Around the League 2018-2019 Part 2- Everyone is having fun except us

  • Xenforo Cloud will be upgrading us to version 2.3.5 on March 3rd at 12 AM GMT. This version has increased stability and fixes several bugs. We expect downtime for the duration of the update. The admin team will continue to work on existing issues, templates and upgrade all necessary available addons to minimize impact of this new version. Click Here for Updates
Status
Not open for further replies.
This is the correct answer.

It's the wrong way of thinking, but it's human nature.

The whole Forbort thing has just been such a disaster for this team. Trading up to draft him (1 pick before a star level player), watching his largely disappointing play in college where he never looked the part of a 1st round prospect to keeping him over players who turned out to be much better NHL players.

It really is shocking with how awful he has been basically from the moment the Kings drafted him that he is still here 9 years later, just very odd and unusual.

I will say that the season before the expansion draft he did show some improvement and at times even shades of why we might have drafted him. However, even watching the few games I saw at Minn-Duluth, I wondered why the hell we drafted him in the first place.
 
This is the correct answer.

It's the wrong way of thinking, but it's human nature.

The whole Forbort thing has just been such a disaster for this team. Trading up to draft him (1 pick before a star level player), watching his largely disappointing play in college where he never looked the part of a 1st round prospect to keeping him over players who turned out to be much better NHL players.

It really is shocking with how awful he has been basically from the moment the Kings drafted him that he is still here 9 years later, just very odd and unusual.

I think this is what it came down to.

I really hope they move him in some kind of deal. It's pretty apparent that he's not a good defender and while not a bust, he's just not a good fit with this team.

McNabb, while he has his own faults, seems to be the better of the two, including a tougher player around the net. I remember the term McBadd thrown around here quite often , so who know if they both would've been in the same boat had the players been switched.
 
Last edited:
Man, I love Frolov. Would have loved him to get a Cup here. Such a personality.


the only think I remember about his 'personality' is that he was one of the laziest players in Kings history. A whole lot of talent and not a whole lot of drive.
 
Go look at the 2010 draft, with the exception of maybe a handful of players (and 2 of them were russian), there isnt much to get excited for after Forbort was taken at 15th overall. That draft wasnt all that great.
 
  • Like
Reactions: KINGS17
I think this is what it came down to.


McNabb, while he has his own faults, seems to be the better of the two, including a tougher player around the net. I remember the term McBadd thrown around here quite often , so who know if they both would've been in the same boat had the players been switched.


I always appreciated McNabb's ability to literally take out opposing players with devastating (yet legal!) checks. He'd hit them and they'd then have to leave the game due to concussion protocol. That sort of "secret weapon" aspect of McNabb left me scratching my head when he wasn't protected in the expansion draft. Peeps make dumb decisions.......
 
Retaining McNabb over Forbort likely wouldn't have mattered. The Kings' record wouldn't change as a result of keeping McNabb. He's actually 5th in average ice time among Vegas defenders this season. The only dmen averaging less ice time than McNabb this season are Nick Holden and Jonathon Merrill.

The Kings would be in the same position they're in if McNabb was playing on the top pairing alongside Drew Doughty. As we've found out with Forbort, having a slow moving anchor on the blueline on your top pairing is just a recipe for disaster.
 
Go look at the 2010 draft, with the exception of maybe a handful of players (and 2 of them were russian), there isnt much to get excited for after Forbort was taken at 15th overall. That draft wasnt all that great.
I agree it wasn't that great. I went to the draft and everyone was disappointed the Ducks picked Emerson Etem ahead of the Kings pick. Dean traded to move up in the 1st round to get Forbort. That draft was largely a nothing burger. Some good players to be sure, but nothing earth shattering.
 
back then I wanted LA to protect both and deal Muzzin for Kapanen.

At the time some leafs fans were offering Kapanen + 1st for Muzzin and was getting crucified by some LA fans. I still wish that deal would have happened. However who the hell knows what would have happened to this team last year with no Muzizn but with Kap.
 
McNabb was never the same player after he was benched for a returning and completely washed up Matt Greene.

I had always kind of thought McNabb got overhyped by people here (best d-man not in the NHL), but even I can concede that he was maybe starting to turn a corner and boom Greene came back and Sutter sat him and literally he was never close to being that good again for the Kings.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DoktorJeep
McNabb was never the same player after he was benched for a returning and completely washed up Matt Greene.

I had always kind of thought McNabb got overhyped by people here (best d-man not in the NHL), but even I can concede that he was maybe starting to turn a corner and boom Greene came back and Sutter sat him and literally he was never close to being that good again for the Kings.
A move like that can sour a player on an organization, and then the player just wants to find a new job.
 
Are we really lamenting the loss of a D-man that was regularly dogged here? Statistically the two are near identical and Forbort is 2 years younger. They kept Forbort for the upside. Even this season, he's only 2pts back from McNabb. He's not good, but neither is McNabb.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: TruKingFan
Are we really lamenting the loss of a D-man that was regularly dogged here? Statistically the two are near identical and Forbort is 2 years younger. They kept Forbort for the upside. Even this season, he's only 2pts back from McNabb. He's not good, but neither is McNabb.

I agree if that they made the right call given forbort had/has the potential to be better. However I think both are decent 4-6 guys. Issue is that Forbort keeps getting top line minutes.
 
  • Like
Reactions: kingsfan28
I really think people here have no idea how to judge talent.....other than by results or numbers oriented results.

There's a book by Shane Malloy that I think a lot of you would benefit from reading called The Art of Scouting, extremely good read, gives you an insight to what people in the game actually pay attention to etc.
 
Are we really lamenting the loss of a D-man that was regularly dogged here? Statistically the two are near identical and Forbort is 2 years younger. They kept Forbort for the upside. Even this season, he's only 2pts back from McNabb. He's not good, but neither is McNabb.

