Tribute Auston Matthews Discussion "the Beauty" Edition

[Gary Nylund]

If Matthews decides winning means a great deal to him (and it does with most players), the sky is the limit. That's how I view his play this year. A guy who is improving on his game and wants to win badly. I have said on here that in my opinion, he and Andersen are the most untouchable for trade prospects.

I hope he breaks 50 goals. He is in the unique position, at such a young age, where one can honestly say "if he decides to stay with this team for his career, he could own most offensive records". For a franchise over 100 years old, that would be one hell of a statement (more importantly, I hope, a S.C or two).

Mats had 420 goals in his career. Matthews already has 130 or so. Simply put, if he stayed in Toronto for his career, he would obliterate the record. He and Marner, would probably be neck and neck for most points in a career. All of this, secondary to winning a Cup of course.

Sometimes we forget, just how lucky we are to watch the offense this team can produce. It's probably unmatched in team history. I hope Dubas appreciates this and find a way to improve the back end, even if ever so slightly.

Nice post! Hopefully the idea of re-writing the Maple Leafs record book will help convince him to stay here. And you're so right about us being lucky to watch this team, People are grumpy (me included) because we're still waiting to win even one playoff series but once that dam bursts, we could be in for a long sweet stretch of playoff success.

 

[sxvnert]

Love how Matty shut down yet another ridiculous 500 word question from Hendrick.

 

[Leafsfan74]

Since 2017-2018, when Mackinnon broke out...

ES P/60

Matthews - 2.90
Mackinnon - 2.65

ES P1/60

Matthews - 2.51
Mackinnon - 2.14

PP P/60

Mackinnon - 7.09
Matthews - 6.32

PP P1/60

Mackinnon - 5.19
Matthews - 5.17

This is pre-prime for Matthews with way worse ES linemates, and about 40% of the PP sample on the 2nd unit, being compared against Mackinnon in his prime, on one of the most stacked lines in the league, on the 1st PP unit for the whole sample.

Both players are top shelf talent.

That said, in my opinion, there is only one player I trade Matthews for and it isn't Mackinnon. That's how highly I rate his talent, coupled with his youth, size, and growth potential.

I always sensed he has that quiet confidence and hunger to win, and that's important to me as a fan. He isn't just content with scoring, he wants the puck when the game is on the line.

Let us not forget why there was a reason so many teams wanted to win the 1st Pick that was Matthews. He is a guy who can (and is) a big part of turning a franchise around really quick.

 

[34]

Lemme get u a prize real quick

Will settle for a Stanley Cup in Toronto.

 

[authentic]

Since 2017-2018, when Mackinnon broke out...

ES P/60

Matthews - 2.90
Mackinnon - 2.65

ES P1/60

Matthews - 2.51
Mackinnon - 2.14

PP P/60

Mackinnon - 7.09
Matthews - 6.32

PP P1/60

Mackinnon - 5.19
Matthews - 5.17

This is pre-prime for Matthews with way worse ES linemates, and about 40% of the PP sample on the 2nd unit, being compared against Mackinnon in his prime, on one of the most stacked lines in the league, on the 1st PP unit for the whole sample.

So you truly believe that points per 60 tell the whole story? Do you really come away from watching both of them actually thinking to yourself that Matthews appears to be better than MacKinnon, let alone a whole tier above him?

 

[authentic]

Both players are top shelf talent.

That said, in my opinion, there is only one player I trade Matthews for and it isn't Mackinnon. That's how highly I rate his talent, coupled with his youth, size, and growth potential.

I always sensed he has that quiet confidence and hunger to win, and that's important to me as a fan. He isn't just content with scoring, he wants the puck when the game is on the line.

Let us not forget why there was a reason so many teams wanted to win the 1st Pick that was Matthews. He is a guy who can (and is) a big part of turning a franchise around really quick.

MacKinnon is the definition of what you're describing here. I hope Matthews reaches his level but he really hasn't yet, and I don't believe anyone other than a few very biased posters would think otherwise. MacKinnon is a faster, smarter, more driven player with better hands and playmaking ability, and still is a very good goal scorer on top of that even if not on Matthews level there. I really don't understand how someone thinks Matthews is better nevermind on a whole other level.

 

[authentic]

Who was then lol? Marner? He had an extremely bad start this year under Babcock. He wasnt doing anything on ES and neither was Tavares.

Are we not talking about the entirety of their careers? Or just the first 15 or so games this season? Either way you slice it they are both very close.

