Auston Matthews Watch 2016

[BruinInPhilly]

I mean, these are all fair points and just to repeat -- I love Chychrun and think it would be awesome to have him on the Bruins.

I guess where I disagree-- I'd still take Matthews over Chychrun if I could-- is that while there are plenty of great forwards in the league, there are only a handful of truly elite forwards that fall into this category: Connor McDavid, Eichel, Matthews are today's Crosby, Kane, Ovechkin. We're talking the very top of of the pile; players who become the face of the franchise and carry a team into Cup contention. Pittsburgh would never have won a cup without Crosby. Chicago never without Kane. Ovechkin no Cup yet, but he's been the heart of their team for a decade, including many very good teams.

And on the D side, I see plenty of #1D around the league, all who can, and have, quarterback a Stanley Cup team. You don't necessarily need Ekblad to win a Cup or contend.

Look at Tampa. Victor Hedman has become their #1D; he's no Duncan Keith or Doughty or Ekblad, however. But he's definitely good enough to lead a Cup contending defensive core.

And now look at St. Louis. They arguably have two elite #1D in Pietrangelo and Shattenkirk. Haven't come close to a Cup, because their offense is dismal. Tarasenko may be the difference for them finally, as he's developed into a truly elite forward.

Or look at Nashville. They also have two elite #1Ds in Roman Josi and Shea Weber, and now a future elite #1D in Seth Jones. Not even close to a Cup. Why? Poor offense.

Now back to Tampa. Hedman has been important but it's Stamkos, however, who has been the difference in turning that franchise around. Like Crosby, he turns good players into elite players when he plays with them (Kunitz).

Connor McDavid will have the same effect. Matthews, if he lives up to his billing (and record smashing amateur career) will do that too. Instant impact and big long term impact.

I don't pretend to be any kind of expert on prospects as I mainly just read about these prospects and see the occasional youtube clip. That being said I agree on taking Matthews or Chychrun if we somehow get the #1 and IF our scouts think he is the best player in the draft. It certainly seems like he is the the undisputed #1 in most rankings. You just don't draft for need with the #1 pick. I'm sure there are some better hockey analogies, but look at the Portland Trailblazers passing on Michael Jordan and Kevin Durant. Also forwards are generally safer and faster to develop than defensemen. Unless our scouts think Chychrun is the best player in the draft, I'd take Matthews and target D-men in following picks. Many top defensemen in the league were not 1st round picks.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/and-no...semen-rankings-for-2015-16-203303273-nhl.html

Just using the list as a basis, not arguing the merit of its ranking, but of this list 13 defensemen were taken in the 1st round to 12 taken. Considering the included Brent Burns on there who is mostly a forward now, i consider it to be about half and half.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/player.htm?id=8475692

I could only find fantasy rankings for the forwards, but out of the top 100, 34 were taken outside the 1st round and only a handful are top tier forwards (Benn, Bergeron, Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Pavelski).

I'd be interested to see how it compares when just looking at top 10 picks, but I'm too lazy for that and need to get to work.

 

[Ice Nine]

I don't pretend to be any kind of expert on prospects as I mainly just read about these prospects and see the occasional youtube clip. That being said I agree on taking Matthews or Chychrun if we somehow get the #1 and IF our scouts think he is the best player in the draft. It certainly seems like he is the the undisputed #1 in most rankings. You just don't draft for need with the #1 pick. I'm sure there are some better hockey analogies, but look at the Portland Trailblazers passing on Michael Jordan and Kevin Durant. Also forwards are generally safer and faster to develop than defensemen. Unless our scouts think Chychrun is the best player in the draft, I'd take Matthews and target D-men in following picks. Many top defensemen in the league were not 1st round picks.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/and-no...semen-rankings-for-2015-16-203303273-nhl.html

Just using the list as a basis, not arguing the merit of its ranking, but of this list 13 defensemen were taken in the 1st round to 12 taken. Considering the included Brent Burns on there who is mostly a forward now, i consider it to be about half and half.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/player.htm?id=8475692

I could only find fantasy rankings for the forwards, but out of the top 100, 34 were taken outside the 1st round and only a handful are top tier forwards (Benn, Bergeron, Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Pavelski).