We're back to pre-2012 when the debates were about Purcell and Moulson. Losing sucks. Now Moulson is wasting a spot in Ontario because the Kings don't have enough young talent to fill out an AHL roster, and Teddy has his talks for whatever reason.
 
We're back to pre-2012 when the debates were about Purcell and Moulson. Losing sucks. Now Moulson is wasting a spot in Ontario because the Kings don't have enough young talent to fill out an AHL roster, and Teddy has his talks for whatever reason.


You mean that was Purcell in the kitchen with Campbell? I try to fast-forward through all the intra-period breaks. If so, then that's very, very sad. That makes me believe that Teddy's not just a "has-been", but a "never-was"....... :-(
 
I really think people here have no idea how to judge talent.....other than by results or numbers oriented results.

There's a book by Shane Malloy that I think a lot of you would benefit from reading called The Art of Scouting, extremely good read, gives you an insight to what people in the game actually pay attention to etc.

Since you have read the book, can you explain to me how Forbort can possibly be seen as a top pairing defenseman?

By the eye test his lack of puck handling skills are very apparent. In his own zone, he struggles to make a tape to tape pass, often sending passes into the skates of the receiving forward and this leads to prolonged time in the defending zone. He also struggles with a heavy forecheck, choosing to chip the puck to an empty area when pressured, again leading to the team as a whole struggling to break out of the zone. His inconsistencies in this area are an extreme hindrance to the team being able to navigate the neutral zone and complete a successful zone entry. Once in the offensive zone his lack of puck moving skills becomes apparent once more, any attacking time is generally ended when the puck comes to him. Again, under pressure he typically reverts to a safe play which is to dump the puck to an empty area, either down the boards or behind the net. This leads to a 50/50 battle and ends any threat.

By the numbers, his drag on the team possession wise is also very apparent. His CF% is the worst among defensemen on the team who have played more than 50 minutes at 46.16%, same with SCF% he is worst on the team with 44.48%. His rel in every possession stat is negative. Beyond that look at his WOWY with Doughty, across the board Doughty see about a 5% drop in possession when paired with Forbort.

By the results, we see that Forbort is struggling to keep the puck out of the net. His 41.03 ES GF% is 2nd worst among blue liners on the team with more than 50 minutes, just beating out Dion.

Now, some of this can be explained by deployment and playing a lot of minutes on a shit team, but that is my point. He certainly has defensive skill and he also has great reach when defending, but he should not be on the top pair dragging down the 11 million dollar man. He needs to be sheltered on the 3rd pairing with a young puck mover, basically a modern Matt Greene.
 
Everything above about Forbort is true except mentioning him in the same damn breath as Matt Greene, even with using the qualifier of "modern".

Might not be a softer player in the league.
 
No one is arguing Forbort is a top pairing defenseman as shown in his career so far. Barring some huge turnaround in his game, he'll be a bottom pairing guy. Problem is he is deployed as a top pairing guy possibly to be sheltered by Doughty, though that doesn't seem to be very effective.
 
Everything above about Forbort is true except mentioning him in the same damn breath as Matt Greene, even with using the qualifier of "modern".

Might not be a softer player in the league.

Haha, I was more using Greene as a reference as someone who lacked puck handling skills, but provided value defensively on the 3rd pair. I fully agree with you about him being soft, I remembered being bothered so much by that when he finally joined the team. Dude is f***ing huge, but plays smaller than Gaudreau.
 
Since you have read the book, can you explain to me how Forbort can possibly be seen as a top pairing defenseman?

By the eye test his lack of puck handling skills are very apparent. In his own zone, he struggles to make a tape to tape pass, often sending passes into the skates of the receiving forward and this leads to prolonged time in the defending zone. He also struggles with a heavy forecheck, choosing to chip the puck to an empty area when pressured, again leading to the team as a whole struggling to break out of the zone. His inconsistencies in this area are an extreme hindrance to the team being able to navigate the neutral zone and complete a successful zone entry. Once in the offensive zone his lack of puck moving skills becomes apparent once more, any attacking time is generally ended when the puck comes to him. Again, under pressure he typically reverts to a safe play which is to dump the puck to an empty area, either down the boards or behind the net. This leads to a 50/50 battle and ends any threat.

By the numbers, his drag on the team possession wise is also very apparent. His CF% is the worst among defensemen on the team who have played more than 50 minutes at 46.16%, same with SCF% he is worst on the team with 44.48%. His rel in every possession stat is negative. Beyond that look at his WOWY with Doughty, across the board Doughty see about a 5% drop in possession when paired with Forbort.

By the results, we see that Forbort is struggling to keep the puck out of the net. His 41.03 ES GF% is 2nd worst among blue liners on the team with more than 50 minutes, just beating out Dion.

Now, some of this can be explained by deployment and playing a lot of minutes on a **** team, but that is my point. He certainly has defensive skill and he also has great reach when defending, but he should not be on the top pair dragging down the 11 million dollar man. He needs to be sheltered on the 3rd pairing with a young puck mover, basically a modern Matt Greene.

He;s not a first pairing Dman, he's a solid 3rd line pairing Dman, along the lines of Roman Polak, etc, as far as your eye test assesment, you are hyperfocusing on his mistakes. First of all, show me a defenseman that DOESNT struggle with a heavy forecheck? And chipping the puck to an empty area while being pressured? That's kinda what you are supposed to do. Part of that is the forwards don't recognize that, and go to the empty area, to help out, they stand there and watch.

Again, under pressure he typically reverts to a safe play.....ummm....yea, again, kinda what you are taught.

Just reinforcing my statement before as true.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad