Around the NHL 2023-2024

[Brockon]

can you believe McDavid passed the record for assists in a single post season and now we also have a dman that's within striking range of the old record as well? That's ridiculous.

McDavid's 8g-36a-42p, is 4th in NHL history (23gp) - I think there's a pretty good chance that he gets 2-3 more points tommorow night and moves up the list ,even if the Oilers can't force a game 7.

The only higher scoring postseasons ahead of him are now:

1. Gretzky 47p in '85 (18gp)
2. Lemieux 44p in '92 (23gp)
3. Gretzky 43p in '88 (19gp)

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Looks like Toronto is working on a Marner Extension

 

[Brian39]

That could quite literally be what happened to Goodrow. It is rumored that Goodrow used his NTC not to be traded to SJ. So the Rangers waived him and SJ claimed him anyway.

Was this the plan all along? If so it's circumvention. But there is probably no way to prove it, so NYR/SJ will get away with it.

Hard disagree and I feel pretty confident that the League would win if the PA tried to file a grievance based on those facts alone.

"We couldn't trade you, so we put you on waivers" is 100% allowable for a player with a NTC. The fact that the player tried to block a trade to the last place team and that this team then claimed you on waivers does not make it circumvention.

IMO, the only way it becomes circumvention is if NYR and SJ executed the other components of the trade based on San Jose picking him up of waivers. If SJ's waiver claim of the player is used as 'past considerations' for another trade, then the PA would have a case for circumvention.

In reality, this would be a tough case to prove, because no GM is stupid enough to go on record that they another trade based on the waiver activity. But if we get to the draft and the Rangers trade pick #30 to the Sharks for pick #42 with no other assets included, then the PA would have a very good case that obviously this was the other components of the Goodrow trade That is so obviously a trade that the Rangers would never make in a vacuum and it would be painfully clear that such a deal was a direct result of San Jose picking up Goodrow on waivers.

In that example, I think that the PA absolutely wins a grievance that this waiver activity circumvented his NTC. But unless San Jose is at some point rewarded by the Rangers for the claim, then it isn't circumvention. What will get really interesting is if the Rangers and Sharks make a multi-asset trade at the draft that looks one-sided in San Jose's favor but can be plausibly defended as a standalone deal by the Rangers. But unless that happens, Goodrow is going to have to eat this one and go to San Jose if he wants to get paid the remainder of his contract.

 

[Brian39]

McDavid's 8g-36a-42p, is 4th in NHL history (23gp) - I think there's a pretty good chance that he gets 2-3 more points tommorow night and moves up the list ,even if the Oilers can't force a game 7.

The only higher scoring postseasons ahead of him are now:

1. Gretzky 47p in '85 (18gp)
2. Lemieux 44p in '92 (23gp)
3. Gretzky 43p in '88 (19gp)

This is the best individual NHL playoff performance I've seen in my lifetime.

I don't care what happens in game 6. He could have 0 points and go -5 and I would still say that this is the best playoff performance I've ever seen. Stats aside, I have never seen a skater put up back-to-back games like what we just saw from him while facing elimination.

Drai, Hyman, Nugent-Hopkins, and Kane have combined for 6 points through 5 games in this series. Not a single forward on the Oilers besides McDavid has more than 3 points through 5 games. Stuart Skinner has played every minute of the series and is sporting a .902 SV%. If I could have magically learned all of this information (and only this information) 3 weeks ago, I'd have felt pretty damn comfortable putting a large sum of money on the Panthers winning the Cup in 5 games.

I know that game 4 was a blowout and they didn't 'need' his points to win, but McDavid getting this series back to Edmonton for game 6 is one of the most amazing things I've seen as a hockey fan and that is after an also-insane first 3 rounds where he had 31 points in 18 games.

I so, so badly want to see him/them get this series back to Florida for a game 7, but even if they can't do it, McDavid has been the best I've ever seen in the playoffs.

 

[Blueston]

Hard disagree and I feel pretty confident that the League would win if the PA tried to file a grievance based on those facts alone.

"We couldn't trade you, so we put you on waivers" is 100% allowable for a player with a NTC. The fact that the player tried to block a trade to the last place team and that this team then claimed you on waivers does not make it circumvention.

IMO, the only way it becomes circumvention is if NYR and SJ executed the other components of the trade based on San Jose picking him up of waivers. If SJ's waiver claim of the player is used as 'past considerations' for another trade, then the PA would have a case for circumvention.

