Around the League - PLAYOFFS!?

[Menzinger]

i am always amused by this.


The thing is - i remember everyone thought that the years/term that Hyman signed for in was really not worthwhile with his injury history.

I will never understand why people can't just be happy former players here are doing well, without being "well you know if they were here we'd be amazing." life doesn't work like that.

People thrive on negativity, unfortunately. Almost nobody's morning the loss of Verhaeghe (or Cody Ceci lol) because it's not nearly as sensational.

If Hyman gets to hold the cup I'll cheer for him even though I'd likely prefer the Oilers lose

 

[notbias]

Hyman is the perfect playoff style player.. He plays physical, he wins puck battles for his linemates, he lives in the blue paint, occupying defenders and screening the goalie and scores greasy goals because he gives 100% effort every shift.

Except when he was here.

Past Toronto management wasn't smart enough to play him on the PP because they invest 1/2 their Cap in the Core 4 and then come playoff time they can't figure out why their PP goes cold.

Wrong like usual.

Unfortunately, under your beloved Lou/Babcock, he got less PP time than when they spent 1/2 the cap on the core 4.

Zach Hyman has 11 PP goals this playoff season alone. The entire Leafs team scored 12 goals total this years playoffs and they most games they every one in a season is 5 while Hyman has 5 GWG including series deciding goals to advance his team.

Now you've just started lying to try to prove a point...

Feel free to check the GWG too.

Everyone is so protective of a small soft perimeter player like Marner who had 1 goal and 3 points when the Leafs as a team would be so much better with a team full of blue collar hard working players like Hyman . Heck former Leaf Connor Brown has as many SH points this year as Marner had points total. Even more shocking is Leaf fans want Marner extended to pay him potentiality $12 mil when players making $5 mil or less feast in the playoffs.

Now we are bringing up a player who has been a healthy scratch for parts of the playoffs as someone we miss?

This whole post is a Mess...

 

[ruaware41]

I don't think he can let this go rn. I just ignore it even though it's some serious revisionist history. man needs to vent to let it go even though he's way off. When Hyman says he wanted to stay but Toronto didn't want him and Edmonton did I think he's playing with the truth there. For some reason I highly doubt he wasn't offered a contract. He probably just wasn't offered what he was looking for. At the time it was an over payment, later he proved himself.

 

[Daisy Jane]

Hyman and Kadri are the salt in the wound. All the hopeful gritty guys gone in trades etc. Often for nothing because of NuSoftHockey.

no it's not. again, to me everyone is looking at how Hyman is performing now - and not remembering how most people on the forums was bashing the poor guy because most times he did the wrap around thing, and he was glued to Matthews's side. but then we saw how clutch he was with gwg's etc. and that was nice. and then he was a UFA and he priced himself out of town.. almost EVERYONE here was like we wouldn't mind Hyman to come back. then we saw what Edmonton paid for him and considering his injury history everyone went eww. that was not very good. Let's not rewrite history now. (I will give credit where it is due - if you weren't one of those people then that's fair)

I said it then, and I'll say it now. Kadri was a dunderhead when we needed him not to be. he took two dumb penalties. which got him suspended twice (and i don't want to hear about how Parros is mean to the Leafs bleh blegh). they were dirty hits. I also said i feel that while i like Kadri - a trade like that was good for him because I feel it allowed him to grow up a bit more (and he was slotted a bit more accurately for his skill set and his other agitator ways). What these guys are doing now they weren't doing then. a bit of it is just maturity (which is why w/some players you simply just have to be patient) - and some of it is they are just hearing a different voice, or they are slotted differently.