 

[authentic]

Guys ****ing incredible

Not bad eh Babcock? Moron

Maybe the best duo in the league Marner and Matthews

It's so refreshing to see how big of a problem he actually was as time goes on. Good riddance.

 

[stickty111]

A superstar. Plain and simple

 

[sxvnert]

 

[BorntoLose]

Pastas been slumping rocket race should be a dandy 50 is really doable

 

[Apotheosis]

2nd in the league in goals and slowly creeping up. What is that, 15 points in his last 9 or 10 games? Doesn't look like his old unsustainable streaks. He's generating chances like crazy right now at ES with Marner and Hyman and same on the PP. I think this is the year he eclipses 100 points. Something like 55 goals and 49 assists (considering he's moving the puck much better and showcasing some good playmaking).

 

[sxvnert]

2nd in the league in goals and slowly creeping up. What is that, 15 points in his last 9 or 10 games? Doesn't look like his old unsustainable streaks. He's generating chances like crazy right now at ES with Marner and Hyman and same on the PP. I think this is the year he eclipses 100 points. Something like 55 goals and 49 assists (considering he's moving the puck much better and showcasing some good playmaking).

The constant changing of the lines keeps his game fresh and mixes up the looks he gets. Its clear Matty needs variety like the genius kid bored in class.

 

[Gabriel426]

Nice post! Hopefully the idea of re-writing the Maple Leafs record book will help convince him to stay here. And you're so right about us being lucky to watch this team, People are grumpy (me included) because we're still waiting to win even one playoff series but once that dam bursts, we could be in for a long sweet stretch of playoff success.

I think we see talents and wonder why they don’t translate to playoff success. With the exception of Hawks and Pens both their first time winning the Cup, the rest of the Cup Winners in the post Cap era are veteran teams or at the very least have their core at 24yrs or older. The Leafs are babies. It will take time. The most important thing is the Leafs were one or even two years ahead schedule. It was nice making the playoffs when the kids broke in but I really won’t consider that a 1st round exit bc they should not even be in the playoffs in the first place. While the last two against Bruins were tough but Bruins was the better team

 

[Dekes For Days]

So you truly believe that points per 60 tell the whole story?

I never said it told the whole story, but it tells a lot more of the story than raw points, which is what most people point to to claim that their chosen player is better.

I added additional context, but all of the additional context just makes Matthews look even better. I'm not sure what part of the story you feel isn't being told.

Do you really come away from watching both of them actually thinking to yourself that Matthews appears to be better than MacKinnon, let alone a whole tier above him?

The eye test often lies to us, especially when comparing between players we see all the time and have investment in to others that we don't, and they play very different styles, but yes, I see the dominance and insane ability to individually affect the game in Matthews. Honestly, people must be trying really hard to not see it. I'm sure Mackinnon getting a stacked line and basically double the PP time definitely helps your positive perception of him.

TBH, I've probably undersold Mackinnon; I didn't mean for this tier thing to get so out of hand. Mackinnon is an amazing player doing really well right now. It's not like there is a massive gap between them. Mackinnon in 17/18 and this year have been on a more similar level, but he was not last year, and that's a significant difference in the tiers. Players who consistently put up top of the top production (in ES P/60, ES P1/60, PP P/60, and PP P1/60) every year even when not in ideal situations (prime, great linemates, etc.) are so, so, so rare.

 

[Martin Skoula]

So you truly believe that points per 60 tell the whole story? Do you really come away from watching both of them actually thinking to yourself that Matthews appears to be better than MacKinnon, let alone a whole tier above him?

P/60 aren't the whole story, it's just a good way to check if the gap you're seeing really exists or is just a product of getting 2x the PP time.

Mack's great, but he's been in one of the best situations in the league to put up points for the last few years. I'm not saying Matthew is better, just that the gap gets really exaggerated because of how they've been used up until Keefe came in. And even with Keefe, none of our players are going to see the same kind of PP time that most other stars do because we don't take enough penalties to get as many make-up calls as we should.

 

[Leafsfan74]

The constant changing of the lines keeps his game fresh and mixes up the looks he gets. Its clear Matty needs variety like the genius kid bored in class.

I may be wrong about Babcocks success with a team like the Leafs. He did well to get them thinking the right way, but his message was stale.

I appreciate Keefes desire to be creative and keep players on their toes. I think your assessment is fair, when you are talented, you want different challenges and looks, whether it's on the ice or in enrichment math.

It's not just energizing for him, it's a treat for teammates who want to play that much harder to put up some points.

