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Yeah, I like Henrique, but his best season is 30 goals, 50 points. He's a 40-50 point depth scorer who can move up in a pinch. near 6 million is up there.
 
YP44 said:
I have never heard of the 10 points = $1m.
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Hadn't heard of it myself until somewhat recently, but it's probably just one of those things fans say to justify or not justify what teams pay a player. As far as I know anyway. People just trying to find some way to judge value. Not a perfect system by any means, but it sort of fits. It's a decent enough ratio. How much cap space do you want a 20 point player taking up? The less the better, but that doesn't always happen. How much should a 40 point guy get? 80 points?

Why has the current Kopitar contract been so contentious? Because he's usually been a 70-75 point player, give or take. Not 100, or even 92. Doughty most likely will never live up to the cap space he'll take up in relation to how good the Kings may be during the course of it, even outside of this point theory, but there's little choice other than to sign him. Same with Kopitar.
 
KingsFan7824 said:
Hadn't heard of it myself until somewhat recently, but it's probably just one of those things fans say to justify or not justify what teams pay a player. As far as I know anyway. People just trying to find some way to judge value. Not a perfect system by any means, but it sort of fits. It's a decent enough ratio. How much cap space do you want a 20 point player taking up? The less the better, but that doesn't always happen. How much should a 40 point guy get? 80 points?

Why has the current Kopitar contract been so contentious? Because he's usually been a 70-75 point player, give or take. Not 100, or even 92. Doughty most likely will never live up to the cap space he'll take up in relation to how good the Kings may be during the course of it, even outside of this point theory, but there's little choice other than to sign him. Same with Kopitar.
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Ya I don't think i like it as a gauge. Doesn't take into account defensive acumen, length of contract (which obviously impacts $ amount), age of player and other things.

I image there is some sort of stats guy who compares contracts vs points, corsi, defensive vs offensive zone time and TOI. I would be interested in those more than strictly points
 
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Does Saros have an agent? Jesus when Hutton can get 3 years at 2.75M Saros getting $1.5 is a steal for the Preds. I get he was an RFA so to me that would justify a one year deal but 3 years at that number is crazy. I could honestly see Nashville moving on from Rinne after this year and putting that $9m elsewhere and having a starter making $1.5M
 
Raccoon Jesus said:
Yeah, I like Henrique, but his best season is 30 goals, 50 points. He's a 40-50 point depth scorer who can move up in a pinch. near 6 million is up there.
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He puts up very similar production to Toffoli. But, he's a center and that holds some weight, along with being a pending UFA which influences his value substantially. If Toffoli was in the same spot, would we be OK with the same? I think Blake would offer something similar, it's just the going rate nowadays.

I personally think Henrique's value is closer to 5.2 or 5.3 right now, but the Ducks are up against it with Perry continuing to decline and Kesler falling apart. I think they knew that they would be better off extending now rather than potentially having him cost even more next year, he's going to get a lot of prime ice time.
 
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Fishhead said:
He puts up very similar production to Toffoli. But, he's a center and that holds some weight, along with being a pending UFA which influences his value substantially. If Toffoli was in the same spot, would we be OK with the same? I think Blake would offer something similar, it's just the going rate nowadays.

I personally think Henrique's value is closer to 5.2 or 5.3 right now, but the Ducks are up against it with Perry continuing to decline and Kesler falling apart. I think they knew that they would be better off extending now rather than potentially having him cost even more next year, he's going to get a lot of prime ice time.
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I don't disagree, it's not awful. But he WILL be 29-34 during the contract and for a guy whose BEST is 50 points when he was 26 years old (edit: he had 51 at 21 as well) it feels like a Travis Zajac special.
 
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King Trouty said:
Let's just shelve the "master"-anything-GM title till said GM wins, me thinks.

Same with Yzerman. So much slobbering on these guys that have done **** all
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The mainboard loves this guy, especially since he's hasn't won a thing as Tampa's GM. Doug Wilson know this all too well on how not to win a championship too.
 
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kingsfan28 said:
The mainboard loves this guy, especially since he's hasn't won a thing as Tampa's GM. Doug Wilson know this all too well on how not to win a championship too.
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Tampa Bay is still loveable and cute because they haven't won anything yet. It's not until you start harming people that haters start showing up. Ever seen anyone say an ill word about Hedman? The guy had a crap series vs. Washington and people gloss it over; Doughty blows a tire at the line making a bad play on Burns and people have it queued in their gif hatereel.

As soon as TB, Winnipeg, Nashville win anything, they'll stop winning popularity contests and questions of their legitimacy will show up. Until then, they're perfect rosters, built to compete forever with no issues whatsoever. No one seems to care that TB's entire starting D rotation has NTCs (Edit: sorry, only 5 of them). No one seems to care that Ryan Johansen is actually a pretty terrible, overpaid 1C. No one cares that Winnipeg has 6 free agents they need to sign this year on top of 7 more (4 RFAs and 3 UFAs) next year, most of whom are first rounders and their C.

But I'm an asshole I guess so I'll criticize them like any other team.
 
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Raccoon Jesus said:
Tampa Bay is still loveable and cute because they haven't won anything yet. It's not until you start harming people that haters start showing up. Ever seen anyone say an ill word about Hedman? The guy had a crap series vs. Washington and people gloss it over; Doughty blows a tire at the line making a bad play on Burns and people have it queued in their gif hatereel.