I'm sorry (and i just saw the Chris Johnson post and i just roll my eyes). ALL OF THESE PEOPLE were saying that it would have been stupid to sign Hyman to those dollars. now it's "the worst mistake the Leafs could ever done?" and these are the same people who are bleating "let's get rid of Marner." (please note I don't give a crap. i was saying trade Marner or Nylander years ago. acknowleding that they would be great but we needed to get someone great back). and if they go and put up god tier numbers and they win a cup. they aren't going to say "well yeah the Leafs needed to do that." they're going to say "the Leafs were stupid to trade Mitch Marner."

again. Be happy that former players that were here, are doing well. I will get mad at the leafs for a LOT of things but i am not going to get mad at them for not giving a bad contract [seen at the time] with a bad term [seen at the time] to a player who HAD injury issues and hadn't broken out the way he has NOW (because he's healthy). if Hyman had several more injuries and a chronic knee issue everyone would be LOLing at Edmonton for doing another dumb contact and we all know it.

 

[Bomber0104]

Hyman continuing to put more egg on the face of Dubas, forcing him to kiss his proverbial arse just like Kadri...

Things like this are what make sports hilariously fun, there has to always be a totally incompetent donkey who's the butt of everyone's jokes that no one should take seriously at all, and it definitely seems like Dubas has achieved that in such a short career.

The hits just keep on coming

 

[Bomber0104]

I don't think he can let this go rn. I just ignore it even though it's some serious revisionist history. man needs to vent to let it go even though he's way off. When Hyman says he wanted to stay but Toronto didn't want him and Edmonton did I think he's playing with the truth there. For some reason I highly doubt he wasn't offered a contract. He probably just wasn't offered what he was looking for. At the time it was an over payment, later he proved himself.

Yes, very shocking that people are talking about the Leafs letting a player go for nothing (with intent) who went on to score 70 goals between regular and more importantly deep post-season play for his next team...

Spoiler alert, if he hoists the Cup on Monday it'll get talked about even more for a lifetime to come.

 

[baton elevated]

no it's not. again, to me everyone is looking at how Hyman is performing now - and not remembering how most people on the forums was bashing the poor guy because most times he did the wrap around thing, and he was glued to Matthews's side. but then we saw how clutch he was with gwg's etc. and that was nice. and then he was a UFA and he priced himself out of town.. almost EVERYONE here was like we wouldn't mind Hyman to come back. then we saw what Edmonton paid for him and considering his injury history everyone went eww. that was not very good. Let's not rewrite history now. (I will give credit where it is due - if you weren't one of those people then that's fair)

I said it then, and I'll say it now. Kadri was a dunderhead when we needed him not to be. he took two dumb penalties. which got him suspended twice (and i don't want to hear about how Parros is mean to the Leafs bleh blegh). they were dirty hits. I also said i feel that while i like Kadri - a trade like that was good for him because I feel it allowed him to grow up a bit more (and he was slotted a bit more accurately for his skill set and his other agitator ways). What these guys are doing now they weren't doing then. a bit of it is just maturity (which is why w/some players you simply just have to be patient) - and some of it is they are just hearing a different voice, or they are slotted differently.

I'm sorry (and i just saw the Chris Johnson post and i just roll my eyes). ALL OF THESE PEOPLE were saying that it would have been stupid to sign Hyman to those dollars. now it's "the worst mistake the Leafs could ever done?" and these are the same people who are bleating "let's get rid of Marner." (please note I don't give a crap. i was saying trade Marner or Nylander years ago. acknowleding that they would be great but we needed to get someone great back). and if they go and put up god tier numbers and they win a cup. they aren't going to say "well yeah the Leafs needed to do that." they're going to say "the Leafs were stupid to trade Mitch Marner."

again. Be happy that former players that were here, are doing well. I will get mad at the leafs for a LOT of things but i am not going to get mad at them for not giving a bad contract [seen at the time] with a bad term [seen at the time] to a player who HAD injury issues and hadn't broken out the way he has NOW (because he's healthy). if Hyman had several more injuries and a chronic knee issue everyone would be LOLing at Edmonton for doing another dumb contact and we all know it.

