GDT: Around the League - 2021/22

[ToneDog]

What mess did he leave here? Marleau and Zaitsev? Marleau would of worked itself out had a little patience been applied.

That leaves one fringe top 4/bottom pair d on a bad but not terrible contract.

Some mess.

Edit: Throw Martin in there too if you want.

Yeah thinking the same here. Lou left a 105 point team. I guess that and Matty, Nylander, and Marner and AJ, Kappy, Brown, Hyman, Kadri, Rielly and Andy on good deals was not enough. Lou was kind enough to take Martin back though.

 

[Stephen]

Weird take considering they're coming off b2b ECF appearances. One being a game 7 vs arguably the best cup winner of the cap era.

Does two years of playoff success sound like a five year window moving forward?

 

[TMLegend]

Does two years of playoff success sound like a five year window moving forward?

How many teams have had a 7 year window where they're legitimate cup contenders?

P.S It's a short list.

 

[3blizzard4]

That sounds like a healthy obsession unlike some others.

I think a lot of fans are in the same boat but don't want to admit it. The dislike for other teams is not so much the players as it is their fans.

 

[Stephen]

How many teams have had a 7 year window where they're legitimate cup contenders?

P.S It's a short list.

And the Islanders are falling out of contention by Year 4 of Lou's era. What's weird about that?

 

[BallardEra]

Was just looking at the scoring leaders.

I don’t see anyone else being able to compete for the AR this season against the Oilers duo.

 

[TMLegend]

And the Islanders are falling out of contention by Year 4 of Lou's era. What's weird about that?

I just think it's weird you've set an arbitrary time period of 7 years. When most contending windows are only a few years at best. This is after saying you've been predicting their decline since a year and half ago. Seems odd, like you're biased or have a dislike of the Islanders in general.

Also, way too early to be writing the Islanders off.

 

[zeke]

Yep. Like trading a first round pick to get rid of an expiring contract.

you mean like signing a 39yr old to an untradeable big money 3yr deal.

 

[ToneDog]

Was just looking at the scoring leaders.

I don’t see anyone else being able to compete for the AR this season against the Oilers duo.

When I looked at the standings this morning I couldn't believe that as good as Soupy has been we are +3 in goals differential. Also the Flames have given up 9 fewer goals than the Leafs in 1 fewer games and are +23 in goals differential.

 

[BallardEra]

When I looked at the standings this morning I couldn't believe that as good as Soupy has been we are +3 in goals differential. Also the Flames have given up 9 fewer goals than the Leafs in 1 fewer games and are +23 in goals differential.

Yes I can’t understand how few goals the Leafs have scored so far this season.

 

[Stephen]

I just think it's weird you've set an arbitrary time period of 7 years. When most contending windows are only a few years at best. This is after saying you've been predicting their decline since a year and half ago. Seems odd, like you're biased or have a dislike of the Islanders in general.

Also, way too early to be writing the Islanders off.

I think it's weird that we're on the same about the Islanders not having the horses to be a long term contender, but you want to nitpick timetables as if when the wheels fall off really matters. They don't have championship ability. Losing in the conference finals doesn't make you close just like Montreal going to finals makes them close. And that's the long and short of it.

 

[TMLegend]

I think it's weird that we're on the same about the Islanders not having the horses to be a long term contender, but you want to nitpick timetables as if when the wheels fall off really matters. They don't have championship ability. Losing in the conference finals doesn't make you close just like Montreal going to finals makes them close. And that's the long and short of it.

I'm not nitpicking anything. I just think your stance is absurd. From predicting the Isles downfall a 1.5 years ago to feeling vindicated now that they've started slow out of the gate this season.

At least for this season, I think they're a championship calibre team. I'd give them better odds to anybody not named Tampa or Vegas too.

 

[Stephen]

I'm not nitpicking anything. I just think your stance is absurd. From predicting the Isles downfall a 1.5 years ago to feeling vindicated now that they've started slow out of the gate this season.

At least for this season, I think they're a championship calibre team. I'd give them better odds to anybody not named Tampa or Vegas too.

Like I said. I think they're on a similar curve as the Fletcher/Burns Leafs in the 90s. That is a well coached veteran team that has the chemistry and intangibles bucket to make deep runs but not the natural talent to get over the ultimate hump vs teams that have the intangibles and the talent. What's more, that recipe relies on a very specific balance of players, chemistry and coaching and once you get too far away from the recipe it falls apart. That mix doesn't have a long shelf life.

This isn't a unique animal in hockey. You can look at Lou's recent history like the 2012 New Jersey Devils Or the 2014 New York Rangers, or the pre-rebuild Ottawa Senators. Unless you think guys like Bailey, Lee, Nelson, Pageau, Palimeri have unlimited upside year to year.