 

[7even]

Who was then lol? Marner? He had an extremely bad start this year under Babcock. He wasnt doing anything on ES and neither was Tavares.

I thought Tavares was most "with it" early. In the games no one was scoring he was the most consistently engaged in both zones.

 

[saffronleaf]

I think we see talents and wonder why they don’t translate to playoff success. With the exception of Hawks and Pens both their first time winning the Cup, the rest of the Cup Winners in the post Cap era are veteran teams or at the very least have their core at 24yrs or older. The Leafs are babies. It will take time. The other thing and it is most important is that they were one or even two years ahead schedule. It was nice making the playoffs when the kids broke in but I really won’t consider that a 1st round exit bc they should not even be in the playoffs in the first place. While the last two against Bruins were tough but Bruins was the better team

I don't know if the Bruins were the better team last year. Yea they were higher in the standings, but still.

I didn't like our loss last year because even with Kadri suspension, Gardiner injury, etc. we controlled that series. We were the better team. It felt like we should have won but choked. In part it was because of Babcock being outcoached. It was a tough loss IMO, unlike the Caps loss or the first Bruins loss.

But hopefully it was a good learning experience for our very young core and we'll see some deep playoff runs soon. Plus we now have Chief Keefe.

 

[Dragao6]

Who was then lol? Marner? He had an extremely bad start this year under Babcock. He wasnt doing anything on ES and neither was Tavares.

I dont disagree with you here but Matthew's was right there with them with the poor performances hence our record and coach firing. Coasted allot of games even when he scored. Scored some meaningless goals near then end when we were already losing by a few.
Sucks when it's hard to come up with better performers at the start when we were way worse but for me and I remember mentioning it often...the best was easily Mikheyev. He was consistent every game and def stood out. Moore was good too. Our better players were are bottom lines unfortunatly along with freddy

Now the matthews under keefe...that's a different story. Doesnt say much for his character if he was dogging it just because he hated the coach but we all know what was there

 

[DanM]

So you truly believe that points per 60 tell the whole story? Do you really come away from watching both of them actually thinking to yourself that Matthews appears to be better than MacKinnon, let alone a whole tier above him?

I think Matthews will have a better career for sure. Just looking at the first 3-4 years of their careers (matthews still in his 4th) the point totals are not at all close, and not to mention the usage is laughable when you look at how each player was and is utilized. You also look at games played (health) and Mack had some pretty average numbers until his 5th year.

Sure, Mack is a great player right now, and has a fantastic situation in Colorado, but let's see how Matthews does staying healthy and not having Babcock as a head coach.

 

[Petrus]

I like Matthews with Marner. Marner is a better defender and grittier player than Nylander. Marner is also a play making winger which compliments Matthews goal scoring.

Nylander on the other hand is a good play making winger as well and is a good complimentary player to Tavares’ grit and more defensively responsible play.

 

[Gabriel426]

I don't know if the Bruins were the better team last year. Yea they were higher in the standings, but still.

I didn't like our loss last year because even with Kadri suspension, Gardiner injury, etc. we controlled that series. We were the better team. It felt like we should have won but choked. In part it was because of Babcock being outcoached. It was a tough loss IMO, unlike the Caps loss or the first Bruins loss.

But hopefully it was a good learning experience for our very young core and we'll see some deep playoff runs soon. Plus we now have Chief Keefe.

I think the performance of the Leafs in that 7 games showed they could play with the Bruins but heading in the playoffs, a lot of us thought we were going to get swept bc of the way the Leafs played toward the end of the season.
Bruins was the better team, it could go both ways but in no way was a shocker like BJ over Lightning.

 

[34]

I like Matthews with Marner. Marner is a better defender and grittier player than Nylander. Marner is also a play making winger which compliments Matthews goal scoring.

Nylander on the other hand is a good play making winger as well and is a good complimentary player to Tavares’ grit and more defensively responsible play.

I agree with this and I think more people are starting to as well.

Nylander seems to be complementing Tavares very well. They seem to be clicking.

Matthews and Marner is just awesome.

 

[kb]

I think the performance of the Leafs in that 7 games showed they could play with the Bruins but heading in the playoffs, a lot of us thought we were going to get swept bc of the way the Leafs played toward the end of the season.
Bruins was the better team, it could go both ways but in no way was a shocker like BJ over Lightning.

Agreed. Last year's playoffs was lost by the special teams' performance. The Leafs fared well at 5 on 5.