I'd be interested to see how it compares when just looking at top 10 picks, but I'm too lazy for that and need to get to work.

Great post and definitely agree. I think this is part of why Dmen often slide down the draft rankings on draft day, because they are more of a gamble and often take longer to develop (Hedman, for example).

And yeah, Duncan Keith, arguably the best in the league, is a second round pick. Mark Giordano undrafted! Anton Stralman a seventh rounder (!). And many other top D were late 1st round picks. Doughty, in ways, is the exception and not the rule.

Crosby, Ovechkin, the two best F in the league, both taken #1 overall. Kane, #1 overall too.

 

[Fonzerelli]

I guess where I disagree-- I'd still take Matthews over Chychrun if I could-- is that while there are plenty of great forwards in the league, there are only a handful of truly elite forwards that fall into this category: Connor McDavid, Eichel, Matthews are today's Crosby, Kane, Ovechkin. We're talking the very top of of the pile; players who become the face of the franchise and carry a team into Cup contention. Pittsburgh would never have won a cup without Crosby. Chicago never without Kane. Ovechkin no Cup yet, but he's been the heart of their team for a decade, including many very good teams.

And on the D side, I see plenty of #1D around the league, all who can, and have, quarterback a Stanley Cup team. You don't necessarily need Ekblad to win a Cup or contend.

LA Kings X 2 with Drew Doughty and the, *achem*, Boston Bruins with Zdeno Chara. Teams dont win Stanley Cup with elite defensemen only rings true if you leave out the teams that did it. I guess that's my problem with your repeated flawed positions.

 

[Ice Nine]

LA Kings X 2 with Drew Doughty and the, *achem*, Boston Bruins with Zdeno Chara. Teams dont win Stanley Cup with elite defensemen only rings true if you leave out the teams that did it. I guess that's my problem with your repeated flawed positions.

We're debating how best to use a theoretical first overall pick.

So, please remind me -- was Chara drafted 1st or 2nd overall?

Or was he drafted in the 3rd round, 56th overall?

 

[sirmaxalot]

He's going to look great in EDM

Hall - McDavid - Yakupov
Matthews - RNH - Eberle

Figure this'll get them to .400 hockey.

 

[RussellmaniaKW]

the NHL really ought to add a clause to the next CBA that a team can only have so many first overall picks in a few year span. I don't know exactly how they should enforce it but if the Oilers end up with Matthews then I'll be livid.

Teams should obviously get to draft early as compensation for having a bad year, but teams should not be rewarded for continuously having bad year after bad year.

 

[sirmaxalot]

the NHL really ought to add a clause to the next CBA that a team can only have so many first overall picks in a few year span. I don't know exactly how they should enforce it but if the Oilers end up with Matthews then I'll be livid.

Teams should obviously get to draft early as compensation for having a bad year, but teams should not be rewarded for continuously having bad year after bad year.

I don't think they'll bottom out this year. I am just playing around.

If they do start doing well, how long is their fan base banned from talking smack??

Let me explain:

I see Edmonton like I see a friend you are playing NHL video games against. You play every day for 3 months and beat them senseless. They flip out, throw the controller, ***** about every play and blame the game.

Then you decide to throw them a bone by adding handicaps to your team and picking the worst team in one of the european leagues while allowing them to be the 2010 Team Canada Roster with (no fatigue) on.

They squeak out a win and then start dancing and getting in your face with trash talk. This seems no more acceptable than EDM talking any smack even if they finish 1st place in the league this year somehow.

Am I right?

 

[BruinInPhilly]

I don't think they'll bottom out this year. I am just playing around.

If they do start doing well, how long is their fan base banned from talking smack??

Let me explain:

I see Edmonton like I see a friend you are playing NHL video games against. You play every day for 3 months and beat them senseless. They flip out, throw the controller, ***** about every play and blame the game.

Then you decide to throw them a bone by adding handicaps to your team and picking the worst team in one of the european leagues while allowing them to be the 2010 Team Canada Roster with (no fatigue) on.