 

[Menzinger]

I've been predicting the downfall of the Islanders for a year and a half now and what I see as being critical to their two conference finals appearance is a total team buy in, chemistry and that veteran know how. Reminds me a lot of the Pat Burns Cliff Fletcher Leafs. You get a lot out of a group, but the more you make changes the more it dilutes the chemistry and balance that made you good in the first place. Look at guys like Toews, Eberle, Komarov, Boychuk, Greiss, Lehner all leaving. Things just change over time. Who knows, they might stabilize with their home stand and make another run, but I don't believe the Isles have the natural talent to be a 5 year contending team.

I think that's a fair point. When there's a fair amount of team turnover it will eventually mess with the chemistry, which could particularly make a team like the Isle's which seems to thrive on that cohesion vulnerable.

 

[Carltons Cup]

It's a good thing the Nucks have an expansion team in their division, otherwise they'd be scraping bottom.

Would give my left nut to hear Hughson now....

 

[BallardEra]

Ovechkin with #15 tonight.

Selanne had 48 as a 36 year old and no player 36 years or older has ever scored 50 in a season.

 

[deprw]

Yep. Like trading a first round pick to get rid of an expiring contract.

I think this is dead horse, but there was two options. Trade Kapanen, Johnson etc. from position of weakness or gut our d for year and rush Liljegren and Sandin or go with Marincin x 2 in third pair. We had Stanley Cup aspirations and having 6,25mil boat anchor on fourth line would have killed those.In both cases that would have been intermediate year for our cup hopes.

That off-season was curve ball Lou left Dubas. It would have been ok if Zaitsev would have lived up to his contract, but he didn't and asked for trade. Lou would have had that same problem and would have done something similar with Marleau or pissed away even more futures when trading away young talent as a cap dump.

 

[Dekes For Days]

What mess did he leave here?

An anchor in Marleau, an anchor in Zaitsev, a healthy scratched Martin making 2.5m, a depleted and unreplenished prospect pool, a bad defense, a toxic coach, a strained relationship between the team and its best players, an unsigned Nylander, a bunch of expiring depth, etc.

 

[uncleben]

An anchor in Marleau, an anchor in Zaitsev, a healthy scratched Martin making 2.5m, a depleted and unreplenished prospect pool, a bad defense, a toxic coach, a strained relationship between the team and its best players, an unsigned Nylander, a bunch of expiring depth, etc.

Any GM has a list like this going at anytime, honestly. Any outgoing GM is going to have loose ends, regrets and resentments, strained or faltering relations, etc. so it's not even a full knock on Lou. But to pretend he left us with nothing to fix is silly too.

 

[ACC1224]

Any GM has a list like this going at anytime, honestly. Any outgoing GM is going to have loose ends, regrets and resentments, strained or faltering relations, etc. so it's not even a full knock on Lou. But to pretend he left us with nothing to fix is silly too.

I think that's obvious but some of the issues time could have taken care of if not for the cap being maxed out.
Lots of blame to go around.

 

[Dekes For Days]

I think that's obvious but some of the issues time could have taken care of if not for the cap being maxed out.

Time wasn't fixing any issues. Dubas fixed the issues Lou left. Contenders utilize their cap space. We were #1 in the league in cap expenditures in 2017-2018 under Lou.

 

[zeke]

Any GM has a list like this going at anytime, honestly.

Not dubas.

 

[kb]

Time wasn't fixing any issues. Dubas fixed the messes Lou left. Contenders utilize their cap space.

LOL no kidding. Needed to be fixed, and fast.

"Dubas should have waited for Lou's anchor contracts to age out, and kept the draft picks, and traded all the good young players requiring raises instead."

 

[uncleben]

Not dubas.

Eh, you could point to a dearth of picks, a slightly concerning farm team (staff), some bigger (not big) money UFAs who have yet to make too much of an impact

I'm not too concerned with those right now, but every team has a least a couple of things that are suboptimal

 

[DraftSchmaft]

Yeah thinking the same here. Lou left a 105 point team. I guess that and Matty, Nylander, and Marner and AJ, Kappy, Brown, Hyman, Kadri, Rielly and Andy on good deals was not enough. Lou was kind enough to take Martin back though.

So what you're saying is Lou was handed a contender built on ELCs and team friendly contracts and basically sat on his ass instead of finding efficient finishing touches with all that cap room and second round picks to trade? Very poor showing by Lou to top this 105 point team off.

Lou did more harm than good to the Leafs and the poor Islanders are suffering the same fate now. It's just being masked by their two covid cup runs.

It's the same story there as it was here. Past management assembled majority of the team. I'm not crediting anyone for Matthews , you or me could roll out of bed and go make that selection for them.