Good read Daisey.
I recall when Hyman was here and like you stated he was getting raked. I stood up for him. I said give me 10 Hymans and you puck your leaf picks . Guess which team would win ha ha.

 

[baton elevated]

It will be an interesting final. Odds would dictate the Panthers should win.
1) Home ice
2) they have lost 3 in a row, due for a rebound game.
3) Oiler's intensity should be tiring them out. Can't play like that without it taking a pound of flesh.
4) Have the Panthers list 4 in a row this year?
5) Feels like a set up game, expect the unexpected.
The MoMo is a b!tch though, once you have it or lose it, it can go a long way.

 

[Al14]

my guy I think you are stuck on the semantics of it. Nylander still sat his ass out until he churned every bit of gold from the gold mine he was after.

Exactly, Nylander withheld his services by NOT SIGNING a new contract.

Like it or not, it was a HOLDOUT on his part until he got what HE WANTED, or UNTIL he would no longer be eligible to play that season.

It was described as a HOLDOUT in every written media I read.

 

[Bomber0104]

Exactly, Nylander withheld his services by NOT SIGNING a new contract.

Like it or not, it was a HOLDOUT on his part until he got what HE WANTED, or UNTIL he would no longer be eligible to play that season.

It was described as a HOLDOUT in every written media I read.

Yup he held out signing a reasonable contract and missed half the season only to end up signing an ever-so-slightly unreasonable contract on the last possible day in December. Proceeded to play like total ass the remainder of the year and then scored on his own net in the playoffs against Boston.

If you're a hockey player that craves winning, sitting out would probably affect you to the point you just sign the contract that gets the deal done and you can get on with training camp with the team.

No, not this cat.

All money, f*** the team.

Disgustingly selfish behavior and paved the way for the next two to run roughshod over that idiot GM we had.

And why wouldn't they when they knowing how badly our management blew the most basic of RFA signings?

 

[ULF_55]

View attachment 885820

This year, Hyman became just the seventh Oiler in franchise history to score 50+ goals this past season and is currently leading the playoffs with 16 goals.

He's wrong.
HOF for Kurvers.

 

[ULF_55]

Exactly, Nylander withheld his services by NOT SIGNING a new contract.

Like it or not, it was a HOLDOUT on his part until he got what HE WANTED, or UNTIL he would no longer be eligible to play that season.

It was described as a HOLDOUT in every written media I read.

Leafs locked him out by not offering a contract he could sign.

 

[Gabriel426]

i am always amused by this.


The thing is - i remember everyone thought that the years/term that Hyman signed for in was really not worthwhile with his injury history.

I will never understand why people can't just be happy former players here are doing well, without being "well you know if they were here we'd be amazing." life doesn't work like that.

I think partly bc Hyman is playing really well as he is part of the reason why Oilers is in their position.
Partly bc some want to trash Dubas
Partly bc Hyman is exactly the type of playoffs player that the Leafs lacked.

Most of all, people are just frustrated with the lack of success our core had collectively and individually in the playoffs. Which lead to people getting mad at MGT for betting on the wrong players…. Esp when they compare Hyman stats to our 10mil plus boys stats.

As I said, Hyman will never have his stats now if he stays on the Leafs but his compete level, grit and his intangibles are sorely missed among our top forwards.

 

[Gabriel426]

no it's not. again, to me everyone is looking at how Hyman is performing now - and not remembering how most people on the forums was bashing the poor guy because most times he did the wrap around thing, and he was glued to Matthews's side. but then we saw how clutch he was with gwg's etc. and that was nice. and then he was a UFA and he priced himself out of town.. almost EVERYONE here was like we wouldn't mind Hyman to come back. then we saw what Edmonton paid for him and considering his injury history everyone went eww. that was not very good. Let's not rewrite history now. (I will give credit where it is due - if you weren't one of those people then that's fair)

I said it then, and I'll say it now. Kadri was a dunderhead when we needed him not to be. he took two dumb penalties. which got him suspended twice (and i don't want to hear about how Parros is mean to the Leafs bleh blegh). they were dirty hits. I also said i feel that while i like Kadri - a trade like that was good for him because I feel it allowed him to grow up a bit more (and he was slotted a bit more accurately for his skill set and his other agitator ways). What these guys are doing now they weren't doing then. a bit of it is just maturity (which is why w/some players you simply just have to be patient) - and some of it is they are just hearing a different voice, or they are slotted differently.