In reality, this would be a tough case to prove, because no GM is stupid enough to go on record that they another trade based on the waiver activity. But if we get to the draft and the Rangers trade pick #30 to the Sharks for pick #42 with no other assets included, then the PA would have a very good case that obviously this was the other components of the Goodrow trade That is so obviously a trade that the Rangers would never make in a vacuum and it would be painfully clear that such a deal was a direct result of San Jose picking up Goodrow on waivers.

In that example, I think that the PA absolutely wins a grievance that this waiver activity circumvented his NTC. But unless San Jose is at some point rewarded by the Rangers for the claim, then it isn't circumvention. What will get really interesting is if the Rangers and Sharks make a multi-asset trade at the draft that looks one-sided in San Jose's favor but can be plausibly defended as a standalone deal by the Rangers. But unless that happens, Goodrow is going to have to eat this one and go to San Jose if he wants to get paid the remainder of his contract.

They would have to be Jack Quinn stupid to get busted.

 

[joe galiba]

They would have to be Jack Quinn stupid to get busted.

mentioning him made me throw up in my mouth

 

[Davimir Tarablad]

Looks like Toronto is working on a Marner Extension

That’d be hilarious given how many Leafs fans/media are trying to run him out of town

 

[Drubilly]

NSFW or children (language)

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Congratulations to Cogliano for a super solid career!!

 

[ChicagoBlues]

I’ve been keeping an eye on Dallas.

Pavs retired. Dellandrea was just traded.
It is quite possible that Seguin has surgery and starts the season on LTIR. If he doesn’t, then the Stars will have a diminished Seguin. Duchene is willing to take a discount to stay in Dallas, but his age is a concern and his postseason was not good. Tanev is attracting lots of attention with a price tag that Dallas cannot affford. Suter was being unprofessional and selfish during the playoffs when he refused to play his offside. Everyone else agreed to do that. They might be stuck with him, but buying out the final year is what they want to do. Faksa needs to go to clear cap. There is more.

They have problems.

 

[Brian39]

I’ve been keeping an eye on Dallas.

They have problems.

I see the same type of smaller/secondary problems that most top 10 teams have when they are in a Cup window. Pavs had a great regular season but was a shell of himself in the playoffs. Dellandrea was healthy scratched in 13 of 19 playoff games. I don't think they'll have an issue moving Faksa if that is how they want to clear some cap as he plays an absurd shutdown role and is effective in that role. He is exactly the type of guy teams love to have if they can make the cap work.

Ultimately, most of the problems/decisions involve guys who quickly become secondary/expendable players in the playoffs.

They had 12 guys put up 5+ playoff points this year. 10 of them are under contract next season (Johnston, Heiskanen, Robertson, Benn, Seguin, Stankoven, Hintz, Dadonov, Lindell, Marchment). 1 is an RFA (Steel) and then Duchene is a UFA. Otter had a middling regular season, but was every bit the #1 guy they expected in the playoffs. He is under contract too.

Harley didn't have the playoff production to make the top 12 production list, but he played very well otherwise and logged big minutes. He is an RFA without arbitration rights who will certainly be back.

We'll see what they do about Duchene/Tanev/Suter, but they currently have $16.2M in cap space to fill 10 roster spots, so it isn't like they have no money. The prospect pool has thinned with the graduation of Stankoven/Johnston, but they still have a handful of intriguing prospects who can likely start contributing as cheap bottom of the lineup guys. Bourque is a near lock to be a cheap NHL forward next year. I expect one of the young D will get a shot as a bottom pair guy. They have some cheap internal options to allow them the space to extend/replace Duchene/Tanev.

I really don't see problems. I see a top 5 team returning the bulk of its core, which contains multiple young players who have plenty of room to keep improving. Almost all the cap/retiree casualties are guys who underperformed in the playoffs. They very well may not be the 113 point team they were this year, but they should comfortably make the playoffs and they still have all the ingredients of a contender.

Here are the lines from their last game, using question marks in place of guys who are no longer in the organization (including pending UFAs)

Robertson-Hintz-Seguin
Benn-Johnston-Stankoven
Marchment-???-???
Bourque-Steel-Dadonov

Lindell-Heiskanen
Harley-???
Suter-???

Otter
???

I see two damn good top 6 lines, a good 4th line, a damn good top pair, half of a damn good 2nd pair, and a legit starter. And they have $16M to replace a 3rd line that struggled in the playoffs, extend/replace Tanev, and fill in the rest. I'd wager that Bourque will get a nice long audition as one of those top 9 forward question marks.

I don't really see a problem. A couple hard decisions that can impact the future, but not problems.

 

[stl76]

Suter was being unprofessional and selfish during the playoffs when he refused to play his offside. Everyone else agreed to do that. They might be stuck with him, but buying out the final year is what they want to do.

Didn’t know this happened, was it widely reported?

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Didn’t know this happened, was it widely reported?

No, it wasn't widely reported, but I've been keeping tabs on Dallas.

@Brian39, decent argument, but Seguin is not healthy. Elevating Stankoven to the 2nd line after only 43 games and relying on him is a major risk. Mavs' trajectory is promising, but expectations need to be checked. Benn has already slowed down and will be another year older. They have a great top-pairing D, but so what? What about the rest of their abysmal situation on defense? They have 3 guys. That's it. Otherwise, Steel is a keeper and we shall see about Daddy.

But the most salient point in your post is "in a Cup window".

Expect them to bring in someone like Mantha or Arvidsson. Will Carrier is rumored, but that means Faksa has to go. It's not as rosy as people think it is over there.

Do not fear the Dallas Stars.

 

[mk80]

In Coyotes news today… the land auction that Alex Meruello was hoping/relying on winning next week has been cancelled.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1804241818663686606

 

[Blueston]

In Coyotes news today… the land auction that Alex Meruello was hoping/relying on winning next week has been cancelled.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1804241818663686606

So apparently they are now requiring Meruello to get special use permit from city before they sell him the land. I don’t know much beyond that, but this feels like the type of hurdle these clowns won’t be able to clear.

 

[stl76]

No, it wasn't widely reported, but I've been keeping tabs on Dallas.

Was it reported anywhere? Tried searching around but couldn’t find any news related to this.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Was it reported anywhere? Tried searching around but couldn’t find any news related to this.

Sorry, perhaps I shouldn't speak out of turn. There are Dallas Stars insiders and this insider said so. That ownership is pissed off at Suter. So, I should say, not reported at all. Locker room stuff that should not have escaped. This is from an insider who knows people in the organization.

Take that for what it's worth, plus there are, indeed, reports that Suter was gonna be bought out prior to last season.

 

[Blueston]

Sorry, perhaps I shouldn't speak out of turn. There are Dallas Stars insiders and this insider said so. That ownership is pissed off at Suter. So, I should say, not reported at all. Locker room stuff that should not have escaped. This is from an insider who knows people in the organization.

Take that for what it's worth, plus there are, indeed, reports that Suter was gonna be bought out prior to last season.

Perhaps this is true, but that doesn’t square with what has been reported. He has bad locker room rep from previous stops but that isn’t what Stars reporters have been saying, at least from what I have seen. Sense has been that Deboer liked and trusted him so he overplayed Suter even though his legs are about done.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Perhaps this is true, but that doesn’t square with what has been reported. He has bad locker room rep from previous stops but that isn’t what Stars reporters have been saying, at least from what I have seen. Sense has been that Deboer liked and trusted him so he overplayed Suter even though his legs are about done.

Totally fair.

EDIT: Looks like Seguin and Hintz will not need surgery. This matters in the calculus.

 

[STL fan in MN]

In Coyotes news today… the land auction that Alex Meruello was hoping/relying on winning next week has been cancelled.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1804241818663686606

This is truly shocking they’ve hit another hurdle.

 

[Brian39]

@Brian39, decent argument, but Seguin is not healthy.

He was clearly playing through an injury, but you're acting like there is a known degenerative or career ending issue. We're 3 weeks out from them being eliminated with no indication that he has some massive issue to deal with. He's 32, not 37. Like a lot of yor stances on guys, it feels like you are taking the worst case scenario and accepting it as a given.

Elevating Stankoven to the 2nd line after only 43 games and relying on him is a major risk.

Not elevating, repeating. He was 6th in even strength minutes per game in the playoffs and got a surprising amount of defensive usage against surprisingly top competition. His 6 most-faced opponents in the playoffs were MacKinnon, Lehkonen, Hyman, McDavid, Eichel, and Hertl. He wasn't sheltered at all and went +6 at 5 on 5 with good underlying numbers.

He could take a step back, but this isn't 'can he do more?' It is putting him in the same role he excelled in against the league's best.

Mavs' trajectory is promising, but expectations need to be checked.

The expectation is complimentary 3rd liner in his age 23 season after being the AHL leading scorer in his age 22 season. I don't think that expectation needs to be checked at all. I don't expect him to set the world on fire. I expect him to be the 3rd piece of a good 3rd line that has at least one 50+ point guy on it.

