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Around the League 2018-2019 Part 2- Everyone is having fun except us

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kingsfan28 said:
Not at all, they've done it right and are in a great position to make a long run to the finals. They just seem, like RJ pointed out to be heading in SJ direction with all the praise without the final result. Seriously, it gets jammed down our throats about their drafting and player management game after game, year after year.
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Right now they're just the pre-Cup Capitals, but instead of getting utterly roasted by media and fans year after year like the Caps did, people are throwing rose petals down and prostrating themselves on the red carpet in front of them.
 
Yet again you go off on this lame attempt to discredit another team that is getting a smidgen of attention. Yzerman took over Tampa Bay in 2010. The previous management, ownership group prior to Vinik, and coaching staff were all terrible. Hence how they wound up with Stamkos and Hedman in back-to-back years. He purchased the Lightning the same year Yzerman was hired as GM.

The season he took over is when they first made the ECF, then they struggled until the Jon Cooper hiring. Do you need to be reminded of how shitty things were with the Kings prior to 2012? Since 2010-11 (when Yzerman took over) Tampa Bay has won 47 playoff games. The Kings have won 44. Only the Penguins, Blackhawks and Capitals have won more playoff games than Tampa Bay in that time frame.

I don't get this bitter resentment some of you display over a damn good team. It seems really petty and envious, y'know, like those who shit all over the Kings and what they accomplished from 2012-2014.
 
The Lightning were only separated from a cup win by 6 years when Yzerman took over. You are acting like they had been bad for a long time. And only 6 years in actual time, but 5 if you discount the lockout season. The Lightning right now are completely top heavy. They have one monster line that's doing more than half the work. Come playoff time, are they going to maintain that or will they face teams that will shut down that line?
 
OT for Edmonton/Phoenix was a very good result, but Edmonton needs to win a few games here. They have 4 regulation wins in their last 26 games (6-17-3 overall)...
 
I’d actually consider the Lightning roster to be pretty balanced top to bottom. They could use more muscle and maybe another upgrade on the blueline if you want to nitpick, but in terms of production, they’re getting a lot of players contributing.

Tampa Bay Lightning Stats | 2018-2019

They’ve earned the praise. Yes, they haven’t won any Cups yet, and who knows when that’ll happen, but as was mentioned, people had the same criticism about the Caps, but now they can shut up about them.

But what happens with teams who win the Cup once and don’t climb that hill again? Can they no longer be praised as good teams? Are the only teams that deserve any praise those who win the Cup?
 
Bandit said:
If that's how people want to make themselves feel better then ok, but there is no difference between the two.

xen·o·pho·bi·a
noun
dislike of or prejudice against people from other countries.
"the resurgence of racism and xenophobia"
synonyms: racism, racialism, racial hatred, ethnocentrism, ethnocentricity

Webster defines race:
a : a family, tribe, people, or nation belonging to the same stock
b : a class or kind of people unified by shared interests, habits, or characteristics

Wikipedia:
A race is a grouping of humans based on shared physical or social qualities into categories generally viewed as distinct by society.

So every time he says something about "Typical chicken Swedes" Or "Euros" or "Russians" that "Don't play the game the right way" or "hide behind their visors like cowards" or whatever other endless generalizations he's made in the last 40 some odd years, yup, that's him being a racist.

Whatevs though, I'm not convincing anyone who doesn't already see it and I've expended all the energy I care to on the subject.
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No, you're not convincing anyone, because you don't have a convincing argument.

Question, when people in Iran go out into the streets and chant "Death to America!", which race are they demonstrating racial hatred toward? Americans? Hmm, I must have missed that choice on every government form I ever filled out asking me for my race. Stupid me I have been checking "White/Non-Hispanic" all these years. I should have just been checking the "Other" box and writing next to it "American".

I just gave you examples of Cherry praising Ovechkin and criticizing Ovechkin. Does Cherry not have the same appreciation for how European players are taught and trained as he does for how it is done in Canada or the U.S.? Probably. Does this cause him to have a built in bias against European players? Probably.

Does it have anything to do with their race? Probably not. I am sure like any human being Cherry has his own set of prejudices and biases he battles every day. We are imperfect. That is a fact. I am grateful that SJW's like yourself point it out though, because without perfect individuals like yourself the rest of us would be walking around without any self awareness whatsoever. I am also grateful you spend your time worrying about everyone else instead of yourself. It shows real self-sacrifice, because what would we do without people like you.
 
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AzKing said:
A lot of teams are starting to put a few games between themselves and the Kings.
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It's also funny how the narrative between the East and West is so different. The Kings are what, 8 points out of the WC and are considered done. The Flyers are the same situation between 6-8 points out , and everyone's like they still have a shot, they can't lose game like this and still make it. Tampa just wrecked them tonight.
 
KINGS17 said:
No, you're not convincing anyone, because you don't have a convincing argument.

Question, when people in Iran go out into the streets and chant "Death to America!", which race are they demonstrating racial hatred toward? Americans? Hmm, I must have missed that choice on every government form I ever filled out asking me for my race. Stupid me I have been checking "White/Non-Hispanic" all these years. I should have just been checking the "Other" box and writing next to it "American".

I just gave you examples of Cherry praising Ovechkin and criticizing Ovechkin. Does Cherry not have the same appreciation for how European players are taught and trained as he does for how it is done in Canada or the U.S.? Probably. Does this cause him to have a built in bias against European players? Probably.

Does it have anything to do with their race? Probably not. I am sure like any human being Cherry has his own set of prejudices and biases he battles every day. We are imperfect. That is a fact. I am grateful that SJW's like yourself point it out though, because without perfect individuals like yourself the rest of us would be walking around without any self awareness whatsoever. I am also grateful you spend your time worrying about everyone else instead of yourself. It shows real self-sacrifice, because what would we do without people like you.
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And I gave you examples from credible sources that define race as something that goes beyond that little checkbox you've been ticking all your life, but you want to say it's not a convincing argument because it's easier than dealing with what's right in front of you. Maybe if people spent more time considering themselves American and less time considering themselves "white/non-hispanic" we'd all be better off. It's amusing that you are calling me a "social justice warrior" as if I'm supposed to feel bad about speaking up for everyone's right to be judged on their individual merits and actions. I don't. Being concerned about others and being concerned with your own life are not mutually exclusive concepts. Some people are capable of both. I encourage everyone to try it, the world would be a better place.

You can keep trying to put me down though if it makes you feel better. I'm sure your close personal racist :eek::eek::eek::eek: friend Don really appreciates it.
 
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Ziggy Stardust said:
Yet again you go off on this lame attempt to discredit another team that is getting a smidgen of attention. Yzerman took over Tampa Bay in 2010. The previous management, ownership group prior to Vinik, and coaching staff were all terrible. Hence how they wound up with Stamkos and Hedman in back-to-back years. He purchased the Lightning the same year Yzerman was hired as GM.

The season he took over is when they first made the ECF, then they struggled until the Jon Cooper hiring. Do you need to be reminded of how ****ty things were with the Kings prior to 2012? Since 2010-11 (when Yzerman took over) Tampa Bay has won 47 playoff games. The Kings have won 44. Only the Penguins, Blackhawks and Capitals have won more playoff games than Tampa Bay in that time frame.

I don't get this bitter resentment some of you display over a damn good team. It seems really petty and envious, y'know, like those who **** all over the Kings and what they accomplished from 2012-2014.
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Ziggy Stardust said:
I’d actually consider the Lightning roster to be pretty balanced top to bottom. They could use more muscle and maybe another upgrade on the blueline if you want to nitpick, but in terms of production, they’re getting a lot of players contributing.

Tampa Bay Lightning Stats | 2018-2019

They’ve earned the praise. Yes, they haven’t won any Cups yet, and who knows when that’ll happen, but as was mentioned, people had the same criticism about the Caps, but now they can shut up about them.

But what happens with teams who win the Cup once and don’t climb that hill again? Can they no longer be praised as good teams? Are the only teams that deserve any praise those who win the Cup?
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It's not discredit. They've earned praise; they haven't earned absolution. And it's not bitter resentment when I repeatedly talk about how awesome they are and fun to watch. They deserve whatever attention they're getting right this moment because they're utterly annihilating everyone. It's just much easier to be objectively critical when they're about as far away from us as possible.

Exhibit A: someone lording that they won 47 playoff games over your 44 when you have 2 Cups and they have 0? What a stupid ass argument.

Would you rather be the Kings for the last 15 years, or the Sharks?

That doesn't mean a team/organization is 'unsuccessful,' but just as praise is due where praise is due--i.e. the Sharks being competitive for two decades, the Lightning touching but not crossing the finish line and putting together arguably the best team of the cap era--so is criticism. It's not binary, Ziggy. But you're flipping out on people as if they have to choose one thing or the other when both things can easily be true. The Sharks have been a phenomenal organization. They're also their own worst enemies and have choked repeatedly. No one blinks when I say that. But the moment it comes up about TB, here you come on your stallion to their rescue, I guess?

I stand by my Caps example. They were absolutely dominant in regular season after regular season then just kept tripping over their dicks when it mattered most. So far, TB is the same way. Fair? The difference: people were utterly destroying the Caps, questioning Ovechkin's character, committment, heart, etc. while people cannot stop blowing Tampa Bay. That's what I take issue with.
 