I'm sorry (and i just saw the Chris Johnson post and i just roll my eyes). ALL OF THESE PEOPLE were saying that it would have been stupid to sign Hyman to those dollars. now it's "the worst mistake the Leafs could ever done?" and these are the same people who are bleating "let's get rid of Marner." (please note I don't give a crap. i was saying trade Marner or Nylander years ago. acknowleding that they would be great but we needed to get someone great back). and if they go and put up god tier numbers and they win a cup. they aren't going to say "well yeah the Leafs needed to do that." they're going to say "the Leafs were stupid to trade Mitch Marner."

again. Be happy that former players that were here, are doing well. I will get mad at the leafs for a LOT of things but i am not going to get mad at them for not giving a bad contract [seen at the time] with a bad term [seen at the time] to a player who HAD injury issues and hadn't broken out the way he has NOW (because he's healthy). if Hyman had several more injuries and a chronic knee issue everyone would be LOLing at Edmonton for doing another dumb contact and we all know it.

But most people appreciate Hyman but he was misused on the 1st line.

I think a lot of people are trashing Leafs Hyman only to try to win the argument for those stating Hyman is a better playoff performer than our guys.

 

[hockeyes]

Yup he held out signing a reasonable contract and missed half the season only to end up signing an ever-so-slightly unreasonable contract on the last possible day in December. Proceeded to play like total ass the remainder of the year and then scored on his own net in the playoffs against Boston.

If you're a hockey player that craves winning, sitting out would probably affect you to the point you just sign the contract that gets the deal done and you can get on with training camp with the team.

No, not this cat.

All money, f*** the team.

Disgustingly selfish behavior and paved the way for the next two to run roughshod over that idiot GM we had.

And why wouldn't they when they knowing how badly our management blew the most basic of RFA signings?

Yup he held out signing a reasonable contract and missed half the season only to end up signing an ever-so-slightly unreasonable contract on the last possible day in December. Proceeded to play like total ass the remainder of the year and then scored on his own net in the playoffs against Boston.

If you're a hockey player that craves winning, sitting out would probably affect you to the point you just sign the contract that gets the deal done and you can get on with training camp with the team.

No, not this cat.

All money, f*** the team.

Disgustingly selfish behavior and paved the way for the next two to run roughshod over that idiot GM we had.

And why wouldn't they when they knowing how badly our management blew the most basic of RFA signings?

Blaming Nylander for Marner and Mathews being all about money is an.. interesting take.

Nylander steps up more than those two every year so obviously they do not follow in his footsteps. Is he overpaid? Of course, everyone on this team is, but he does elevate while the others do not.

 

[weems]

If EDM wins, you really have to give them props and especially to their head coach.
Watching EDM over the McDavid years, I was never impressed with the quality of hockey they played. Sore of like us, tons of skill but very lazy, tons of stretchs being poor defensively, would rather play in a 6-4, 5-4 game than a tight 2-1 playoff style matchup.

Seeing how dominant they've been under Knoblauch makes me think we should have fired Keefe sooner, even if he's a decent coach or wasn't fully to blame. Sometimes you just need a new voice or a different coach that brings a different system or wants to implement a different culture.

 

[thewave]

But most people appreciate Hyman but he was misused on the 1st line.

I think a lot of people are trashing Leafs Hyman only to try to win the argument for those stating Hyman is a better playoff performer than our guys.

People liked Hyman because he went after the puck and played right here. Sure he was not this 50 goal scorer but of we had him today he would still be getting us the puck and not doing a Mitch Marner and avoiding the corner.

 

[thewave]

no it's not. again, to me everyone is looking at how Hyman is performing now - and not remembering how most people on the forums was bashing the poor guy because most times he did the wrap around thing, and he was glued to Matthews's side. but then we saw how clutch he was with gwg's etc. and that was nice. and then he was a UFA and he priced himself out of town.. almost EVERYONE here was like we wouldn't mind Hyman to come back. then we saw what Edmonton paid for him and considering his injury history everyone went eww. that was not very good. Let's not rewrite history now. (I will give credit where it is due - if you weren't one of those people then that's fair)

I said it then, and I'll say it now. Kadri was a dunderhead when we needed him not to be. he took two dumb penalties. which got him suspended twice (and i don't want to hear about how Parros is mean to the Leafs bleh blegh). they were dirty hits. I also said i feel that while i like Kadri - a trade like that was good for him because I feel it allowed him to grow up a bit more (and he was slotted a bit more accurately for his skill set and his other agitator ways). What these guys are doing now they weren't doing then. a bit of it is just maturity (which is why w/some players you simply just have to be patient) - and some of it is they are just hearing a different voice, or they are slotted differently.

I'm sorry (and i just saw the Chris Johnson post and i just roll my eyes). ALL OF THESE PEOPLE were saying that it would have been stupid to sign Hyman to those dollars. now it's "the worst mistake the Leafs could ever done?" and these are the same people who are bleating "let's get rid of Marner." (please note I don't give a crap. i was saying trade Marner or Nylander years ago. acknowleding that they would be great but we needed to get someone great back). and if they go and put up god tier numbers and they win a cup. they aren't going to say "well yeah the Leafs needed to do that." they're going to say "the Leafs were stupid to trade Mitch Marner."

again. Be happy that former players that were here, are doing well. I will get mad at the leafs for a LOT of things but i am not going to get mad at them for not giving a bad contract [seen at the time] with a bad term [seen at the time] to a player who HAD injury issues and hadn't broken out the way he has NOW (because he's healthy). if Hyman had several more injuries and a chronic knee issue everyone would be LOLing at Edmonton for doing another dumb contact and we all know it.

I don't remember disliking Hyman. He was solid at hockey fundamentals and got us the puck often. He is a player that you can rely on in the playoffs. Forget his shockingly amazing season. I can discard it and still say we need a player like this right now over here.

I didn't dislike Kadri ever. He was playing on a whimpified core and got completely gaslit into those suspension by blatant dirty reffing. He was a battler when you put him with strong wingers. Another type of player we need now.

Dubas went on to take all of the testosterone out of the room until the failures piled up. At that point he started trading futures and assets like a man about to lose his job.

In summary. The Leafs seem to trade all the useful playoff players that have good chemistry because they lack the cap to bring them back. They have high turnover and as a result lack chemistry. Top it off with having coach that was never deserving of his position here. Not the best or the brightest.

It was an organizational shitshow.

 

[ToneDog]

If EDM wins, you really have to give them props and especially to their head coach.
Watching EDM over the McDavid years, I was never impressed with the quality of hockey they played. Sore of like us, tons of skill but very lazy, tons of stretchs being poor defensively, would rather play in a 6-4, 5-4 game than a tight 2-1 playoff style matchup.

Seeing how dominant they've been under Knoblauch makes me think we should have fired Keefe sooner, even if he's a decent coach or wasn't fully to blame. Sometimes you just need a new voice or a different coach that brings a different system or wants to implement a different culture.

McDavid - it is cup or bust this year -go ahead and doubt us

Now compare that what our whiny stars say and do

You cannot build a house on stilts. McDavid and Draisaitl are pillars. We have stilts.

 

[weems]

McDavid - it is cup or bust this year -go ahead and doubt us

Now compare that what our whiny stars say and do

You cannot build a house on stilts. McDavid and Draisaitl are pillars. We have stilts.

Will be interesting to see how they play/act under Berube.

 

[Fogelhund]

But most people appreciate Hyman but he was misused on the 1st line.

I think a lot of people are trashing Leafs Hyman only to try to win the argument for those stating Hyman is a better playoff performer than our guys.

Hyman might have one of the highest hockey IQ’s, to make things work for him, and continue to have better performances at his age. He’s a very likable guy, and I’m happy for his successes.

He’s also a guy who had 5 points in his last 19 playoff games with us. He had knee issues. He wanted a NMC. He was paid more than it appeared he'd be worth. Players don't normally peak at 30/31 years old, that's completely out of the norm.

Of course, those who feel a need to air their grievances, and how they were personally hurt by prior management, are going to go off on this opportunity.

WIth hindsight, they should have kept him, for sure. But where he was, at the time of UFA.. it's easy to see why they passed on him.

As others have mentioned, it's funny to see the flip flops here though... how our team has been mismanaged, because we didn't build a team like Florida... and now that we are at a point where Florida might not be the blueprint suddenly... it's Hyman... I wonder where the anger gets directed next, if Florida miraculously comes back from the dead??

 

[Peasy]

Does anyone honestly think Hyman would be having anywhere near the same success if he was with Matthews instead of McDavid?

This is the Chris Kunitz effect. There is not a better situation that Hyman could be in right now.

 

[Daisy Jane]

As others have mentioned, it's funny to see the flip flops here though... how our team has been mismanaged, because we didn't build a team like Florida... and now that we are at a point where Florida might not be the blueprint suddenly... it's Hyman... I wonder where the anger gets directed next, if Florida miraculously comes back from the dead??

it will still be the same - but it will be back to goaltending.
I honestly forgot how tiring it can be here sometimes. I don't mind the one hill you wanna die on (I have my hills here) but it's just this collective mindset of this is horrible. or people have this one big view of what "tough hockey" is. a few years ago I remember (because i was actually surprised). - that the leafs were outhitting and just being super physical against Boston and Tampa. like back to back years, and series. they were holding their own. and still it was grumble grumble rumble. like even when the Leafs are physical a lot of people here can't acknowledge it

i'm not going to dismiss the fact that the team needs to have more "yes, I will eff you up this evening." factor to it. and as a total team mentality, the team needs to have this. "yes we can lose 2 in a row. but it has to be a comedy of errors for us to lose the third." aspect to it.

but i remember when a lot of people here were begging for high ended drafted talent. now people are complaining that we have no gritty players and we have too much talent and we need to get rid of all of it and we should have overpaid. [at the time] to keep the playoff grit that wasn't even that CONSISTENT here with us.

I am not sitting here saying i wouldn't make changes when/if the opportunity arose. but i firmly believe that a lot of the teams issues is mental HOPEFULLY Berube can change that with some new additions to the team. they have to want to do it and I think it starts with the regular season and basically benching people for being all rinky-dinky. (yes including Matthews). because it really seems to me that a lot of people won't be happy until the team turns back to what it looked liked in 2014. (which was total and utter crap btw).

 

[Nineteen67]

Does anyone honestly think Hyman would be having anywhere near the same success if he was with Matthews instead of McDavid?

This is the Chris Kunitz effect. There is not a better situation that Hyman could be in right now.

No, but he’d still be big, fast, and tenacious.

 

[Nineteen67]

McDavid - it is cup or bust this year -go ahead and doubt us

Now compare that what our whiny stars say and do

You cannot build a house on stilts. McDavid and Draisaitl are pillars. We have stilts.

They all say it’s Cup or bust. McDavid has elevated his play, they caught lightning, and are on a Cinderella run….

Crosby and McDavid are generational and the only two active players that could win a Cup despite their roster.
Not saying they don’t have help, but you replace McDavid with any player on the planet right now and we’re already in the off season.