As soon as TB, Winnipeg, Nashville win anything, they'll stop winning popularity contests and questions of their legitimacy will show up. Until then, they're perfect rosters, built to compete forever with no issues whatsoever. No one seems to care that TB's entire starting D rotation has NTCs (Edit: sorry, only 5 of them). No one seems to care that Ryan Johansen is actually a pretty terrible, overpaid 1C. No one cares that Winnipeg has 6 free agents they need to sign this year on top of 7 more (4 RFAs and 3 UFAs) next year, most of whom are first rounders and their C.

But I'm an ******* I guess so I'll criticize them like any other team.
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I think Winnipeg has some hard decisions to make. They have great talent but it will be hard to keep all or even most.

Every year the cap goes up Johansen's deal looks a little bit better.

I hear ya though, nobody judged me for being a kings fan till after the 2nd cup. After the first cup most people were happy for me.
 
I don't want to hear about being humble "and where we were" before our first win. We won. That notion is buh-byes. We f***ing killed the league for a three-year stretch. We Won. More than once. We cemented that Kings' greatness. We get gloating rights. ESP vs TBL fan et al

These GMs that haven't won are losers.

And we have played bad hockey out here the last several years. Dreams shot to shyte for some, while others soberly knew we weren't going anywhere.

But, guess what, we won. TWICE. There is no more magnanimous bow downs. These scrub, non-winning GMs get slobbed on by our own board, whilst bitch slapping a great GM like Dean Lombardi. Shame on you.

Just wow.

And don't get that twisted for acquiescing and accepting failure in the future and resting on the laurels of our previous greatness. No -- only to shoot down the spew for these failure GMs in here that land "omg a sweetheart deal."

Here, let me bend over for them...
 
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Not a defense of Yzerman, but I feel the Cup wins are ancient history at this point and banging that drum in light of one playoff game victory in the four years since is a tough sell.

We crapped on the Ducks four years after their win and they actually won a playoff series during that time. Sure, the Kings won two of them but, man, there hasn't been much to cheer about since.

Doesn't mean I'm going to lavish praise on other teams, I just can't say "scoreboard" from four years ago.
 
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BigKing said:
Not a defense of Yzerman, but I feel the Cup wins are ancient history at this point and banging that drum in light of one playoff game victory in the four years since is a tough sell.

We crapped on the Ducks four years after their win and they actually won a playoff series during that time. Sure, the Kings won two of them but, man, there hasn't been much to cheer about since.

Doesn't mean I'm going to lavish praise on other teams, I just can't say "scoreboard" from four years ago.
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I specifically addressed our recent lack of success
 
YP44 said:
I think Winnipeg has some hard decisions to make. They have great talent but it will be hard to keep all or even most.

Every year the cap goes up Johansen's deal looks a little bit better.

I hear ya though, nobody judged me for being a kings fan till after the 2nd cup. After the first cup most people were happy for me.
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And I think Winnipeg and TB have done great jobs getting this far, to be fair. They just haven't had to make tough decisions about their youth yet. Nashville...meh. Not many GMs with that long of a tenure that haven't done much but tread water, so I'm going to heap less praise there. I don't like the Johansen deal like at all. 8 million dollars for your fourth leading scorer and he doesn't bring defense or anything when he's not making plays. They were just so thirsty for a 1C that they could not develop that they overpaid in both player and money--Jones is a perennial top-1o d-man going forward and RyJo is basically a low-end 1C or great 2C. I think in the coming 2-3 years they'll start looking less-infallible if they don't win (but obviously the GMs have them in a good position--I just don't like the hero worship when nothing has happened yet).
 
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Guys and gals, I'm sorry. Sometimes the only way I know how to post is by being a hot head. It isn't cool. Especially here, in such a close knit, incredibly hockey-intelligent community.

I need to chill out and take a break. My bad, Kings fans.
 
Raccoon Jesus said:
And I think Winnipeg and TB have done great jobs getting this far, to be fair. They just haven't had to make tough decisions about their youth yet. Nashville...meh. Not many GMs with that long of a tenure that haven't done much but tread water, so I'm going to heap less praise there. I don't like the Johansen deal like at all. 8 million dollars for your fourth leading scorer and he doesn't bring defense or anything when he's not making plays. They were just so thirsty for a 1C that they could not develop that they overpaid in both player and money--Jones is a perennial top-1o d-man going forward and RyJo is basically a low-end 1C or great 2C. I think in the coming 2-3 years they'll start looking less-infallible if they don't win (but obviously the GMs have them in a good position--I just don't like the hero worship when nothing has happened yet).
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I like that Nashville's GM is not scared of doing something and is not content with status quo. He has made some big deals. Not every move is going to work but I like that he does something rather than nothing.
 
YP44 said:
I like that Nashville's GM is not scared of doing something and is not content with status quo. He has made some big deals. Not every move is going to work but I like that he does something rather than nothing.
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I'm on board with that. He's constantly reshaping. And this is a guy who pursued Forsberg and Kariya as well, and not scared to change the roster to match the times. But I guess within that praise also lies the criticism that 1. he doesn't know how to win and 2. if that weren't Nashville and were, say, LA, he'd be getting absolutely raked. It's about perspective. But I also hate Nashville so :P
 
King Trouty said:
Guys and gals, I'm sorry. Sometimes the only way I know how to post is by being a hot head. It isn't cool. Especially here, in such a close knit, incredibly hockey-intelligent community.

I need to chill out and take a break. My bad, Kings fans.
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You realize I'm around still right....as long as I'm here, you can pretty much do whatever, and people will still hate you less than me lol
 
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