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I’m not flipping out on anyone dude. Can you point out where I did that? I pointed out 47 playoff wins vs. 44 because you were claiming they had less wins. Clearly I wasn’t saying anywhere I’d rather see more playoff wins than Cups, but you being over dramatic conflate things and make assumptions of things that weren’t said.

It’s called giving credit where credit is due. And for years any time Tampa Bay is brought up it turns into a pissing match with you. Do they hit a sore spot with you? God forbid we give kudos to a team that has drafted well and assembled a damn good team (even if they haven’t won a Cup, yet).

It’s not like they’re overhyped and not delivering like say, the Coyotes or Oilers, who many assumed would be good teams by now. Those are teams that deserve the ridicule. Not the f***ing best team in the league.
 
kingsfan28 said:
It's also funny how the narrative between the East and West is so different. The Kings are what, 8 points out of the WC and are considered done. The Flyers are the same situation between 6-8 points out , and everyone's like they still have a shot, they can't lose game like this and still make it. Tampa just wrecked them tonight.
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Because they're 13-3-1 in their last 17 games. They've given themselves a chance. The Kings recently had a 12-7-1 stretch, and then played themselves out of the conversation again by going 0-3-2 in the last 5. The Flyers also don't have to climb over 7 teams.
 
I think Tampa Bay is a dope team. They’re also fun to watch.

But they do need at least one championship. Without one, they’ll always be remembered as the team who just could never put it all together. The Sharks are an apt comparison as of right now. Since the lockout, is there any team in the league with more playoff wins and no championships than the Sharks? God I hope they never win :laugh:

There’s no reason Tampa shouldn’t have won last year. Field was wide open.
 
Bandit said:
And I gave you examples from credible sources that define race as something that goes beyond that little checkbox you've been ticking all your life, but you want to say it's not a convincing argument because it's easier than dealing with what's right in front of you. Maybe if people spent more time considering themselves American and less time considering themselves "white/non-hispanic" we'd all be better off. It's amusing that you are calling me a "social justice warrior" as if I'm supposed to feel bad about speaking up for everyone's right to be judged on their individual merits and actions. I don't. Being concerned about others and being concerned with your own life are not mutually exclusive concepts. Some people are capable of both. I encourage everyone to try it, the world would be a better place.

You can keep trying to put me down though if it makes you feel better. I'm sure your close personal racist **** friend Don really appreciates it.
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I encourage you not to label people you don't even know.

As I illustrated to you Cherry praised and criticized Ovechkin in two separate videos. What did he critique? Ovechkin's actions. If Cherry is a "racist" shouldn't he just hate Ovechkin? Why critique his actions? Isn't that exactly what you said above, that people should be judged on their own merit and their actions?

I think you should re-examine your own standard and start applying it.

I certainly don't trust you to be the arbiter of who is a racist, and who is not, based on what I have seen you do around here. Worry about yourself. The world would be a better place.
 
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kingsfan28 said:
It's also funny how the narrative between the East and West is so different. The Kings are what, 8 points out of the WC and are considered done. The Flyers are the same situation between 6-8 points out , and everyone's like they still have a shot, they can't lose game like this and still make it. Tampa just wrecked them tonight.
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That's because far too many fans don't know the numbers behind that. They were out at Thanksgiving. This fools gold run, they've done that 6 out of the last 7 years. Play poor thru Jan and then go on a 'run' and the fans get riled up.

I had two colorful debates yesterday at work, trying to explain that there is no 'only' in only 3 games back. Because the league is not going to stand still in time while the Flyers win 3 games to tie the last playoff spot.

They can't afford to lose, they are treading quicksand again.

They have the 3rd most (pointed out yesterday on NBC Sports) difficult schedule remaining. Including 13 games vs divisional opponents, 2 vs Caps, 2 vs Isles, and most of the teams they play are ahead of them.

The silver lining is that next year, with new management in place, and Hart in net, this will be a much better team. There will be players moved out and new faces in the lineup. And a coach that hopefully will provide the leadership that they need to play good from Oct. I am hoping that Voracek and simmonds are gone (Giroux won't be much as I'd love to see that) and a change in leadership there will help.
 
YP44 said:
agreed but also I could see a situation where the team is gassed after this run and needing an injection.
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That makes sense too. You hate for them to change the way they're playing right now though. It's working. But adding a talent like Duchene or Panarin is a pretty big addition of talent, you just have to hope they fit right without changing the mojo. Don't stop playing the way they're playing
 
YP44 said:
anyone else think Duchene is bound for St. Louis?
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I'd be interested to see if Columbus takes a kick at either Duchene or Stone if they deal Breadman.

Maybe try to convince either of those two to resign , they might have better luck although there is speculation out there that Duchene likes Ottawa and would be very open to going back their in the off-season.

Should be interesting over the next few days leading to the deadline.
 
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