Benn has already slowed down and will be another year older.

And will be in a role that reflects that.

They have a great top-pairing D, but so what? What about the rest of their abysmal situation on defense? They have 3 guys.

Agree to disagree that an elite top pair is meaningless. And whether it is Tanev or using some of that $16M on a different guy, the 2nd pair is shaping up to be very good as well.

I think the bottom pair will likely be their biggest weakness, but that is a pretty common achilles heal and something that can be addressed at the deadline.

If I were them, I'd try to shed some cap and re-work the bottom of the lineup, but I very much disagree that it isn't rosy there. Pretty much your entire analysis is based on multiple guys hitting the cliff due to age AND the young guys all regressing. That's possible, but I think it is far from the most likely scenario. They are in a low tax, warm state and are viewed as a contender league-wide. They will be able to attract talent or trade for guys with no-trade lists. They are far from a finished product and aren't in a real cap crunch.

Things are pretty rosy.

 

[Blueston]

He was clearly playing through an injury, but you're acting like there is a known degenerative or career ending issue. We're 3 weeks out from them being eliminated with no indication that he has some massive issue to deal with. He's 32, not 37. Like a lot of yor stances on guys, it feels like you are taking the worst case scenario and accepting it as a given.

Not elevating, repeating. He was 6th in even strength minutes per game in the playoffs and got a surprising amount of defensive usage against surprisingly top competition. His 6 most-faced opponents in the playoffs were MacKinnon, Lehkonen, Hyman, McDavid, Eichel, and Hertl. He wasn't sheltered at all and went +6 at 5 on 5 with good underlying numbers.

He could take a step back, but this isn't 'can he do more?' It is putting him in the same role he excelled in against the league's best.


The expectation is complimentary 3rd liner in his age 23 season after being the AHL leading scorer in his age 22 season. I don't think that expectation needs to be checked at all. I don't expect him to set the world on fire. I expect him to be the 3rd piece of a good 3rd line that has at least one 50+ point guy on it.


And will be in a role that reflects that.


Agree to disagree that an elite top pair is meaningless. And whether it is Tanev or using some of that $16M on a different guy, the 2nd pair is shaping up to be very good as well.

I think the bottom pair will likely be their biggest weakness, but that is a pretty common achilles heal and something that can be addressed at the deadline.

If I were them, I'd try to shed some cap and re-work the bottom of the lineup, but I very much disagree that it isn't rosy there. Pretty much your entire analysis is based on multiple guys hitting the cliff due to age AND the young guys all regressing. That's possible, but I think it is far from the most likely scenario.

Yeah, is there anyone in the West better positioned than the Stars for next couple years? Maybe Oilers just because of McDavid, but everyone else still has major questions/holes. Obviously, team like Avs or Canucks or whomever may pass Dallas, but agree with you that is rather odd to spotlight Stars as particularly vulnerable.

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

In Coyotes news today… the land auction that Alex Meruello was hoping/relying on winning next week has been cancelled.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1804241818663686606

Worst case scenario he's just going to pocket his tidy proceeds for selling the team to Utah. I'm shocked, SHOCKED, that the real estate plan for Merullo is hitting snags. He seems to have no local goodwill, and no allies in the government. I think there is a pretty viable path for a team in Phoenix succeeding, but not so sure its possible if he's driving it.

Yeah, is there anyone in the West better positioned than the Stars for next couple years? Maybe Oilers just because of McDavid, but everyone else still has major questions/holes. Obviously, team like Avs or Canucks or whomever may pass Dallas, but agree with you that is rather odd to spotlight Stars as particularly vulnerable.

Its a really good time to become a Utah fan. They've got such a war chest of young talent and picks. They're going to shift into a growth mode and probably be a really rewarding team to watch. When they make the playoffs next, the city is going to explode in support.

The dark cloud that was present in Arizona wasn't completely obvious to me until I saw how positive the reception was at the SLC airports and the arena. For a team that has been in a losing funk, its not always this easy to flush the team culture and start fresh, but this franchise just got a chance to hit the rest button.

I'm not saying they'll be contenders in the next 2 years, just that they will be ascendant.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

@Brian39 This point-by-point is based on a mischaracterization of my post. In other words, there are many ways to interpret anything.

You see them as rosy and I do not. Cool.

Saul Goodman.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Yes!!!! Henrique was a great pickup!! He and Janmark play well together.