They squeak out a win and then start dancing and getting in your face with trash talk. This seems no more acceptable than EDM talking any smack even if they finish 1st place in the league this year somehow.

Am I right?

 

[BNHL]

Maybe we should start a Jake Wise thread;http://terrierhockey.blogspot.com/2014/10/top-bantam-forward-commits-to-bu-men.html

 

[sirmaxalot]

Maybe we should start a Jake Wise thread;http://terrierhockey.blogspot.com/2014/10/top-bantam-forward-commits-to-bu-men.html

Am I to understand we have also started a Zack Bergeron watch? 2033 is it?

 

[Shaun]

Maybe we should start a Jake Wise thread;http://terrierhockey.blogspot.com/2014/10/top-bantam-forward-commits-to-bu-men.html

actually saw him play with the islanders a few years ago and he was unreal

 

[BNHL]

actually saw him play with the islanders a few years ago and he was unreal

I've been tracking him for a couple of years,committed to BU at 14,word is his hockey IQ is off the charts and his shot and skating are right there too.

 

[Ice Nine]

the NHL really ought to add a clause to the next CBA that a team can only have so many first overall picks in a few year span. I don't know exactly how they should enforce it but if the Oilers end up with Matthews then I'll be livid.

Teams should obviously get to draft early as compensation for having a bad year, but teams should not be rewarded for continuously having bad year after bad year.

It really is outrageous, isn't it? Oilers should be relegated to the ECHL if they finish bottom 3 this year. NO DRAFT PICK, EITHER.

We'll call it "The New Edmonton Rule".

It'll be fun watching them play the Greenville Swamp Rabbits, Quad City Mallards, and the Idaho Steelheads.

They'll surely finish at least mid-table there.

 

[Jean_Jacket41]

Seems like the Bruins didn't get the memo about tanking after 3 games into the season.

4-0-1 since and into a playoffs spot.

Eat that.

 

[Jean_Jacket41]

7 teams started the year 0-3. This is their actual record:

LA 6-3-0
Boston 4-3-1
NJ 4-4-1
Pittsburgh 4-4-0
Carolina 3-6-0
Edmonton 3-7-0
Columbus 2-8-0

 

[sirmaxalot]

I'd rather see Matthews somehow go to Montreal or Toronto than Edmonton.

That's how annoyed I am with EDM's refusal to make moves to improve outside of a strategy based around "Just be garbage and get the best talent"

 

[Bruwinz37]

I've been tracking him for a couple of years,committed to BU at 14,word is his hockey IQ is off the charts and his shot and skating are right there too.

Been the best player around for years. Like a man amongst boys.

 

[HeartsAlive]

6-1-1 since Chara came back. I think this can get wrapped up into the Shark Tank thread at this point, I don't think the Bruins 1st is gonna be worth as much as some were wishing for this year.

 

[81ragnaH]

I mean, these are all fair points and just to repeat -- I love Chychrun and think it would be awesome to have him on the Bruins.

I guess where I disagree-- I'd still take Matthews over Chychrun if I could-- is that while there are plenty of great forwards in the league, there are only a handful of truly elite forwards that fall into this category: Connor McDavid, Eichel, Matthews are today's Crosby, Kane, Ovechkin. We're talking the very top of of the pile; players who become the face of the franchise and carry a team into Cup contention. Pittsburgh would never have won a cup without Crosby. Chicago never without Kane. Ovechkin no Cup yet, but he's been the heart of their team for a decade, including many very good teams 1.

And on the D side, I see plenty of #1D around the league, all who can, and have, quarterback a Stanley Cup team. You don't necessarily need Ekblad to win a Cup or contend. 2

Look at Tampa. Victor Hedman has become their #1D; he's no Duncan Keith or Doughty or Ekblad, however. But he's definitely good enough to lead a Cup contending defensive core.

And now look at St. Louis. They arguably have two elite #1D in Pietrangelo and Shattenkirk. Haven't come close to a Cup, because their offense is dismal. Tarasenko may be the difference for them finally, as he's developed into a truly elite forward.

