ATD Chat Thread XX

[VanIslander]

Indeed, context matters.

Stats help illuminate - not replace - plays we see. The longer the lens, the more revelant the stat.

 

[tinyzombies]

I think it depends on what your objective is - are you trying to compile data, or make an argument?

If you're just trying to compile data, then the numbers that are presented are (more or less) accurate. It's no different than saying that Jamie Benn won an Art Ross, but Steve Yzerman didn't. It's a factual summary of what actually happened.

If you're trying to make an argument (or a greatest players list) - yes, for sure, you need to consider the context. (That's when you get into comments like "Yzerman would have won at least 1 Art Ross if not for Gretzky/Lemieux, and Benn peaked during an unusually weak season").

Factual summaries can (and should) support a position, but they're never a position on their own.

I’d also love to see adjustments for systems played vis-a-vis possible wins. For example: if Bergeron’s leash had lengthened he would have scored more but lost more. There should be an offensive score not based entirely on points tho, because if he can score out of that role, he deserves a higher offensive rating than he usually gets credit for. And same for an offensive guy who doesn’t defend - if that doesn’t lead to wins he should be penalized. Etc. for dmen who play zone for instance, they might have to play zone because that’s all they can do or maybe like Shea Weber it’s because they are dominant in a zone - even tho they give up medium danger stuff in volume. There’s no detail to stats.

 

[ChiTownPhilly]

Personal FYI-

Have been away-from-board for a while due to the fact that a close family member has sustained [to use hockey parlance] a season-ending Lower Body Injury. Recovery IS expected... but I'll be serving in the role of primary care-giver-- and that will be my new occupation, until further notice.

Will miss the history project, and also (possibly) a future draft or two- but they'll have to be slid off the priority-list, for now.

 

[ImporterExporter]

Personal FYI-

Have been away-from-board for a while due to the fact that a close family member has sustained [to use hockey parlance] a season-ending Lower Body Injury. Recovery IS expected... but I'll be serving in the role of primary care-giver-- and that will be my new occupation, until further notice.

Will miss the history project, and also (possibly) a future draft or two- but they'll have to be slid off the priority-list, for now.

Family first. Hoping for the best for everyone good sir!

 

[BenchBrawl]

Personal FYI-

Have been away-from-board for a while due to the fact that a close family member has sustained [to use hockey parlance] a season-ending Lower Body Injury. Recovery IS expected... but I'll be serving in the role of primary care-giver-- and that will be my new occupation, until further notice.

Will miss the history project, and also (possibly) a future draft or two- but they'll have to be slid off the priority-list, for now.

Wishing your loved one the best recovery. Take care of yourselves and see you back when you're ready.

 

[VanIslander]

I was searching for a good testament to Potvin's skating (to counter a puzzling claim that Denis wasn't good at skating)...

And i came across this Bowman gem about Bourque:

Ray Bourque is the closest I've ever seen to I think the best I've ever seen, Doug Harvey. He played until he was 44. Bourque could do the same thing. He's never out of position. He conserves his energy. He's been a model player, he plays hard and he's never been on the carpet for anything.

 

[Habsfan18]

If we ever have an all-time tough motherf**ker draft, Shea is going 1st round. What a warrior. It's a damn shame he and Carey Price JUST fell short that year.

 

[jigglysquishy]

Talking hockey with uncles. Turns out one was neighbours with Bobby Baun in the Toronto area. And the other spent 3 months as an intern doctor for the Leafs in the early 70s. Stitched up Gilbert Perreault and became buddies with Johnny Bower.

Interesting the connections you bump in to.

 

[tinyzombies]

View attachment 928401

If we ever have an all-time tough motherf**ker draft, Shea is going 1st round. What a warrior. It's a damn shame he and Carey Price JUST fell short that year.

I wouldn't say JUST short. Tampa didn't take us seriously and still easily beat us. Edmundson and Chariot in the top 4, Petry playing with a broken hand, Shea you saw above, Price on one leg by the time the finals rolled around. Danault was Bergeronlike during that run, we collapsed and Price too care of literally everything, until he couldn't. The matchups were perfect for us, even tho they were much more talented teams. Leafs were soft and had a suspect defense and goaltending and we were big and mean in the middle, Winnipeg played zero team D, Vegas was slow and had Mr. Fleury and his usual playoff antics and we had some speed up front, But Tampa was just stacked and dominant in the middle at both ends of the rink. We couldn't even get to the net, and then Vasi with his overinflated equipment was waiting.

 

[tinyzombies]

Look who is now in the top 100:

 

[BenchBrawl]

I was searching for a good testament to Potvin's skating (to counter a puzzling claim that Denis wasn't good at skating)...

And i came across this Bowman gem about Bourque:

From watching his games, Potvin was an efficient skater. When you compare him to "similar" defensemen (Stevens, Chara, Robinson, Pronger, Weber), Potvin was a better skater than all of them.

 

[tinyzombies]

From watching his games, Potvin was an efficient skater. When you compare him to "similar" defensemen (Stevens, Chara, Robinson, Pronger, Weber), Potvin was a better skater than all of them.

I think not.

 

[jigglysquishy]

Found this while doing research on the goalie project