December - feels like 2018-19 Jets waiting to win the cup because they were on the cover of Hockey News so of course they'll win... right?

If Im Chevy I mortgage the future IF I CAN... but maybe there's more guys not willing to come here because of Winnipeg and scared of the gong show last season... But he's gone after this season if we stumble in or miss

 

[AlphaLackey]

We haven't really been a first place team. It's more like maybe we aren't a second place team.

If you want to sell me on the idea that, despite Dallas's insane variance with loser points, despite us winning more games than any other team in the conference, that we aren't a first place team, but are a B- to B+ at best? I'll hear those arguments. The article I've crowed about shows that we need at minimum 2 more pieces (on D, FWIW) to meet the minimum standard of any cup winner in the age of advanced stats.

But in an age where the best team in the league and perhaps in recent history has an 85% chance to not win the cup? I'm not inclined to write off our chances as being 0% to win, not when our best player is in the one position where variance plays the biggest role.

There's three scenarios that come to mind... aside from this team just still carrying the Atlanta country club syndrome...

1. Chevy had a presser on Jan 11 basically saying big moves were coming - the team fell apart about a week after that... did Chevy have a trade in place and it was 'vetoed' by a player not wanting to come here?

2. The record since Montreal is garbage - that was a whole weekend of PLD/Montreal media... did something crazy happen there - like PLD partied with guys from the Canadiens instead of the Jets? Or something bizarre

3. Jets ego came back after we thumped Avalanche 5-0... Scheif changed in December - feels like 2018-19 Jets waiting to win the cup because they were on the cover of Hockey News so of course they'll win... right?

If Im Chevy I mortgage the future IF I CAN... but maybe there's more guys not willing to come here because of Winnipeg and scared of the gong show last season... But he's gone after this season if we stumble in or miss

If Chevy can't spend to the cap to give our core one last hurrah, then he's not the steady-and-stolid-y GM I thought he was. Everything I've said positive about his tenure, and there's been many more Ws than Ls, will pale in comparison to this most important week of his career.

 

[BigZ65]

If you want to sell me on the idea that, despite Dallas's insane variance with loser points, despite us winning more games than any other team in the conference, that we aren't a first place team, but are a B- to B+ at best? I'll hear those arguments. The article I've crowed about shows that we need at minimum 2 more pieces (on D, FWIW) to meet the minimum standard of any cup winner in the age of advanced stats.

But in an age where the best team in the league and perhaps in recent history has an 85% chance to not win the cup? I'm not inclined to write off our chances as being 0% to win, not when our best player is in the one position where variance plays the biggest role.

I get the quibble with the point system...but we were tops in point percentage for a few days here and there...not long enough to call ourselves first place.

 

[blueandgoldguy]

There's three scenarios that come to mind... aside from this team just still carrying the Atlanta country club syndrome...

1. Chevy had a presser on Jan 11 basically saying big moves were coming - the team fell apart about a week after that... did Chevy have a trade in place and it was 'vetoed' by a player not wanting to come here?

2. The record since Montreal is garbage - that was a whole weekend of PLD/Montreal media... did something crazy happen there - like PLD partied with guys from the Canadiens instead of the Jets? Or something bizarre

3. Jets ego came back after we thumped Avalanche 5-0... Scheif changed in December - feels like 2018-19 Jets waiting to win the cup because they were on the cover of Hockey News so of course they'll win... right?

If Im Chevy I mortgage the future IF I CAN... but maybe there's more guys not willing to come here because of Winnipeg and scared of the gong show last season... But he's gone after this season if we stumble in or miss

hmmm, I don't see it. He is safe for another year. Moot point though if they finish strong ...or at least respectable.

 

[WolfHouse]

Being barely above .500 *in games won*, when on a downturn of variance, when you cashed out much better when luck was going your way, says a lot. Being .531 with zero loser points, in an era where loser points have made ".550 the new .500" is so far removed from 'absolutely putrid' as to defy credulity.

Again, somehow, this 'absolutely putrid team' has won more games than any other team in the conference. Want to call them a touch overrated? Fine. Sell me on why Dallas's 11-more-loser points doesn't make them lucky but doesn't make us unlucky.

But to suggest that this is not a playoff team? Again, as I've told others, if you truly believe what you believe, it's time for you to go out and make your easy fortune.

To be fair, Dallas Stars are a fkn disaster. Worse than the Jets right now... if half the division wasn't tanking, both teams would be in danger.

 

[White Out 902]

yeah, those great 10 year rebuilds in buffalo edmonton and arizona should give fans hope!

It's a really fair point to bring up failed rebuilds like you would find in certain cities and markets. Some of them are totally unfair though like, the coyotes, who I'm convinced exists strictly to launder money. What I am willing to guarantee is that this team isn't going to get us anywhere close to a Stanley Cup. Something about this core snapped and broke and game two of the Vegas series, and they just haven't been the same since.

This game was painful to watch. I can't believe I subjected myself to all 3 periods.

 

[WolfHouse]

hmmm, I don't see it. He is safe for another year. Moot point though if they finish strong ...or at least respectable.

Hitting wild card level would imply 'not finishing strong'.

 

[AlphaLackey]

I get the quibble with the point system...but we were tops in point percentage for a few days here and there...not long enough to call ourselves first place.

That's fair. We're still a clear contender for first place, in a way that (say) Calgary isn't. The next week is big, doubly so with our 2nd line center out for two months. >.<

 

[voyageur]

I would like to thank alcohol (her name is Carolann) for putting me to sleep before the end of this game. Statement game, what's the statement?

Jets are not playing like contenders. Too late to roll the tanks in.

 

[Zippity]

If only they kept Stanley up

 

[None]

all of those teams can attract free agents and don't have to deal with being the #1 team on no trade lists, I also hate when everyone talks about the rangers rebuilding, they got a free noris level defencemen and 100 point winger

The Jets got to where they are without free agents, they can do it again. Success in this league is cyclical and we might have already reached the peak with this core. At some point they need to consider that there's irreconcilable flaws that prevent this team from truly getting to the top. Player contracts are expiring and the need to have this discussion will approach quickly.

They are in the proverbial "your damned if you do", "damned if you don't " situation.

You are essentially hoping the team catches lightning in a bottle in the playoffs at this point. Do you go out and mortgage the future for that or do you transition most of the core ala what the Blues do.

I'm not sure trading Dubois and bringing back Mark and Helle will lead to much more then a bubble team the next few years unless we get some prospects really step up in a big way. So does it make sense sticking with a group that's been here a decade now.

Chevy has some real tough questions to answer.

I'm not even sure what I would do. Are the Jets willing to part with picks and prospects for that chance to catch lightning with the contract uncertainty on the horizon? What if we don't capture lightning and fizzle out in the 1st round and Hellebuyck and Scheifele just refuse to negotiate until they're UFAs?

 

[gojetsgo]

The Jets got to where they are without free agents, they can do it again. Success in this league is cyclical and we might have already reached the peak with this core, at some point they need to consider that there's irreconcilable flaws that prevent this team from truly getting to the top. Player contracts are expiring and the need to have this discussion will approach quickly.

if we lose helle, pld and schefiele were going to be at a much worse starting point then they were when we got them