Or look at Nashville. They also have two elite #1Ds in Roman Josi and Shea Weber, and now a future elite #1D in Seth Jones. Not even close to a Cup. Why? Poor offense.

Now back to Tampa. Hedman has been important but it's Stamkos, however, who has been the difference in turning that franchise around. Like Crosby, he turns good players into elite players when he plays with them (Kunitz).

Connor McDavid will have the same effect. Matthews, if he lives up to his billing (and record smashing amateur career) will do that too. Instant impact and big long term impact.

Great post and definitely agree. I think this is part of why Dmen often slide down the draft rankings on draft day, because they are more of a gamble and often take longer to develop (Hedman, for example).

And yeah, Duncan Keith, arguably the best in the league, is a second round pick. Mark Giordano undrafted! Anton Stralman a seventh rounder (!). And many other top D were late 1st round picks. Doughty, in ways, is the exception and not the rule.

Crosby, Ovechkin, the two best F in the league, both taken #1 overall. Kane, #1 overall too.

These are good posts, like most of yours are.

Ultimately, you'd be fine with either one. My main gripe was comparing apples to apples. If you're going to compare D to Chychrun at this point, use fair comparisons, not Cam Barkers.

As far as team building, I'd always take elite D. There's just too many elite F. I'd say there's more than just the three you mentioned, but even if not, let's just use those three. Crosby won with a ridiculously deep F group. It wasn't just him, it was him, Malkin, and Staal down the middle. Any team where Jordan Staal is your #3 you are doing pretty darn good in. And any team where Malkin is your #2 is insane. He was a top 3 F in the world when they won the cup. And one of the higher ranked above him was also on his team. That team was an outlier, not the norm. And Kane? I could just as easily say he doesn't win jack without Keith there.

A second point I wanted to highlight was #1D vs elite D. There aren't a ton of elite D in this league, maybe 3-5. But the past winners (8 out of the last 10 actually) had an elite D when they won. You need to score to win, but the Bruins and the Kings and other winners have shown you can score by committee if you have an elite D manning the blue line. After last years draft, I was thinking/hoping we could develop one like a Keith or a Chara from a late round pick, but the odds of that happening are extremely slim. On the contrary, look how the bruins are scoring right now. They do not have a truly elite offense forward, they are deep and balanced and lead the league in scoring. And they have done that before, had a top 5 scoring team under Julien with no elite scoring F. From a matchup standpoint, if a team has an elite F you gameplan to shut him down (Chara vs Crosby in 2013 for example). A team with balanced F is obviously much harder to do that with. Who to you pair your top D against? Shut one line down, the others will just score on you instead.

Ultimately, I'd be drooling over either one. I was pissed with they traded Tyler Seguin and I'd be thrilled to have someone like Austin Matthews on this team; I don't actually hate offense lol. I'm just saying, if given the choice, I'd take the elite D because I believe those are harder to find. Just a preference.

At this point, I'd say lets just agree to disagree. Cheers

 

[Shaun]

sell what you can.

 

[ashnathan]

sell what you can.

Im with you on this. I don't want them to blow it up per se...but get rid of stuff that will give you good return, and take the medicine this season, have a good draft, make some good moves in FA and go on an assault next year.

 

[Shaun]

Matthews is completely dominating WJC.

San Jose is 7 points back of last place.

 

[JRull86]

Matthews is completely dominating WJC.

San Jose is 7 points back of last place.

I will laugh if Sweeney turns Martin Jones into Matthews or Chuchyrn.

 

[RedeyeRocketeer]

Matthews is completely dominating WJC.

San Jose is 7 points back of last place.

They're also 7 points out of the 21st pick in the 1st round, and they've played the least games in the NHL.

Let's be realistic, we'll be pretty happy to get the 12th overall pick with it I suspect. And that's pretty good.

 

[TheBigBadB]

They're also 7 points out of the 21st pick in the 1st round, and they've played the least games in the NHL.

Let's be realistic, we'll be pretty happy to get the 12th overall pick with it I suspect. And that's pretty good.

What happens at the trade deadline will decide who free falls. I mean SJ does have some players they could sell off to get a first back, so they may have to sell off even if their own first is gone.